[url= http://www.vitalmtb.com/forums/The-Hub,2/Fender-bender-freakout,4764 ]Video here[/url].
Six of one, half a dozen of the other if you ask me.
Why in jebus's name are they wearing so much kit for (what looks like) a really tame trail? Full face, and goggles, and full armor? Jeez 😆
agree, with a sensible head on, half and half.
really dunno what caused her to slam her brakes on though...
A Blue route [i]and[/i] all that body armour?
ajantomWhy in jebus's name are they wearing so much kit for (what looks like) a really tame trail? Full face, and goggles, and full armor? Jeez
And at least one of them had a conspicuously large camelbak.
I think she might want to consider another sport, and perhaps speak to a professional about anger management and not just grabbing the ****n brakes like that. Jesus. Buy a road bike if you don't want to fall off. Dude was more than fair, i think my reasonable facade would have crumbled pretty quickly with a WTFU.
Wee in her shoes
Seems the rider with the camera made the fairly obvious mistake of assuming people don't do stupid things. Although the person who hauled on the brakes for whatever reason should be much more aware of who is around them.
Over reaction too.
He was way too nice, she was way too mean.
+1
He's in the wrong. He should be able to stop if she does, he should have left moreroom. End of story. Closest parallel I can think of is driving. The way I understand it when you have to apply the brakes, for whatever reason and however hard, if the person behind collides with you they are at fault.
I feel pretty sorry for that guy, how many people leave enough room so you can come to a [u]complete[/u] stop if the person in front slams the brakes on. He was gracious enough about the whole thing, so fair play to him.
I'd agree, half and half... Sure he should have been able to stop but would you ever stop in the middle of a trail like that? But even if you think it's all his fault you've still got to say she's a total arse, and he's a really nice guy. I would have started out the way he did I reckon then told her to stick it up her arse, she even says "It's mountain biking". Yes it is, sometimes you fall off.
Ambrose - MemberHe's in the wrong. He should be able to stop if she does, he should have left moreroom. End of story. Closest parallel I can think of is driving. The way I understand it when you have to apply the brakes, for whatever reason and however hard, if the person behind collides with you they are at fault.
Which gets me thinking...I am on the motorway, travelling at the speed limit. The guy in front (safe distance) is in a Porsche 911 Turbo with carbon ceramic brakes. I am in a 91 civic. If he hits the anchors hard enough...I reckon I am in the back of him, regardless.
Just a thought. Maybe the girl in front had Saint brakes and helmet cam man had juicy 3's 🙂
100% the second rider / camera bikes fault. Ride into the back of someone its your fault. No if but or and.
Plenty of time to stop anyway - or swerve
Bikes don't have brake lights either.
All you have to leave in terms of a gap is reaction time plus a tiny bit- see them slam on the brakes you slam on the brakes. They stop and you stop behind them
I think he had enough room to stop easily but didn't hit the brakes quickly enough or hard enough
She may have been an ass but he was totally in the wrong - he hit her. She diod not reverse into him
this is a wind up, right?
Plenty of time to stop anyway - or swerve
wtf?
100% the second rider / camera bikes fault. Ride into the back of someone its your fault. No if but or and.
You even ridden on road with other people?
And riding off road with other people is hardly any different, except you have to concentrate on what you're riding as well as the other persons speed, which slows your reaction time (IMO). If you suddenly slam on your brakes for no real reason, you are asking for trouble.
yes, he should have left more room, but she was plain mental.
Or you can just leave a big enough gap....
TandemJeremy - Member
"I think he had enough room to stop easily but didn't hit the brakes quickly enough or hard enough"
Because he'd been taken so completely by surprise by the totally unpredictable action of the rider in front, obviously. You don't just plan for the person in front to suddenly stop dead in the middle of the trail like that.
Crashasaurus "Which gets me thinking...I am on the motorway, travelling at the speed limit. The guy in front (safe distance) is in a Porsche 911 Turbo with carbon ceramic brakes. I am in a 91 civic. If he hits the anchors hard enough...I reckon I am in the back of him, regardless."
Yup. And the police are going to be asking him why he slammed on the brakes, and most likely he's going to end up on a charge of dangerous driving unless he had good reason.
TandemJeremy - MemberAll you have to leave in terms of a gap is reaction time plus a tiny bit- see them slam on the brakes you slam on the brakes. They stop and you stop behind them
How does one see the fingers of the rider in front?
Yes. TJ if you ride with anyone from here, you are just asking for them to slam on their brakes next time you're behind them, then get you to pay for a new back wheel.
wind up for sure! ... no way was she hurt from that, no frickin way! how quick was she up to throw her bike at him FFS.
he was too nice about it too ... and IMO the woman is Always in the wrong ... LMFAO ;O)
and Ladies IF yer gonna slam yer brakes on to pull up, then pull up to ONE SIDE of the trail! Lol ... i know im in sooooo much trouble but i just done care ;O)
"RealMan - Member
Yes. TJ if you ride with anyone from here, you are just asking for them to slam on their brakes next time you're behind them, then get you to pay for a new back wheel. "
Oh I wish you hadn't said that. I'm gonna get ya TJ 
crashasaurus - MemberWhich gets me thinking...I am on the motorway, travelling at the speed limit. The guy in front (safe distance) is in a Porsche 911 Turbo with carbon ceramic brakes. I am in a 91 civic. If he hits the anchors hard enough...I reckon I am in the back of him, regardless.
Not if you leave a safe distance
Only a fool breaks the 2 second rule. 65 m at 70 mph.
Oh I wish you hadn't said that. I'm gonna get ya TJ
100% the second rider / camera bikes fault. Ride into the back of someone its your fault. No if but or and.
😀
If she'd known he was behind her she should have let him past but it looked like he got a bit too close. She totally over reacted and he was too nice. I think he should have apologised made sure she was ok then moved along. Could have said something like 'Move aside lady. I have trails to ride'.
Crashasourus - as soon as they start to slow you ca see then slowing - so you start slowing at the same point they did if yo have the reaction time gap - about half a second/ I prefer a 2 second gap like with cars
Northwind - want to try it?
it says on the thread under that they had a bit of a cuddle back at the car park. 🙂
TJ I can guarantee you I could make you ride into the back of me dozens of times in one ride if I wanted to. Unless you absolutely refuse to ride within 50m of anyone else.
Is it just me or do you now feel under dressed for a "blue" trail, think I might break out the armour to nip to the shops for some milk , just in case!!!
Rwealman - not a chance squire. riding with a normal gap like he had you could do anything you want an I would be 100% confident I would not hit you
TandemJeremy - Member
"Northwind - want to try it?"
Yeah, why not. If you see me turn up for a ride with really big rotors and tyres you may want to be on your guard.
Everyone- £10 to the first person to make TJ ram them. £20 if you go mental afterwards and post the video on the internet
Leave more room? That's twaddle right there. How do you overtake? I always thought the unwritten rule was if you are faster than the person in front and you want to pass you wait till you are close enough then (god help me)shout rider on your left/right. If s/he slams on the brakes while you are sizing your move what are you meant to do? I'd chalk it down as a trail incident.
The dude is a gracious gent, he didn't have to take it.
TandemJeremy
Not if you leave a safe distanceOnly a fool breaks the 2 second rule. 65 m at 70 mph.
I thought someone would say that. Now, the maths would make my head hurt, so hopefully some mathelitcal person will work this out but a quick google tells me that a 911 Turbo, (never mind say a veyron or a merc slr for the sake of avoiding internet ultra geek pedantry) can stop from 120 mph in the same distance as an "average" car can from 60mph.
So surely as I said above, if a person in a car with sufficiently powerful brakes decides to brake check you (assuming you are not similarly equipped) I reckon you are in for a prang. Sorry for going OT.
Fool, rule, 2 seconds?
not a chance squire. riding with a normal gap like he had you could do anything you want an I would be 100% confident I would not hit you
Sorry, its rubbish. And I fear you live too far away from me to prove it. So instead, I invite you to tell the guys you ride with next that you will give them £5 if they can make you ride in to the back of them.
Or let them know about Northwind..
Everyone- £10 to the first person to make TJ ram them. £20 if you go mental afterwards and post the video on the internet
😀
Do they have to throw their bike at him too?
crashasaurus
If my maths is correct
2 seconds at 70 mph is around 65m. According to they highway code at 70 mph braking distances is 75m, reaction distance around 20m - so 95 m total.
Now unless the porsche can stop from 70 mph in under 30 m with a 65 m gap you are safe (30+65=95)
In actual practice any modernish car can easily beat the highway code braking distance You civic will probably stop in under 60m - so the porsche would have to stop in 20 m for you to hit the back of it
Northwind - seriously = next time we are out have a play with this - you will be suprised how quickly you can stop if you want to
If someone launched a bike at me like that they would be wearing the ****ing thing a few seconds later.
Probably some stupid **** yank team building corporate day out, judging by all the gear they had on.
There was **** all wrong with her. Total overreaction.
The second she decided to react like that I'd have ridden off, because nothing he could of did or said would make any difference.
Regardless whos at fault, if you cant take the knocks then find another sport.
Realman - bullshit - you obviously cannot use the brakes properly - 20 mph on a gravel trail you can stop in a few metres - 5 or so easily.
crashasaurus - MemberI thought someone would say that. Now, the maths would make my head hurt, so hopefully some mathelitcal person will work this out but a quick google tells me that a 911 Turbo, (never mind say a veyron or a merc slr for the sake of avoiding internet ultra geek pedantry) can stop from 120 mph in the same distance as an "average" car can from 60mph.
Only a fool would be following a Porsche at 120mph.
she is a baaaad cat..
TJ every last bit of your last post was a bit tragic. 😆
edit well no not the last but the one about cars.
Nonk - the arithmetic or the challenge to realman?
All a bit sad and keyboard warrior 🙂
😆
TandemJeremyNow unless the porsche can stop from 70 mph in under 30 m with a 65 m gap you are safe (30+65=95)
Okaaaaaay 🙂
Another quick google reveals that a 2007 911 GT2 can stop from 60mph - 0 in 30 metres. A figure apparently recorded by Porsche.
Although I cant find any figures to back it up I reckon it's entirely plausible (considering the increased contact patch that other super cars with larger tyres would have never mind downforce, better brakes, lighter weigh etc) that another road car could, from 70mph stop in 30m. Sorry, I'll stop now. Or start a threa in the chat forum along these lines.
Do you think the helmet contributed to her horrific injuries? 😯
If someone launched a bike at me like that they would be wearing the ****ing thing a few seconds later.
+1. ****ing right an' all.
She made a mistake, stopped suddenly, then got all pissy because she felt stupid. She milked that for all it was worth, acting all hurt like that. I mean, she had all that body armour on ffs! Stupid cah. She wouldn't want to ride around in London, if she's that highly strung.
Maybe the feller could've slowed down more, but he had already slowed down loads anyway.
If she'd thrown the bike at me, I'd've battered it to death with a rock, screaming at her 'Run! You're next!'
At this point I may have stripped off naked and let the warm blood of a freshly killed animal drip all over my body.
Then praps had a nice cigarrette. Or a pasty or something. See what she had to say about [i]that[/i].
for people commenting about the armour, judging by the bikes they were at a lift assisted downhill park and a lot of the blue trails at them are relatively smooth as thats what a lot of people like to ride, it means they can go fast, you mostly have to go on the blacks to get the gnar and big jumps etc
I would've done it on me shonky rigid hybrid. With a rack and panniers with me shopping in. Overtaken all of them without crashing, then been at the bottom waiting for them.
Smoking a nice ciggie.
And I wouldn't be dressed head to toe in ****ing stormtrooper body armour, either.
Pfft...
Ban whining Yank women from trail centers 😉
Yes he should'nt have gone up the back of her but what a
CRAZY BITCH, why stop suddenly in the middle of the trail? No sign of a mechanical, no shout of stopping etc.
Bloke was a bit too reasonable if you ask me.
She braked at the sight of that tiny little tree root.
He had a ton of space to go round on the right without any problem, or left if he could get over the stupid wooden kerb thing.
I guess if you put enough idiots together in the same place, bad things are going to happen.
I guess if you put enough idiots together in the same place, bad things are going to happen.
Is that a reference to this place? 😉
What deserter said. Also helmet cam footage of a trail *[b]rarely[/b]* conveys how it rides, and the blue grading across the atlantic is a little different to the blue grading here.
Karate Monkey is a blue and the helmet cam footage in no way conveys how much fun it is to ride.
Still, I think she over reacted a little. 🙂
I'd have thrown the bike back at her.
In no way is she blameless either.
He made her do a wheelie when he hit her... *s****s*
I think I wouldn't have hung around, I would have just got on my bike and pissed off.
BTW for all the armour comments, that track may just be a lead in to some gnarly rad stuff, I for one don't stop and take my armour off every time the trail goes over a flat bit.
20mph on gravel and stopping in 5 meters..... you're kidding right? you obviously dont weigh over 14stone TJ!
even if i rode into a wall at 20mph i think i'd travel over 5 meters wrapped in bricks.
*must lose weight and increase braking efficiency before riding with americans*
even if i rode into a wall at 20mph i think i'd travel over 5 meters wrapped in bricks.
😆
If he hadn't had his iPod on so loud, he might have noticed her. BeeGees too, tsssk... 😉
what a total overreaction by the girl, admittedly if you're bricking it in the first place and then take a tumble emotions are probably high but still hitting the guy with your bike? i cant believe she tried to say he'd broken her leg!
the guy was far too nice, maybe he should have read the signals a bit better but if any of those people had access to that headcam video her audience would have rapidly dwindled.
maybe she should have spent a bit longer on fire roads.
Do these stopping distance calculations include reaction times too?
Initially when I watched it I agreed with people thinking stupid woman for stopping in the middle of the trail. Then I watched it again and saw that he had a real good view of the group in front as he approached them and it was obvious they were novice riders. So he should have been a bit more considerate.
As for comments about blue trails, Crank it Up in Whistler is a blue trail (I think) and you can get plenty of air on that. Also they might be riding a blue on there way to a double black diamond of doom.
Bazzer
it was obvious they were novice riders.......they might be riding a blue on there way to a double black diamond of doom.
Does not compute!
I would have just bunny hopped her. No one has any skill these days.
Does not compute!
Oops that probably did not make sense. I meant comments about blue trails and body armour. They could be on route to something more gnar 🙂 !!!
If you're looking to overtake someone travelling slower than a slow thing you need to be pretty close, but you don't expect them to stop for no apparent reason, there was probably just enough room to ride around the outside of her. After watching it a few times it begins to look a bit staged.
I'd have said 50/50 but the more she ranted, the more I felt it was her fault! I was impressed at how she managed to stand up and swing her bike at him with the broken leg she claimed to have! He didn't look to be going that fast and what ever speed he was doing, he slowed down behind them. It looked to me like her dead stop came as a total surprise. As for being too close, well, that's try when following but you do actually have to get closer if you're following someone.
As for her reaction, don't they have animal control for such feral creatures?
nice tag 🙁
How he kept so calm I don't know. Fair play to him.
She was stupid to stop in the middle of a fast trail. It showed a lack of awareness. If you're going to stop pull to the side and have a quick check over your shoulder first.
philconsequence - Member20mph on gravel and stopping in 5 meters..... you're kidding right? you obviously dont weigh over 14stone TJ!
Weight is irrelevant as it means more grip - and grip is the limiting factor not your brakes
5 m stopping distance from 20 mph on gravel is easy - if you know how to use your brakes and if your brakes are in good condition
By gravel I meant the trail centrer surface - not loose deep gravel of course
You would be surprised how quickly you can stop given decent technique
bunch of pansies.... end of.
Yeah the guy at the back should not have been close enough to rear end her. But give him a break, If you are going to stop dead, not slow down for a technical section but stop dead, do it at the side of the trail. If you stop in the middle of the trail you should expect a problem or be causing one I reckon.
Anger management training is required and I reckon the guy at the back can give it. I would have lost it well before he moved on.
Weight is irrelevant as it means more grip
It also means more kinetic energy (directly proportional), no idea if grip is also directly proportional. Complicated I suspect.
TandemJeremy - Member
You would be surprised how quickly you can stop given decent technique
Would a bit of front wheeel-lock have sorted everything out? 😀
He hit her his fault, hit her pretty hard too causing her to wheelie. She's either a noob or a mincer he could see that on his approach, going pretty slow on a tame looking section, should have slowed wayyyy down and maybe politley let her know he was there - squeely brakes are good for this, she had a full facer and by the looks of it was half scared to death no way is she gonna notice someone behind her.
Seems pretty strong over reaction from her, I'd be pretty freaked if a car hit me from behind, I like to think I'd cut another rider some slack...dunno tho.
It [b]was[/b] a good way to make sure he had a clean run at the rest of the trail 🙂
Oof, looks like she was in a bit of a grumpy mood anyway. Maybe she hates MTBing but her boyfriend makes her do it.
His fault in law I'm sure, but you have to sympathise.
Weight is irrelevant as it means more grip - and grip is the limiting factor not your brakes
Teej I think you keep forgetting you are a nurse and not an engineer.
Toys - on gravel is grip not the limiting factor and grip is proportional to the weight on the wheels? Yo will skid before yo run out of power int eh brakes assuming brakes in decent condition?