[Closed] Shimano 2011 - Is that it?

cynic-al,

running 2 x 9, 26/38 front, 11-32 rear (I think).

38-11 is more then enough, that I've never been able to see exactly what speed I spin out on mostly cause I stopped using a computer ages ago, but also because I rarely get it up to that gear. I have a feeling its somewhere in the region of 35mph, though.

So unless I've got a huge road descent down a mountain to the trails, or I have normal roads to the trails, and just fancy going at 40mph all the way there (likely..), its not a problem at all.

I shall enquire about the trade price tonight.

Only thing now is running one MTB all year round on XX or the cheaper? 2011 version.

That said I've just put a £200 order in with him for drivetrain consumables. And he reckons my XTR shifters are on the way out. See what I'm doing here 🙂

Trade prices on XX are pretty hilarious sadly!

Bum.

The cassette is the really daft bit, if you can hold out until a conventional cassette is available it will certainly be a fair cheaper option than the PowerDome one.

Oldgit - I can see exactly what you are doing there!

To me, the benefit of XX has all been down to the quick front shifts and the usefulness of the 2 x 10 concept. Since this has now / is about to trickle down, I would go at most for X0, and probably X9. At the very least go for a cheaper cassette. By the looks of it, XX will be the only carbon chainset, but that in itself is no great revelation. The chainrings and front mech (which look very similar on new X0 but just with alloy arms) are the bit that matters.

XX is the ultimate bling, but now that the tricle down has started, I would wait a bit for that to be available. It just isn't worth the premium unless every single gramme counts and you must have the best. I make no apology for having expensive taste in bikes, so for me it was worth it, plus I have been riding it for 4 months vs waiting another few months more for the trickle down effect to happen.

Must admit I was getting all cocky untill I saw the casette price.
Everything looks about double XTR except the chainset which ain't too bad.

[url= http://www.actionsports.de/Cassettes/Fun-Works-S-Light-Titan-MTB-Cassette-10-Speed-176g::24524.html ]This[/url] full ti one is far cheaper ironically, but doesn't come in the 11-36.

Don't be fooled. Current XTR prices will go up when the new stuff is announced.

It is already expensive, but since price doesn't seem to have been a barrier to XX, and they want to elevate XTR to 'supergroup' status again, I have a feeling that whilst individual components may vary, the total groupset price will be in line with XX.

And, whilst the XX cassette is very expensive, it's not hard to see why given the extremely wasteful and lengthy manufacturing process. The result is light, stiff, and hopefully being steel long lasting, although time will tell.

I have like sooooooooooooooooo many problems from flexing cassettes WTF 😛

Actually why don't sram hear treat their XX stuff in the same manner as samurai swords?

Might cost a bit but would last ages.

You miss the point entirely. Since it is so hollowed out, and there isn't much supporting it, it could have been a bit flexible. It isn't a comment about cassettes being flexible in general.

Honestly, some people are sooooooo touchy!

You miss the point entirely. Since it is so hollowed out, and there isn't much supporting it, it could have been a bit flexible. It isn't a comment about cassettes being flexible in general.

Honestly, some people are sooooooo touchy!

Ah, I mis-interpreted.

Some folk has said it's an issue on regular cassettes TBF.

Just waiting for 1x11 to be honest, which will be Shimano 1 Sram 0 if the current Alfine is anything to go by.

Al don't bother my experience about njee is that he considers riding around a muddy field mountain biking.
He doesn't even ride with a camelback or a spare tube (I still am waiting for you to answer some of the question on the other thread by the way).

If you oppose a valid argument to him he will just rely on insults and get offensive. Just don't bother you and I probably know better than him...

As for 2x10 I am so gnar to the power of sick that I use 2x9 :p And it's been 6 years now 😀

Just saw the SRAM piccies on the homepage. I now agree with myself even more! Shimano have some catching up to do.

But i don't want 2X10. I'm not a skinny bastard who races carbon bikes around a field. 2X9 is plenty, 27 too many (for what I ride). I'm hoping that some strength training will rid me of the need for a small chainring. 1 X 9 would be great. No front derailleur, no LH shifter and a nice tidy short chain. And SRAM can **** off with those prices.
I just had an amazing rip around whites level in the middle chainring, hope the training works!

Sorry Juan, which was the other thread, I can't actually remember?

I'm pretty sure I'm quite a reasonable chap actually Juan, sadly there seem to be more people who side with me for the most part. Let me guess, that's just xenophobia?

Just don't bother you and I probably know better than him...

What's that based on then? Go on, as you obviously know me so well? Do you even know my name? It's used on here often enough!

I'm unsure of where I've said riding around muddy fields is mountain biking, again, a link would be nice. I believe you've been to this neck of the woods before, drop me an email next time, we'll go for a ride, you can show me some of your rad to the power sick skillz.

2x10 sounds just right for me. I rarely use the low gears on my current 3x9 setup and since I ride singlespeed quite a bit, I know I can muscle up a hill if I need to. Since I also ride TT bikes I've got used to closer spacing on the back. In fact I'd be tempted to use a road 10spd on the rear. Summit like a 11-28.

Shimano 10spd on XT and SLX [url= http://www.pinkbike.com/news/shimano-10-speed-xt-sea-otter-2010.html ]link[/url].

Whether it's just XX or whether the shiting is inherently better on 2 rings up front, the real revelation of 2 x 10 is at the front. All the back does is facilitate the 2 rings up front without losing gear range.

These days, unless you use proper roadie equipment you can go lighter with discs!

http://clee-cycles.co.uk/cc/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/21_73/products_id/398
http://clee-cycles.co.uk/cc/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/21_73/products_id/475
http://clee-cycles.co.uk/cc/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/61_63/products_id/306

~190g rear, 160g front - what disc brake was it you were using which was lighter?

"having said that the 11-36 cassette is of interest for 1x10"

11-36 would be just as useful on 9 speed though. As far as I can tell the only reason there's not already an XT and 990 11-36 9-speed is that it's supposed to be a selling point of 10-speed so it's not in their interests to launch it for the old standard. Or perhaps I'm being cynical 😉

...actually I've now realised there isn't even a real decrease in weight with 2x10 assuming you're using an SRAM chainset, rather than one of the numerous lighter 3 ring chainsets available.

Sram are inferior in every way in terms of action, build quality and price.

Shimano win, and no, I don't think 10 gears out back means you HAVE to have 2 up front. Personally I'll probably just go 1x10 when the time comes, but for most riders who want to run bash guards etc. the current Sram 2x10 is useless.

Actually aracer I was thinking more of wheels.

The lightest V-brake rim I can think of is the ZTR 355, at about 380g. The Innolite XCC250 gives you 260g on the rims alone, which goes a long way to offset the weight difference in the brakes. It was vaguely tongue in cheek, but I'm sure you've seen Ole's 970g disc brake wheels on Weight Weenies.

I rely on njee20 for my light wheel info! He's a polite young chap too.

When are the road 355s out?

From the NoTubes message board posted a couple of weeks ago:

Alpha 340 will be available this spring. It will be available in 32, 28, 24, & 18 holes. We will sell the rims by themselves in 32 or 28 holes only. Alpha 24 & 18 hole rims will only be available as custom wheel builds. Information on what hubs we will offer & prices for the rims and wheelsets will be announced soon.

Seems reasonable to assume a 340g weight then, which is pretty impressive!

Nice to know I can be relied on Al, my talent doesn't end at wheels though, I can do all light weight parts 🙂

Edit, and as an added bonus, here it is:

[img] [/img]

Actually aracer I was thinking more of wheels.

http://m5recumbents.com/site/EN/_m5__Lightweight_bike_parts/Front_and_rear_hubs/

Cheers!

I CBA spending £££ on other stuff tbh - wjeels is biggest bang for buck, esp with stans.

If I use revs on the front on my rebuild I can lose 200gm!

we'll go for a ride, you can show me some of your rad to the power sick skillz.

Well as soon as the flights resumes you can take the first flight to nice. I'll be happy to show you around...

The post I am referring to is the weight one. Plus I have just read you have been pedalling 3 hours on the big ring. So you're either god like cyclist and I bow in front of your fantastic riding level. Or you just happen to live in a very flat place with no mountain on it. The fact you ride with no camel back or spare tubes (once again referring to the weight post) gives away how 'engaged' your riding is.
I may just be an average rider (actually below average buy my position in the group) but I would not go anywhere without water or a spare tube. Just because I don't fancy pushing my bike back to the car for 2 or 3 hours.

My friend matt (he won busas XC and finished second over all at gorrick series) actually tells me not to bother... He rode here and his words are: riding here is just another world (for both ups and down), it's important to be prepared.

So I am not gonna bother again.

'Sram are inferior in every way' ? What a ridiculous sweeping statement.

so, in conclusion, worlds most expensive groupset works well.

Yep. After several deviations and blatant hijacking by retro-geeks, dr who geeks and finally extreme weight weenies (thanks to Njee for his usual polite and uncontroversial approach!) we come full circle back somewhere close to the original posting!

but I would not go anywhere without water

Neither would I, that's ridiculous, I merely carry mine in a bottle, not a bag on my back!

Or you just happen to live in a very flat place with no mountain on it

Are you educationally sub normal? You know where I live, of course there are no mountains here! There's a reasonable amount of climbing if you want to find it, but it's all short sharp stuff, there's nothing prolonged and I've never said otherwise.

I don't doubt the riding there is more technical, I've never disputed that, and I wouldn't be remotely surprised if you were a far better rider technically than me, I would hope you are living where you do. I'm glad 'Matt' enjoyed the riding there too, although the relevance of that is rather questionable!

What I fail to understand is how any of that is relevant for my choice to not carry a tube when I'm riding the hills local to me, having not needed one in a very long time? Not engaged in my riding? Shouldn't you be on MBUK or Pink Bike with talk like that? Or, better yet... stop being a failure and go out and get a ****ing job. Good lad.

Yes, but if you're going there, you have to bear in mind that whilst disc rims might be lighter, if you're running rim brakes you can use rather lighter hubs.

That being the dodgy roadie componentry to which I was refering! Even so, the lightest rear hub M5 do appear to be 183g, which is heavier than the fabled Tune Dezibel or the Extralite Ultradisc hubs.

Anyway, that's going to extremes. I did say that my comment was tongue in cheek, and what I meant was that innovation has largely come in disc brake, not rim brake components. Ie... I'll wager a full XTR bike with XC717 rims and v-brakes is close in weight to one with full XX, ZTR Podium wheels and disc brakes.