we lend out tools, pump etc, but one occasion I was finishing a custom build and a customer asked to borrow the chain tool, after a couple of minuted he came inside moaning that the tool is rubbish as the pin had broken in the tool, i was a bit put out but put a spare in and advised that its what we use in the workshop and is of the best quality, also to make sure he put the chain in the tool properly, I left him too it and started again on the bike, so he comes in again with a broken pin and tells me that he will go elsewhere as my tools are rubbish.
I was then left with no spare pins and had to put a chain on a customers bike, at which point I had to resort to taking a new tool off the shelf and using it, not a massive loss but so frustrating and just ridiculous attitude to what a LBS should be doing for people in the name of customer service.
like i said we still lend tools but now and again some toss pot will take a bit more of your faith in humanity away.
The realities of retail. There's talk in the thread of it being a 'terrible business model'. Really? I'm not sure he guy who owns Cycle Surgery would have behaved the same way.
This is just one member of staff who just couldn't be arsed. One member of staff who didn't think of the consequences and one member of staff who will probably never think of the consequences no matter how many times you tell him. He might not be there for much longer, before moving on to his next job paying around minimum wage. There are some excellent people in LBSs earning proper money and there are some who will never get past just being order takers...
I was in Halfords the other day ordering a headset press. Guy walks in complaining the new bike he picked up has a chain that skips when he pedals backwards. One guy spends two minutes telling him that it's normal, all bikes do that until a second team member walks up and makes a meal of it before telling him to bring it in as "he's never heard of that happening before".
Getting good staff is bloody hard. Training poor staff is nearly impossible.
Assuming you had the spare links/pins and the bike wasn't caked in dog eggs, given you'd just spent £50 I'd have hoped the lad would have grabbed a chain tool and done it for you. If I had a LBS I wouldn't lend the tool.
It's a tricky one - I've lent tools and had them come back broken or not at all. So I'm afraid I make a judgement when people ask, and sometimes just say no.
I was recently building a replacement for my stolen mtb. Thought I had purchased everything and it was only when I was starting the build that I realised I had forgotten to order rotor screws (they are usually just the parts I would transfer from bike to bike until some scroat nicks one, so I'd forgotten them). Popped into my local bike shop (Specialized) where I am a regular customer and know many of the staff. Asked one of the lads if they sold them, he said no, but would get me some free from the back - how many did I need? Like a donut, I just asked for 6.
It was only when I got home I remembered I needed 6 for each end, so the next morning I popped back down, explained to some young lad on the shop floor the situation and asked if I could be cheeky and get another 6? He went and asked another fella, who disappeared out the back, put 6 bolts in a bag and then told me they would be £4.99. £4.99 for 6 little screws! I exclaimed surprise but that was the price he explained as he rang in a miscellaneous sale for £4.99. Knowing it was either that or not ride my new bike for the weekend, I just paid it, attached the rotor and rode.
Its a little thing, but they are now doing the free servicing on the two bike I had bought off them in the month running up to this incident, and I won't be purchasing much from them in the future.
I'm confused. You're upset because you ultimately paid £4.99 for 12 bolts, when you should have paid £10?
How very dare them give you something for free, no wonder you're not going back.
As for the OP sounds like the guy at the till couldn't be arsed to look.
Bolts - yes, I usually give them out for free because I scavenge loads. But it's my business so I can do as I like - an employee doesn't have that freedom, and the shop might have a minimum charge for stuff.
when i worked in the shop - the only person that touched my tools was me - they were my tools , they were how i made my money , i have spent time and money making sure i have good quality tools to do the job.
i dont lend tools to strangers.
Id do odd jobs for people to get them out a bind yes - but id do it - if i dont have time because im up to my eyes in work then thats tough shit. we always had a selection of tools available to buy in the shop if its really that important.
Got burnt too many times in the early days - broken/not returned/misused.
fool me once , shame on you - fool me twice shame on me.
I only needed a 4mm Allen key. You get them free with Tesco's furniture.
Why do people expect bike shops to lend out tools?
What kind of response do you think you'd get if your car broke and you asked a garage to lend you tools???
You get them free with Tesco's furniture.
Next time you know where to go then.
I asked my LBS if they could fit a headset for me. Their response? "Sorry, we're fully booked for 3 weeks, but you can borrow the headset press if you like". Similar story when I needed my steerer shortened: "Really busy but if you just bring the forks in I'll do it while you wait"
Top guys!
I think bike shops are our own worst enemies sometimes - bike shops are the few shops* which are still really personal, often single shops run by the boss with a few assistants, who all work there because they like bikes. We're personal, often more like clubhouses than professional retail outlets.
That means people sometimes get offended when we actually have to make a profit, charge for small things or not lend stuff out - that's the kind of thing businesses do, not clubs.
You wouldn't dream of asking B&Q for a couple of free bolts, or asking the Kwik Fit to lend you a spanner, but that's because they're big companies - they're expected to be impersonal.
*Second-hand bookshops, maybe, or old record stores, but they're dieing out.
I only needed a 4mm Allen key. You get them free with Tesco's furniture.
How many bike shops are fitted out with Tesco furniture?
Having worked/helped out in a few LBS,I can say from experience I/they would always help anyone unless abusive/downright rude ("we're busy try next bike shop?"),you generally just hand over standard quality tool or crappy cheapo bike pump (roadies never carry!)and let 'em get on with it. Often you would do the task yourself and glace in the direction of a charity collection box!. Advice if you need advice/repair in a LBS take a nice packet of biccies!. Being nice usually gets nice back!. 🙂
"we're busy try next bike shop?"
When I was the only bike shop in a big suburb of Glasgow, I felt morally obligated to help people out - now I'm in the city with a normal bike shop 6 doors down I can just tell people to go try them 😉
My LBS has a track pump on a long chain outside the shop for anyone to use.
I have borrowed a extra long socket extender bar from a halfords to secure my car battery when it was loose.
I think it was poor especially as you were a paying customer not someone who had just walked in of the street.
I do not use cycle surgery after them refusing to even look at wheel with a seized bearing I bought in for servicing unless I bought in the entire bike and left it with them, then went to another shop who had the job done in twenty minutes no problem.
I'm confused. You're upset because you ultimately paid £4.99 for 12 bolts, when you should have paid £10?
You think £4.99 is the going rate for 6 rotor bolts? You think that is what price they are in their system (they are not actually even in their system - the first member of staff clarified that for me).
Its all down to attitude and customer service - "I'm sorry, but we can't afford to give you another 6 free, how about a couple of quid, or you purchase some lube or something and we will throw them in?".
From all the stories about people not buying in shops anymore - trying stuff on then heading out on the internet etc, decent customer service, and not being overly picky goes a long way. Especially to customers who have spent a couple of grand in your shop within the last month!
How very dare them give you something for free, no wonder you're not going back.
If you look over there, far, far away in the distance, you might be able to see my point. You are miles away from it.
I hope some of the berks on this thread are in need at some time and don't get assistance. I hope they are not conveniently at a bike shop and get stranded somewhere. It would only be what you deserve 😉
Whys thats then dezb - thats just being a prick.
If i see someone stranded with a puncture or broken chain and ill try and help if i have tools or offer a lift if im going the same direction.
Thats a bit different from a random unknown person asking me to give them my tools for free to do a job when there are various tools for the same job within 2 ft of where their standing for sale.
[i]Whys thats then dezb - thats just being a prick.
[/i]
Nail on the head mate. Exactly what their attitudes suggest they are.
*woosh*
What do you do for a day job..... Do you do it for free ,?
I hope some of the berks on this thread are in need at some time and don't get assistance. I hope they are not conveniently at a bike shop and get stranded somewhere. It would only be what you deserve
That seems to happen to people who don't carry the right tools for the job.
Like the guy I tried to help reseat his burped tyre at Swinley, he still stomped off without a word of thanks, cursing the fact that "no one carried CO2", him included.
There's in a LBS round the corner from me, but I don't like their attitude so I don't go there. I rather ride the opposite direction past a Cycle Surgery and an Evans to give my money to people who seem to give a sh*t.
You think £4.99 is the going rate for 6 rotor bolts?
Well, yes, here's some on CRC, rrp £5 discounted to £2.99
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/mobile/avid-disc-bolts-torq-head-threadlock/rp-prod20302
Far as I can see, you got lucky the first time with the free ones, then had to pay rrp for the 6 further ones...but you're still 'up' comparing the total you paid overall for 12 with what it would cost you on CRC.
Think you bring a bit precious over now saying you won't go back there. Ive bought gear cable, rotor bolts etc to get a build finish...sometimes I get freebies like ferrules thrown in, sometimes I pay rrp but I would never expect freebies, its my fault for being impatient and wanting a build finished
Err, yes, £4.99 for 6 rotor bolts sounds about right. These are the ones we stock, RRP is £3.99 for six:
http://www.fibrax.com/disc-pads-rotors/rotors/rotor-bolts-6
So you've paid £5 for 12 which sounds like a pretty good deal to me. What puzzles me is why you think they should repeatedly give you free stuff? If they were a bit busy would you volunteer an hour of your time to help stack the shelves?
They're owned by Snow and Rock and IMO as a company they're assholes and don't like this sort of publicity.
Don't be surprised if their legal department show up and attempt to get this thread shut this down.
[i]What do you do for a day job..... Do you do it for free ,?[/i]
So, in your mind, you have somehow made this question relevant to what the thread is about... talk about [i]*woosh*[/i] 😆
You think £4.99 is the going rate for 6 rotor bolts?
Shimano rotor bolts are £6.99
I'd have lent you a 4mm allen key though 🙂
Sorry your right the op was about a poorly prepared cyclist, Expecting a freebie, that the guy was going to give you but clearly his lend it bits box had been robbed of all 4 mm allen keys by other freebie expectant cyclists no doubt.
Shimano rotor bolts are £6.99I'd have lent you a 4mm allen key though
So you're the guy that ruins torx head bolts then?
😉
I've spent (like many, I'm not special) many tens of thousands of hard earned over the last 20 years in my LBS. I don't expect discount, but I'm happy to receive it when offered. They tend to give me a discount on everything I buy but I don't expect (and frankly feel a bit cheap) when they offer me discount on stuff under about £30 or £40.
They probably made about £1.60 on that £5 pack of rotor bolts. Forgetting about the free pack, how much do you think they should make on selling you a pack of bolts?
What's fair? Should they offer everything under a fiver free to all their good customers for example?
I wouldn't lend my tools out to anyone. If it was a little job I'd do it for you FOC if allowed.
theres some serious shit talked about on here, the op asked for a lend of a 4mm ak, the op didnt ask to rob the shop of their so called precious tools, 4mm ak wats the cost 50p, if a shop cant afford that to lend to a customer who has just blown £50 in their shop, then they dont deserve any customers,theres a common theme through all this, bikes mechs and their precious tools, ive been a bike mech and an engineering toolmaker by trade, i damn sure if we had a customer asking at our front door for a lend of a 4mm ak, and who had just spent money with our firm we would even hesitate,its just plain n simple shit customer service, and if i were the op, i would of told them to stuff their £50 worth of goods and made the guy give me my money back, which would of taken him longer than it would of to find a 4mm bloody ak, its shops like that, that make people shop on line, with out good customer services all you bike mechs with your precious tools would be out of a job, and im not talking about the people who expect a shop to lend them their whole tool boxes here, it was a 50p 4mm ak.
My Allen keys don't cost 50p - I only buy quality.
the op only wanted to borrow the ak for a ten minute job to get him home, he wasnt expecting the ak to last him a life time,besides that, i dont think it was even about the tools, the salesperson probably just couldnt be arsed to go and look in the workshop. i suppose if the salesperson actually owned the shop their attitude might have been different,when its not your business and your probably on minimum wage, you probably cant blame them.
My point is that I don't keep cheap Allen keys hanging about the workshop. Same with chain tools - the only chain tool I have is a Rohloff one, and no-one uses that but me.
its not so much, cheap allen keys these days, it the shit cheap allen cap bolts that manufacturers keep insisting on fitting out their bikes with that would probably round off first, also it doesnt matter how much you spend on tools, a crap mechanic will always ruin them, which is why i can understand shops not lending out expensive tools, but you have to admit, how petty is it for a shop not to lend the op a 4mm ak, after spending good money in that same shop,any workshop should have at least a few sets of allen keys lying around, especially a bike shop where a 4mm ak is used quite often.
4mm ak wats the cost 50p, if a shop cant afford that to lend to a customer who has just blown £50 in their shop, then they dont deserve any customers
This is my view. Cycle Surgwry have turned from a really good little bike shop into a corporate chain interestedonly inprofit. Which is why I no longer use them, other than to use their customer pump at their Holloway road branch. I won't spend money in there though, because of theur attitude. I understand their staff churn rate is very high; not surprising really.
My point is that I don't keep cheap Allen keys hanging about the workshop.
I don't know what sort of bike shop you rn, but if you don't have a few cheap tools to lend customers who spend money in your shop, then youre not the sort of bike shop i'd do business with. We're not talking about Snap On ratchet sets or Park Headset presses etc, were talking aobut a 50p alen key. If the Op came in and demanded to use the frame alignment jig or facing tool for free, then of course, you'd tell them to get lost. But an allen key? Thats just petty. A good bike shop has some 'sacrificial' tools to lend customers, it's part of a good customer servicce based business model. Offer something the onlinmes can't. And if you dont, then quite frankly, you deserve to fail.
Would have fixed it for him myself, don't lend any tools.
Agree with LoCo - I've usually got an Allen key in my hand, I'd happily tighten up a bolt if someone asked nicely. In fact did that a couple of times today.
Why don't you just get some cheap basic tools to lend customers? What's wrong with that? Are ypu in the busness becasue you love and bleive in promoting cycling, or do you just want to make money.
Because I don't think I've ever lent a tool to someone who has spent money in my shop.
Because I don't think I've ever lent a tool to someone who has spent money in my shop.
Then you'd never get my business. I'd go somewhere else, who would lend me the tool. Are oyu one of those bike shops who woudn't lend someone a set of tyrel levers and a pump, if they'd bought an inner tube from you to fix their puncture?
Ben's 'bikeshop' isn't a bikeshop as you're visualizing it, I think. 😉
Ben's 'bikeshop' isn't a bikeshop as you're visualizing it, I think.
Sow hat sort of 'bike shop' is it then? 😕
