[Closed] Tell me about... Rohloffs

I've had a 'hoff for nearly 6 years now, bought secondhand off here.
Its been back to the factory for new bearings twice, fixed for free and a letter of apology that it had failed! I think I've discovered the source of the failure too -the wheel wasn't dished correctly and I was aligning the sliding dropouts by getting the rim central between the chainstays, effecitvly setting it at an angle. Once I fixed the wheelbuild, I've had no more bearing problems.

I love it. The stationary gear changing is brilliant, I've got used to the weight off the back and I don't notice the drag.

I do want to try a Pinion though.

the lip seals need a special Rohloff tool which good dealers will have.

Paper Gaskets I'd done but I think this one now needs the lip seals doing.

Ah - interesting. I'd not seen a tool or seals for sale on Ison's trade pricelist last time I looked(some time back) so assumed it was something Rohloff insisted on doing at the factory (like fitting Gates sprockets for example).

Ah - tool still doesn't show on Ison's site but SJS have them. Not a bad price as these things go.

I was kind of right about it being a back to the factory job - "Only newer hub seals with an outer metal ring (Serial No. 25400 onwards) can be replaced ...using the tool"

The hub that needs doing is 27712 so only just in the DIY range but I think it's the oldest of ours.

http://www.rohloff.de/en/technology/workshop/tools/hub_seal_press_in_tool/index.html

I ran one for 3 years and switched back to regular drivetrains about 3.5 years ago.

They definitely have a place- if you do longer rides on a hardtail that is light in the first place they are great as they reduce maintenance (a bit- the cables they come with are a liability with the liner prone to being pulled into the shifter, making shifting almost impossible) and are generally unnoticeable. I think if your bike weighs about 24lbs in the first place you've not much to lose.

I fell out of love with it for a number of reasons, including-

- Wheel removal is a bit of a faff with the box having to be removed all the time. Not the end of the world though.

- The extra weight if you ride a lot of technical trails on a hefty all mountain bike (I ran it on an Evil Sovereign and weight with the Rohloff was about 33lbs, when I swapped to a regular drivetrain it was 29lbs) the extra weight pushes the bike weight up to an uncomfortable level, making rides more difficult especially when combined with...

-...the extra drag. If you ride a lot of steep hills you'll be in the 1-7 gears a lot, where the drag is. It is noticeable and can be demoralizing. The extra efficiency of a regular drivetrain is definitely noticeable.

In the end, lower weight and less drag were the main reasons I ditched it and I've not looked back. I rode with another guy who had one and his has also gone in favour of a 1x10 drivetrain.

If you do the bulk of your riding in a place that gets muddy and has more rolling hills or flat terrain and your bike is a decent weight and can live with £50 oil changes plus cables every year (I found cables last just as long as with a regular drivetrain) and the upfront cost then go for it.

I also suffered from random bearing failures similar to the poster above.

I bought one and wanted to love it but i hated it - the drag was far more than on a standard bike - ok it was new 2000 miles etc etc but it really felt bad - like pulling a sack of potatoes. Just don't get it!

Gave up in the end.

Now here's the thing - I run 1x10 now (SLX) which costs me about about £50.00 to change over once a year (cassette, chain, front ring). Runs perfectly in the mud, great efficiency, no problem at all and works much better.

No brainer!

DC

I fully understand that some people really don't like Rohloff's and I understand why but always surprised by the misinformation -

£50 oil changes

£50 buys you oil for a lifetime. An oil change kit is [url= http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/rohloff-full-oil-change-kit-8410-prod12171/ ]£17[/url] rrp but you can re-use the syringe and buy the oil cheaper in bulk (It looks like you can [url= http://www.evanscycles.com/products/rohloff/speedhub-oil-250ml-ec045492 ]buy 250ml quantities[/url] rather than litres now)

@orangeboy - have you routed the shifter cables along with the back brake hose?

Yep just cable tied the whole lot together but the bend is a little tighter than I would like but don't notice when I'm riding

Mine's 14 years old and working fine. My mates don't drop me on the climbs but I don't think it would be an advantage in an XC race. Trail riding i dont notice the difference. One of the main benefits is being able to change gear without turning the cranks - like when you drop down a steep decent and are met with a sudden incline. No mashing and crunching of sprockets.

I've got 2, the first one being circa 9 years old and the second is about 6 years old.

bencooper: Can you remember when I bought them?

1 of them was back to the factory last year for gear slippage issues and got repaired FOC. The other one has run without a hitch...other than a few drops of oil which was easily resolved with new gaskets.

Both are now on HT's. One on a Cotic Solaris 29er with Paragon swinging dropouts and the other on a On One inbred with horizontal dropouts. Both are used across all types of trails but mostly almost daily on techy rocky / rooty trails.

The first hub was originally used almost everyday (inc winter) for commuting on a 18 mile round trip across a mixture of trails / roads and most weekends for thrashing around local trails. For those of you who commute through traffic you'll know that traffic dirt / film is far worse on a bike than good clean mud. With the old XT system, if I didn't give it some TLC every weekend it would jam by day 8 or 9. Now I never have to do anything other than hose down the bike and give the chain a wee wipe with a dry lub once it's dry. It's just something I never have to think about now.

I’ve competed in several 50+ mile off road races through some of the best (worst) terrain Scotland has and I've stopped counting the number of other competitors who who are cursing their fancy XTR / X0 systems that can’t shift properly because of the mud! I did the WHW over 2 days last year without a hitch.

On balance I usually change the cables out every 2 years or so and carry out a 6 monthly oil change as opposed to waiting the full year.

As you can tell I'm a big fan but here's a few thoughts on some of the weaknesses etc

Noise: Yes, it does make a little whirring noise in gears 5 - 7 but if you compare that to a normal system when you try and change gear quickly or when it's full of mud, there's no comparison!

Weight: It’s a little on the heavy side but let's be honest here, we've all spent time and money shaving grams off our bikes and then put on 5lbs over the xmas hols!

Cost: It's expensive and I spent ages making my mind up before I finally took the plunge but it's more than paid for itself in terms of ease of use, reliability and peace of mind on the trail.

I'll never go back to the old way as they are the best bike related investment I’ve made.

I use a metal braided outer brake cable - available from CRC, and xtr inner gear wires. I find this combo the most durable (18mtns-2years) and the smoothest.

I run the hub on a Thorn 853 Enduro hard tail, and the whole thing comes in at 30 pounds or a fraction under. I have had it about 28 but it wasn't durable. It has a place in the winter mainly, and also the summer - I used to run it all year round. But, my geared (xtr) hard tail is so much quicker, or I think so after a winter of riding the Thorn I always feel I have a few months fitness advantage from doing so. FWIW I can't recall ever being dropped on a climb riding the Rohloff'd Thorn - maybe my memory is bad or I ride with slow people..

bencooper: Can you remember when I bought them?

Nope, but I think somewhere there's a list of serial numbers and year of manufacture, could look it up if you're interested.

Next daft question: what cranks, and how easy is it to get the chain line right?

Any cranks you like, and pretty simple - usually just lining up with the big ring works fine.

Chain line is over-rated anyway.

Personaly I use rs7 or older xt hollowtec as I like internal bb

But does not need to be anything special

Looking for something else, I found the list of serial numbers:

000000 - 000400 1998
000401 - 002700 1999
002701 - 006500 2000
006501 - 012000 2001
012001 - 018800 2002
018801 - 027700 2003
027001 - 038500 2004
038501 - 050049 2005
050050 - 065000 2006
065001 - 081600 2007
080601 - 100000 2008
100001 - 115900 2009
115901 - 135800 2010
135801 - 153000 2011
153001 - 171000 2012

I've just heard back - my Alfine is trashed.

Nice one ben , mines is 2005 then number 50039

My cable-routing detail:

[img] [/img]

Silver braided Jagwire brake outer into v-brake noodles, with Jagwire gear inners. I've got another pair of v-brake noodles at the shifter end too to get rid of the silly big cable loop. Works a treat and keeps it tidy.

I rode bikes with derailleurs for 15 years, then a Rohloff-equipped bike (in fact two or three frames worth) for 9 years, and both over the last two years (not at the same time :). There may be disadvantages to internal hub gears, but perceived drag, and weight and its distribution are not really amongst them, currently wheel removal due to the horizontal dropouts annoys me more...

Half a pound more at the rear? People who now run 1x10 don't complain that suddenly the weight distribution of their bikes changed as they lost front derailleur and chainrings. Also, the weight is thankfully in the hub and not further away, a heavy rim makes a bigger difference (to acceleration). Drag? Some friends still believe I have a little eMotor in there, and I am not that fast. I also think that a super-tacky Evo triple-Nano compound stick-to-rocks tyre creates more drag than a Rohloff, if the latter does at all.

The only reason why I changed chainrings (and sprockets) in the last few years was to try slightly higher/lower gears, and change 'the looks', wear is hardly an issue. Which is the main point, with a few oil changes over the years, one return journey to Rohloff for a service, and no maintanance other than oiling the chain even after very muddy rides, I can spend more time actually riding my bike rather than servicing it, and that's what counts most to me.

Gratuitous pic of my latest build and cable routing (since ir_b posted his):
[img] [/img]

If I got one it would be to create a mud proof drivetrain, with a belt.

MidlandTrailQuestGraham did exactly that. He also put a Lefty on his, and possibly gone 29er, in an effort to outniche everyone else... 😉

I rode a Rohloff equipped Airnimal for about 12,000 miles. Only annual oil changes and one set of cables in that time.

If I got one it would be to create a mud proof drivetrain, with a belt.

The guy on the Rohloff stand at Handmade showed me a rear gates carrier that had come of a Rohloff. You could have shaved with it it was that worn and sharp. Gates now supply steel carriers as a result of wear. Combine that with a snubber and the extra weight to both stiffen and allow the rear triangle to split and there are no weight savings over a chain. The belts are expensive and have to be handled carefully and can break in use if stones get picked up with mud into the drivechain. I believe MTG has broken at least one belt. I only spend 2 minutes a week on my chain in the worst winter conditions and it's used off road to get me to work every day. The drivechains already filthy so I can't see a single advantage to the belt off road.

2005 here too according to Ben's year/part numbers list.

The reason I want a belt is because I hate the thought of all that mud grnding my chain away. It's not about cleaning as such, more the destruction of a part.

I might install a chain guard though if I was using Rohloff, to keep it clean 🙂

I've had 4 years from a chain without it being ground away. The first cheap 9 speed SRAM one lasted over 3 and I only changed that because I thought I should. It would almost certainly have gone on a lot longer. I'm sure anything that will wear a chain will wear a belt. I damaged my year old chain recently and replaced it with another £10 kmc one keeping the same chainring and sprocket. It was a little noisier for the first few miles but is running perfectly now. It turned out that the original chain was ok it was the link that I'd used for the life of 2 chains that was on its way out.

Did I mention I've got a belt drive ss too? One day I'll merge them together....

molgrips it looks like MTG thinks I may be right. [url= http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/belt-drive-i-t-may-be-time-to-admit-defeat ]Thread here[/url]

Bah.. Shame that. My search continues. I still thing I would like to fab some kind of chain guard if I had a hub gear.

i think id just buy and fit a hebie chainglider if i was looking for a solution to a problem that doesnt really exist.

I can see the point of a chainglider on the road - even a belt drive but come on half the fun of a mountain bike is being a kid again and getting covered in mud.

i think id just buy and fit a hebie chainglider if i was looking for a solution to a problem that doesnt really exist.

Having my chain covered in crap is a problem. It causes shitloads of wear.

In response to simon_nicolai's post, my details about 50 quid oil changes is not misinformation. That is how much they cost at the dealer I got mine from. I didn't want to do them myself, regardless of how easy it is perceived to be.

I'll charge you £100 to pump up your tyres if you like?

It's not really fair to blame Rohloff because you were stung by a shop 😉

Having my chain covered in crap is a problem. It causes shitloads of wear.

I get 3 years from a crap covered chain. Just how long do you want one to last your tight bastard! 🙂

I didn't want to do them myself, regardless of how easy it is perceived to be.

The day you can't do a Rohloff oil change is the day you need to employ someone to wipe your arse. 🙂
It really is very very simple.

Yes, its a tricky six minute job 🙄

The day you can't do a Rohloff oil change is the day you need to employ someone to wipe your arse.

I've been using two for over ten years in various bikes & yes they are a bit heavier but I hate taking my XT/XTR derailleur bikes out to get caked in thick mud.
I use Middleburn 38/40t DH (4mm) chainrings, 17t [url= http://www.marcelhahn.de/singlerohl15.html ]Singlestar[/url] Ti rear sprockets & SRAM PC1 chains.

SC Chamleon
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Cove G spot
[img] [/img]
Marin Wolfridge
[img] [/img]

For the record my Rohloff went back to Germany three times in as many years for bearing replacements - well documented in the history of this forum. My three other friends who have Rohloffs have had the same issue also.

Bottom line is they do sap the fun out of riding a mtb offroad and are not as indestructable as some claim, but excel in other areas. I still have mine but only ride it for touring or in the depths of winter

Anyone know how easy it is to change the axle plate (to switch between types)?

Very easy - 5 Torx bolts.

Looking for something else, I found the list of serial numbers:
.
.
065001 - 081600 2007
.
.
115901 - 135800 2010

Cheers Ben.

My first hub is 076786 so thats 2007 and second one is 116531 so thats 2010. I actually thought my first one was older but obviously not!

For what it's worth, it's the older hub that's been back twice for some 'rohloff magic fairy dust'!

And another one: what does it cost for a bearing change, and how often? Have read threads on here suggesting once every 18/12, and a trip to Germany.

I believe it's usually the hub shell bearings that can develop play and I know when I spoke to sjs about getting mine converted to disk they said both that and the hub she'll be earrings could be done in the uk. I think most people who have had this done haven't been charged even when the hub is several years old.