Very apt thread - as I nearly decide I needed a Free Ranger last week. Planet X told me I needed a L not and XL as 6ft 2 ( I have shrunk an inch).
off to geometry geeks - and other than top tube length it is nearly identical to my old RoadRat . Even head and seat angle.
So the Gravel Rat stays
Now you may say Hardtail*, but a Cotic Cascade is technically a gravel bike….
nearly identical to the mk1 solaris isn't it?
the only bike I regret getting rid of, and I did run it as a rigid bike (and 2.2 tyres, no dropper) for a while in either 2018 or 2019; possibly before gravel was cool...
Mine's a Mk IV Swift and it's fab (if a bit porky). It's really just a mostly road based gravel bike for me. I got a bit carried away in the Chiggle meltdown sale & built up a proper drop bar gravel bike, which I'm struggling to get to grips with & still mostly ride the Swift.
Winstanley currently seem to have around a quarter off of '23 flat bar Croix De Fers if anyone's after a proper flat bar gravel bike - https://winstanleysbikes.co.uk/genesis-croix-de-fer-10-flat-bar-2023-bike#187=4617
Controversial, I’m going to say a gravel bike has to have a 40t+ chainring
Both of mind have a 38t chainring
|My gravel bike is the same as my tourer and the same as my mountainbike. Sometimes I swap tyres
A gravel bike is one ridden on gravel - anything else is just marketing. |Its not a CX bike unless its built for CX racing
As for those not enjoying drops but liking the on the hoods position, wouldn’t going old school with narrower bars and bar ends fix that?
That is literally why I started the thread 🙂
I have 800mm riser bars with SQlabs inner bar ends on my rigid MTB, best of both worlds.
I liked the salsa cowchipler drops on mine and the hoods.
Now I'm on an on one Jones bar. I double wrapped bits of it last week and it was significantly nicer.
I have sq inner bar ends on one MTB for another hand.position. the 800mm wide bar is substantially nicer than narrow bars and bar ends from back in the day. The sq bar ends are supposed to allow you to brake a bit, but I couldn't get the position to work with hope V4 as the hoses stick out too much. Probably not a combo they had tried .
Trying a set of the sonder bomber 45 degree flared bars
nearly identical to the mk1 solaris isn’t it?
Pretty much why ai bought it actually. I sold a MK2 Solaris (and then regretted it), but had always thought it could make a good rigid, possibly with some wide flared drop bars. MK1 would have been better though.
Controversial, I’m going to say a gravel bike has to have a 40t+ chainring
Even more controversial, I'm going to say a gravel bike doesn't have to have a single ring.
Trying a set of the sonder bomber 45 degree flared bars
That looks at least a 90mm stem if not more. Have you tried a 70mm?
Found this photo from 2013. Think I had it like this for doing some sponsored charity rides. Think I did the 75 mile ride on it that year, and the following year, the 100 mile sponsored ride. For the 100 mile ride judging by photos I'd gone back to a triple chainset on the front, with the biggest ring at 48t. Some of the guys on road bikes commented on the speed I was going on it. It did fly at times 🙂
A gravel bike is one ridden on gravel – anything else is just marketing.
Not really. Is a road bike any bike ridden on the road, no it isn't. People may not like the term, the marketing, the trend etc,. but I can clearly see what a gravel bike is as a category of bike. Therefore a flat bar gravel bike is a gravel bike with flat bars and not drop bars - it is not a rigid MTB.
@kerley I can certainly see you point, but for gravel your logic is a little too reductive. The term gravel, the bikes marketed as gravel, and the terrain described as gravel: it's a very wide spectrum open to a fair amount of interpretation for terrain, categorisation, and bike type. Hence this thread has thrown up lots of interesting and vastly different bikes, which is a good thing. This wide range defies a rigid interpretation of simply a flat bar on a gravel marketed drop bar bike. I say that to defend the honour of rigid MTBs as brilliant tools for this category! 🙂
There's also a degree of spectrum fluidity to road and MTB, but that's another thing entirely!
EDIT: love the Kona and Gary Fisher!
I'm inclined to think that we've pretty much gone full circle and come back to hybrid bikes which have been doing 'gravel' all along (I'd be calling my Swift a hybrid except that 'gravel' seems to be the thing these days).
Ribble for example sell gravel bikes, of course, for road/gravel duties but they also sell a range of flat bar hybrids which they describe as for city roads & country trails.
I think the hybrid question is true to an extent, though it's never going to make a comeback as a marketing term! Also, they traditionally used to be road geometry bikes with a bit more clearance (like my old Raleigh pioneer!), and modern ones are in that vein but perhaps a bit more tweaks and innovation...something like the marin dsx is a good case in point of a really good evolution of that. But it's all just stuff on the broad spectrum with it's various choices and compromises...
The term gravel, the bikes marketed as gravel, and the terrain described as gravel: it’s a very wide spectrum open to a fair amount of interpretation for terrain, categorisation, and bike type
Nope, it is very clear what a gravel bike is. If you went into a bike shop that sold lots of different bikes and asked to see gravel bikes they would not take you to the MTB section, nor would they take you to the road section. They would show you what we know are gravel bikes and what are marketed as gravel bikes.
though it’s never going to make a comeback as a marketing term!
Very true.
We've had freeride, down country and gravel, so what are we calling 'new' hybrids?
Well Ribble still sell them as hybrids (for on/off road riding & adventure) although I get the feeling that 'hybrids' have a slightly more recreational feel to them whilst, perhaps, Gravel bikes are for more serious folk.
Ribble say:
WHAT ARE HYBRID BIKES?
A hybrid bike, in a nutshell sits somewhere in between a road bike and mountain bike. They take the flat handlebars and riding position of a mountain bike which riders find comfortable and intuitive and combine them with the lighter equipment of a road bike. This allows for greater speed for less effort especially when compared to an out and out MTB. To provide the comfort they have flat handlebars rather than the drop bikes that a true road bike road will be supplied with. The flat handlebars provide better comfort and added confidence which makes them a very popular choice for beginner riders. Similarly, to a mountain bike a hybrid bike can be fitted with a vast choice of tyres from slicks for tarmac use to knobbly tyres for off-road surfaces. With gearing low enough for off-road terrain, yet not detrimental to rides on paved surfaces the hybrid bike is a very capable all-rounder.
It's hardly definitive and I'm pretty sure that there was a manufacture some years ago (Boardman possibly) whose hybrid bikes were essentially flat bar road bikes.
Personally I always understood a hybrid to be a hardtail fitted with semi-slicks or slicks (like my Swift & a variety of hardtails that came before it). It probably doesn't matter about defining terms anyway, call it what you like & enjoy riding it.
though it’s never going to make a comeback as a marketing term!
Very true.
We've had freeride, down country and gravel, so what are we calling 'new' hybrids?
I’m guessing flat-bar gravel bikes ?
They would show you what we know are gravel bikes and what are marketed as gravel bikes.
or a touring bike. 700c wheels, Slack geometry, wide gearing, mounting points…
Pashley pathfinder, a revision of original racing bikes from the early 1900’s. That’s a gravel bike!
I reckon if you put flat bars on my gravel bike, it would look like a gravel bike with flat bars
Certainly not a HT MTB and not totally like how I’d perceive a hybrid to look
I'd agree, but what if you put a flat bar on a Cotic Cascade with 2.0" or wider semi-slicks?
I think it's probably a fool's errand trying to tie everything down, there are too many types or bikes and too much cross over. Just ride what suits you.
I'm not sure Gravel is even a discipline anymore, it's a much wider range of riding than it once was, it's more of a main category (like mountain bike).
Nope, it is very clear what a gravel bike is. If you went into a bike shop that sold lots of different bikes and asked to see gravel bikes they would not take you to the MTB section, nor would they take you to the road section. They would show you what we know are gravel bikes and what are marketed as gravel bikes.
I know what you're getting at but there is still a wide variation. It covers everything from a bit more than an endurance road bike for a more racing bias to the longer slacker more MTB influenced bikes that are for more robust riding and then the longer ride bike packer/tourer bias. These are all distinctly gravel bikes even with something other than drop bars on them.
Just like if you are in the road bike area you would have full aero, lightweight climbing and endurance bikes.
According to the UCI, a gravel bike is any bike heavier than 6.8 kilos and that is not “E-bikes, time trial bikes, recumbents and tandems”and has drop handlebars. The qualifying events allow mountain bikes since the drop bar requirement is not included. I’ve not seen any other definition.
hence your flat bar gravel bike is a UCI-hybrid. HTH
Are discussions like this a sign that Western society has reached new heights of sophistication or is it a warning that the end is nigh?