[Closed] Surly Pugsley. Any good when the snow has gone ???

Aye
http://coastkid.blogspot.com/
ask coastkid.

What's the damage going to be for a Rolly equipped Pug ? If you don't mind me asking 😀

TIA Dave.

Fatbikes (there collective term) really shine not just on snow but anywhere where a regular bike is hard work or nigh on impossible to maintain forward travel across soft conditons.
Most impressive place for there ability is the beach...amazing how they ride over very soft sand..also great on soft peat conditions like the cheviot hills and alot of the Scottish Highlands...they leave less of a tyre foot print than a human foot print... hows that for being eco friendly and low impact 😉
Now we just need a British company to build one here in the UK to make it the low carbon footprint eco friendly low erosion bicycle which would be a great thing for cycling 😮

I already had the rohloff off a fisher rig 29er but I think that they are about 1200 quid and most of the other bits I'm transferring accross to the pugs from the rig as well. I'll just be buying the frame and wheels and a couple of other bits and bobs but it'll be about £1200. End of jan you should be able to buy a complete pugsley build for about £1500. You'd have to flog the gearing it came with and have a rohloff built into the rear wheel though. Your probably looking at abou 2800 quid for a rohloff build pugsley from scratch. You could probably build it with an alfine 11 spd hub complete for about 1800 quid though

Coast Kid

It's getting more interesting the more people I talk to and everyones advice just adds to the charm of this bike.
If I increase the tyre pressures would pugsley travel well on harder off road surfaces as well. What I think I'm asking is would I always have to ride a pugsley on my own or could it keep up with normal bikes in normal conditions. Extreme conditions no one without a pugsley could ride with you anyway and when its not extreme could I keep up?

In the dry they roll over everything like a 29er, only twice as good.

What I think I'm asking is would I always have to ride a pugsley on my own or could it keep up with normal bikes in normal conditions.

I've seen Pugs more than keep up on a "normal" ride.

Can't wait for my fatbike to turn up.

Can't wait for my fatbike to turn up.

Nor me.

Stu - Looking at the UPS site it left the states yesterday.

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Mine left yesterday too.

Race yah?

I can keep up with regular bikes on XC trails with my Pugsley.
Some folk ride them with Maverick SC forks and an inline fat front wheel for a bit more comfort...
Ive been commuting last 2 weeks on the Pug in these snow conditions and its been ace despite its wieght, i did Glentress Black route in under 2 hours 2 years ago on mine (though i was fit then :D) and it freaked out my mates riding 20 LBS xc bikes but these bikes are about having fun and exploration off the beaten track..thats where there most rewarding 😮

Moose2008 😀 Thanks for the heads-up.

They're a proper mountain bike. Go into the mountains and ride just about anything.

Obviously not the weapon of choice of those who want to go fast downhill over big jumps.

Here's mine in Harris - not a fireroad or singletrack within sight 🙂

[url= http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1063/5107873267_341b2f0b04_b.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1063/5107873267_341b2f0b04_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

JohnClimber where from? how much?

cheers

epicyclo; mine came into its own on Harris 2 years ago on sodden grassy crofters trails where a regular bike would have badly cut up the ground 😀
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ssstu- they should be great for "gentlemen of a larger frame" so you shouldn't break it with you lardcore riding 😉

Maybe this film i did will convince you to get the debit card out,
The Bike Chain Edinburgh is now taking orders on complete Pugsleys...

leeroybrown - From Davis at bikeman.com
We paid $1500 plus carriage, plus and still to come import duty and VAT

I guess you'll have a bit of a wait now until the next lot come in. I think Stu got the last one.

Thanks John,i do like the look of them

Is there any difference in punctures for the big rims and tyres? Could you run them tubeless?

Awesome vid coastkid, I do want one now. Looks like some sweet singletrack over in east lothian!

Aaahhh I want a fat bike

Hopefully my fat bike will be in the post tomorrow - I fly home next wednesday - hopefully it is waiting on me ! - keep an eye out for snow bound pictures !

Hmmm - with enough interest, maybe we could persuade the importers to bring some Mukluks over....

Hopefully my fat bike will be in the post tomorrow - I fly home next wednesday - hopefully it is waiting on me ! - keep an eye out for snow bound pictures !

Great film Bruce, your wheelies are legendary 😀

mm - with enough interest, maybe we could persuade the importers to bring some Mukluks over...

My LBS has tried. They didn't say no but gave the impression it would be later on next year

From the above pics, are Larry's taking over from Endo's as the tyres of choice and is the handling much better ?

We've asked too, but maybe the recent weather has sparked enough interest. I wonder if having some firm orders would be enough of an "arm twist"?

They had a firm order from me but still said maybe later next year.

It'd be great to see a few more over here though.

i use mine for everything, its not teh quickest but then neither am I

I feel a lot more in tune with it than my carbon hardtail I sold to build it

tyres upto 15-18 psi for dry packed trails, and going to get larry tyres soon

Ive got front and rear rack for touring too

and dont forget you can fit 29 er narrower rims in if you have a pair built witht hte correct offset

[IMG] [/IMG]

Awesome bike for riding loose sand dunes and such...

Some "and such"

[url= http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5210/5214531661_d3421172bc_b.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5210/5214531661_d3421172bc_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

When i can afford a new bike it will be a fat bike .

[url= http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1158/5133094699_e6e317e807_z.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1158/5133094699_e6e317e807_z.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/72475478@N00/5133094699/ ]0301[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/72475478@N00/ ]anrothardonn[/url], on Flickr
[url= http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2721/4357027491_87e2f45c2d_z.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2721/4357027491_87e2f45c2d_z.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/72475478@N00/4357027491/ ]su32[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/72475478@N00/ ]anrothardonn[/url], on Flickr

Good thread chaps, I think a few here are fat-curious!

I didn't know drunky had one.

yea, check out his flickr site, some stunning pics from the frozen north, there's some fat bike build pics on there too from a while ago, not got time to find them but they give good close up pics of a Fatback bike

I want one now. Are they import only?

Nice vid Coastkid. As I'm running the radio through the pc I ditched the Coldplay soundtrack and watched (most of) it to Elvis' Viva Las Vegas which sort of worked.

Going to phone Ison and see how many we can get our mitts on!
(Salsa and Surly)

TBC mid week beachrides next summer? 😮

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stop tempting me...

a fleet of hire bikes...imagine it 😉

shoosh!

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Loving mine at the moment but almost too much snow on the open ground, think I have found the limit of riding around 24" of powder

Now running an SC32 on the front, works great in the dryer conditions and stops that "unbalanced" pull to one side when you get it up to speed

Buy one now you won't regret it 🙂

Heres an Album of various makes of fat bikes ive collected over a couple of years, its on photo bucket so can be viewed as a slideshow.
Lots of makes as you can see and a few on off`s,
King of the fatbike porn must be the moots bikes!,

[url= http://s399.photobucket.com/albums/pp77/coastkid71/fatbikes/ ]Fat Bike Gallery[/url]

So close or ordering one instead of a 29er but looking for some guidance, can anyone help?

1. I note they are good in most terrains but in mid winter do you need specific mud tyres?
2. Parts are they easyish to come by?
3. To get to the singletrack near my house I have some roads to cover, am I correct in assuming they are ok on the road to get to fun stuff
4. Hard packed summer trails will the pugsley do the business in the woods.

I have watched the bid on this thread and am smiling at the thought of getting one, but would like to hear from personal experience in regards to questions above.

Thanks to all those whom reply

Ps 20inch or 22 for an 18st 6ft 2 bloke. My P7 is 21 and fits like a glove

Have a look at Coastkids vids, he seems to manage very well on every type of terrain.

Parts seem to be relatively easy to come by as apart from frame and forks (if you go for 135mm) the only differences are wheels/hubs and bottom bracket. Would have thought smaller rather than larger would be the way to go but bars tend to be higher by the look of most set-ups. Depends what you are getting and what the geometry is compared to your P7!

Had a wee game of email volleyball with Pat CJ at Ison today. Talking numbers of Puglseys we want on a pre-order for March,

sadly no movement on the Mukluk at all.

We will be stocking up on all spares relevant to Pug's also.

Mantastic - you have mail btw if i assume correctly that your initials are C.S.

I can vouch, they're great on sand....
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still no bl**dy snow.............

@thebikechain, indeed that is me. Just checking the geometry on my P7 and F100 before I make my mind up on size. Looks like my F100 is in-between a 20 and 22 but my F100 has the headset extension on and seat post is nearly fully out. Oh decisions decisions.

Will check my emails when back at work in the morrow

Mukluk eta is march
Complete pugsley start arriving in Jan - offering a discount on pre-orders, just email me on Bikemonger at yahoo dot co dot uk
Demo pug should be in the shop in January

The original question... Do they Go beyond snow. The shop demo pug is going straight to the nudist beach sand dunes when it arrives. It should be great on the endless singletrack of sand, swamp and leathery old pervert!

Had an email back from Conrad - probably easier just to copy and paste the update below - hope he doesn't mind but it will answer some questions people might have
[i]In januari production will start on a batch of complete Gobi bikes, available by the end of that month. Those bikes will be spec'ed "high end": Hope, XO, Race Face, Joplin seatpost...
Apart from that we'll offer loose frames in the 4 versions: Gobi (light alu), Atacama (normal alu), Kalahari (Steel) and Outback (alu tandem). You'll be able to tick off a whole list of options: rack bosses, number of bottle cage studs, type of headset, EBB option for single speed, standard colours or special paint, any special wishes...
If you already have an idea what you want and be first in line, we can alreday sort a frame out for you by email. Delivery would be no sooner then mid january, I'm out of some of the raw material (the dropouts), that should arrive within a few weeks.

Price for a Kalahari frame would be around 500 Euro, depending on the options you'd want. Attached a picture of a nice Kalahari one of our test riders just finished.[/i]

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Good thread chaps, I think a few here are fat-curious!

"Chubby Chasers" - is that the correct expression? 😀

I knew some fat curious lads in kid army lol esp after a few jars

Any of you Pug owners running a second set of 29er wheels in addition to the fat wheels?

problem with having regular (that would be 29er) wheels built to a 17mm offset is there strength.
it can be done but its not ideal...
hence the 2nd generation fatbikes with a wider hub (165mm) inline (like normal) build wheels which allow regular inline rear wheels built to the wider 165mm hub allowing swappable wheels... 😮

This is the the thing that sounds complicated about these bikes...
the wheels, but its quite simple,offset or non offset 😮

ah now i get it so a normal 135 rear non offset wheel in the front and a 165mm hub on the rear non offset too.

so is it worth going with a 135 fork now or is 100 as good , given that you'd lose the ability to stick it in the rear anyway as it 165 at the back

oh and who does 165 rear hubs ?

btw where do you lot buy rims/wheels/tyre etc

thanks

We need a new thread just on Fat bike wheels!
Only the pugsley standard frameset uses a 17mm offset front fork and wheel to match the rear wheel (to allow chain clearance along with the 100mmBB whilst using a 135mm rear hub) which also allows swappable wheels front and rear...
this was the first set up available off the shelf...
meanwhile Wildfire, an Alaskan design where aready using a 17mm offset rear wheel build on there frames which is what Surly adopted...
Surly also make a pugsley 100mm hub inline hubbed fork called the Adventure fork which takes a normal inline wheel...though with a wider rim than normal to allow to seat a 4" surly tyre,
general findings is a rim at least 45mm for these tyres...
More lately other companys have made availble a fork which takes a 135mm (rear) hub or now available a 135mm front hub.
So now alot of fatbike companys like Alaskan speedway cycles make 165mm rear inline wheeled framesets and 135 inline forks..
confused? dont worry most folk are!
check out MTBR`s fatbike forum which answers most questions 😮

Merci mr 😉

mick try getting a 100mm rim into a 100mm fork 😉

im trying to engineer an alfine into the rear of my sandman - it has a nuschool 165mm rear end - i have my methods - it wont be as easy as i thought though - might be easier to put my rohloff in 😉

Im sure ill get through the issues though !

Fair on I was thinking of something around 50mm for a rim but I guess if your gonna go fat you may as well go real fat

Doh double post. My baby fat tyres hopefully will arrive today 😉

gonna email angus bike chain - see if my sandman + arctic cycles rims arrived 😉

get them to build my wheels for me coming back because i just wanna ride !!

I don't really have any decent bike shops round me and They are seem to be too busy to order owt in.

I have two SS rear 135mm hubs, do I build two wheels with fat rims or what to use them (at some point in the future) on a fatbike? And what's the cost of F&F set? I don't really care about the logo, ok, On-One would be nice 😉 , steel or alu, whatever. It needs to look sane so no old Sandmen (Sandmans?), please.
Could I get a ti HT frame that will need disc mounts welded on (so it'll be worked on anyway) turned into a fat tyre-accepting jobbie?

You'd need a new rear triangle - cost prohibitive.

I've just ordered up a 48mm rim from tarty bikes to start the expt, to run with a 2.5 Diesel. I'll report back.

Hairychested - Member
..Could I get a ti HT frame that will need disc mounts welded on (so it'll be worked on anyway) turned into a fat tyre-accepting jobbie?

If you were doing this then it's better to start with a 29er frame because the fat wheel is about the same diameter. Doing it with a 26" would require more work to achieve a decent geometry.

The other issue is the bottom bracket. Ideally you need a 100mm wide BB shell. There are very wide BBs available that may allow you to get your chainline correct using a narrower shell, but you would need to be sure that you can get the chainline before starting to cut up a frame.

Unless you're doing the welding yourself it's cheaper to buy a Pugsley frame and then everything works out of the box 🙂

If I went for a Pug are there any UK available offset drilled rims other than the LMs. Just wondering whether its possible to go upto say 50mm wide, which should run Surly endos etc but obviously with less float. Kris Holm do them wide enough but I dont think they have the offset required for the pug. Maybe A Mukluk frameset would be a better idea?

[u][b][url= http://classic-cycle.de/index.php?force_sid=95e625814951dff647affc4390dd2b08&cl=search&searchparam=dhl+26&searchcnid=57d41ac52198ad096.80471172 ]Fatbike rims - fill your boots[/url][/b][/u] 🙂

Nice prices too, cheers 🙂

epicyclo, where do you buy spokes for the fat wheels?
Also, what's the cost of the frame, fork and BB? Wheels can be costly but I can sort of buy the rims now, build them later, buy tyres at some point next year. The other bits are not a problem but I won't buy on credit so need to save up (I can buy on the continent if it's cheaper).
Out of curiosity, would a fat rimmed wheel fit a 456SS?

Just ordinary spokes. I use DTSwiss Comps.

I have not measured a 456, but I think it's unlikely that the wheel would fit. Its overall diameter is more or less the same as a 29er wheel, and if you are using a wide rim the tyre width is about 98mm. You could use a narrower rim, about 40mm gives you a tyre width of 88mm.

Some people are simply using the fattest ordinary rear tyre that they can get on the rear (eg [url= http://www.unicycle.uk.com/duro-wildlife-leopard-26-x-3-tyre-2.html/ ]Duro 3" tyre[/url]) and having a fat wheel and fork on the front. That way you get almost all the benefits, except that a proper fat tyre may roll better than the 3" DH oriented one.

You can save money on the fork by making your own out of a worn out suspension fork. [u][b][url= http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/fatbike-forks-diy-no-welding-from-junk ]Look here for how I did it[/url][/b][/u]

I've just told my wife I understand next year Xmas pressie will be a Pug f+f set. Should be enough time for her to get organised.
Am I correct thinking a Pugsley will allow me to run two rear wheels 135mm?
What's better, those 80mm rims from Germany or narrower trials ones?

Having read into it a bit on mtbr and here, wider rims work better for the soft stuff but less well on normal trails.

Like I said I'm trying it step by step as it's pricy go all the way in one go.

Hairychested - Member
...Am I correct thinking a Pugsley will allow me to run two rear wheels 135mm?
What's better, those 80mm rims from Germany or narrower trials ones?

If so, my opinion is that the amount of offset required for the Pug frame would mean you would have a very flimsy 29er wheel - one flange would be almost directly under the spoke holes and the other at a fair angle. Tension on one set of spokes would be extremely high and the others quite slack. I have built up a wheel like this with a 40mm rim, but I decided I'd rather not ride on it 🙂 If you can get a rim that is wide enough to drill offset spoke holes, that would be much better.

Velocity make an [u][b][url= http://www.velocitywheels.com/store/product.asp?pID=32&cID=18 ]offset rim[/url][/b][/u] but a bit narrow for a 29er tyre. I'd go for something like the [u][b][url= http://www.velocitywheels.com/store/product.asp?pID=248&cID=18 ]Psycho[/url][/b][/u] and drill my own offset holes* - which would also allow you to do a crossover lace up for even more strength.

As far as rim width is concerned between 40mm and 80mm rims you gain an extra 10mm of tyre width. The trials rims are lighter, but let's take stock, this is a Landrover you're building not a Lamborghini 🙂 I'd go for the flotation - you can always drill out the rims anyway and lose quite a few pounds, as does going tubeless although that appears to have a spotted history on low pressure tyres (I have no personal experience).

*I drilled my fat rims offset to get a crossover (left flange to right hand hole on rim etc) to get a really strong wheel (also redrilled from 36 to 32 holes). You can see it here

[url= http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1369/5178780700_49bd728379_o.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1369/5178780700_49bd728379_o.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

Sorry about the big pic, but it shows it clearly.

Personally - I'd go for versatility and lighter weight with 50mm rims. It gives you plenty of float combined with better trail handling on normal trails. The Larry on a 50mm rim is great, it has a nice round profile and corners really well, compared to the Endo which was much flatter on the same rim. For sure- 100mm look more rad and all but I'm not convinced all that added weight is worth it.

I have several bikes to ride when I want narrower wheels, so interested in floaty, beach and snow perfect setup. I'd love to have a set of wiiiide wheels and swap-ability with a 29er set is of no interest to me.
The important thing for me is to spread it in time, I'm jobless at the mo, income is very limited but we should be fine next year. That's why I'm considering building the wheels now, maybe even 1 at the time. I just want to have decent wheels without too many problems. Without drilling. BTW How did you know where to drill?
Those classic bikes rims, when building SS wheels, would it be just like any other rim?

Just my thoughts on the wider v narrower rim thing.

I started off with a 65mm rim and found the tyre to be a bit "wandery" at low psi in corners on hard surfaces.

Switched to an 80mm rim and it feels a lot better at the same pressure.

The Larry still has a round prolife on the tread surface with an 80mm rim too. I can't comment what the Endo's like though as i only ever tried them once and that was quite a while back.