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I know a number of people have made FOI requests to DCC. Has anyone had a response yet? They acknowledged my request and said they'd respond by 23rd November. Looks like they're going to miss that deadline. Have they let anyone else down?
They can clam vexatious requests for failing to respond to FOi requests. I'm too knackered to find a link, but I'm sure it will be easy to find. Which is why some may not be answered.
On the plus side yesterday they repaired some of the potholes I reported 2 weeks ago
Time to report the one on the other side of the road now, didnt want them doing them all at once 😈
A couple of days after I made the request, I had an email telling me when their dead line was. I don't see how they could claim it was vexatious. It related directly to their claim of acting in the interests of public safety.
Morning!
Quick bit of info culled from a pdf which is here [url= http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCEQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fico.org.uk%2F~%2Fmedia%2Fdocuments%2Flibrary%2FFreedom_of_Information%2FDetailed_specialist_guides%2Fdealing-with-vexatious-requests.pdf&ei=eUFwVNz6GcblapjLgMAC&usg=AFQjCNG0GdBpD3Gkhwjyzvlik5__h0MhjA&sig2=M8amcTe64Me96bM1FM4FDg&bvm=bv.80185997,d.d2s&cad=rja ]clickety:[/url]
Under section 14(1) of the Act, public authorities do not have to
comply with vexatious requests. There is no public interest test.
Section 14(1) may be used in a variety of circumstances where a request, or its impact on a public authority, cannot be justified. Whilst public authorities should think carefully before refusing a request as vexatious they should not regard section 14(1) as something which is only to be applied in the most extreme of circumstances.
Section 14(1) can only be applied to the request itself and not the individual who submitted it.
Sometimes a request may be so patently unreasonable or objectionable that it will obviously be vexatious.
In cases where the issue is not clear-cut, the key question to ask is whether the request is likely to cause a disproportionate or unjustified level of disruption, irritation or distress.
This will usually be a matter of objectively judging the evidence of the impact on the authority and weighing this against any evidence about the purpose and value of the request.
The public authority may also take into account the context and history of the request, where this is relevant.
One of the comments on the walking forum
"Re: Rushup Edge destruction :- (
#53519
by Peak Rambler
30 Oct 2014, 21:26
I think the PDNP planners have only one thing in mind, how to increase revenue.
There are many laces in the PDNP where cycling is not permitted, t here are signs stating that (Stanage Edge being one area that springs to mind), but they still cycle through! I'll rephrase that, race through!
I have come across some respectful cyclists, to the point they actually dismount and allow walkers to pass, before moving on at a reasonable speed.
To those few, they are great ambassadors to the mindless.
"
Had an email today relating to the financial ins and outs of what has been going on. I am sure you have all had the same but if not then let me know and I will post the links. Interesting point they made in thesis body of the email was " the area you are referring to is not called Rushup Edge but Chapel Gate" is this correct? So many posts to keep up with I am probably way behind with this info, taken them an age to reply to my email mind.
Yes the entire route is referred to as chapelgate by DCC. Makes it all very easy for them to do the whole stretch in one go without separate "consultations" 😆
The Chapel Gate/Rushup Edge question is an interesting one. My thought is that if they've consulted adequately which they claim they have, then PDNPA wouldn't have been surprised by what they were doing where.
Feels to me like DCC are trying to tag Rushup Edge onto Chapel Gate without anyone noticing. However, a few people might have noticed.
I'm sure someone will pitch in with the correct info but AFAIK the route crosses two parish boundaries and is known as both Chapel Gate and Rushup Edge. I've lived within sight of it for 20 years and as far as everyone I know Chapel Gate was commonly known to stop at the junction with the bridleway from Lords Seat to the road - or Rushup Edge as we know it. There are proper route numbers that identify the rights of way and if DCC had used these in the first place we would all be better informed. (oh and if they had told the public where to find the maps with the numbers - all a bit like having the Vogons as a highways agency)
@johnj2000 - if you can share the links that would be great, we are compiling as much info as possible so every little helps and it would be good not to miss anything.
[url= http://www.derbyshire.gov.uk/council/meetings_decisions/meetings/cabinet/12112013_cabinet.asp ]linky1[/url]
[url= http://www.derbyshire.gov.uk/council/meetings_decisions/meetings_archive/2009_2013_archive/cabinet_meetings/2472012_cabinet.asp ]linky2[/url]
[url= http://www.derbyshire.gov.uk/council/meetings_decisions/meetings_archive/2009_2013_archive/cabinet_meetings/2912013_cabinet.asp ]linky3[/url]
[url= http://www.derbyshire.gov.uk/leisure/countryside/access/latest-work/chapel-gate/default.asp ]linky4[/url]
There you go Roger
@john, this bit always makes me chuckle "Currently, many people are unable to use Chapel Gate because of the rocky 'steps' which have evolved due to damage over time."
I know! Imagine being face by the those rocky steps as you round the corner, freak you right out 😉
I am now imagining poor people in therapy due to the trauma the rocky steps have inflicted upon them
It's the shock after passing through the waist deep lagoon on the top of Lord's Seat at the top of Rushup Edge. At least they are already sodden from the waist down so no one will see an expanding damp patch!!
Do you mean those rock steps that are a completely natural feature, the kind of thing that you would expect to see in the peak district?
Other proposed changes by DCC are an escalator to the top of kinder scout and all climbing routes on Stanage edge to have ladders installed so that as many people as possible can use them.
I've had a reply from DCC, only taken 20 days
The source of the stone is according to DCC:
The gritstone used to date to regulate out the steps on Chapelgate has been provided by Marchington Stone.
A quick Google shows that they are based in Disley
The Rucksack Club - founded in Manchester in 1902 - have got behind the Peak District MTB Rushup Edge campaign. It's fantastic to get support beyond the mountain bike community 🙂
[url= http://www.peakdistrictmtb.org/index.php/58-the-rucksack-club-show-their-support ]More info[/url]
Nice work tortoise.
I am very concerned though that DCC are just going through the motions, that the right buttons were pressed to get them to pause the work, but not the right buttons to get them to reverse the damage that has been done. I can't help but feel that we need to increase the noise again in the build up to the meeting with DCC. I don't want DCC to think that people have got over the initial shock and have started to accept it. I remain very upset, angry and fearful for the future of mountain biking in the peak district.
I remain very upset, angry and fearful for the future of mountain biking in the peak district.
Couldn't agree more.
fasternotfatter - you make a valid point. We have plans for something on Monday. Not to be naive, but we have to go into this meeting believing DCC have good intentions; not blinkered, not in some rainbow and unicorns way expecting to come out holding hands and skipping with them, but that they have the intention to change something.
If they don't, then yes it's back to the 'make as much noise as possible' plan.
All that said, who are we to stop you making your voice heard on their social media?
Was horrible riding down there today really missed how it was before. Noticed that chapel gate repairs were not looking very good!
It's the big meeting with Derbyshire County Council tomorrow. Peak District MTB, Ride Sheffield, Friends of the Peak, BMC and Keeper of the Peak going to have a word
Good luck! Anything less than a reversal of the work carried out is a declaration of war on mountain biking 😈
It would be nice if we could shoot for rushup edge being reinstated.
Fingers crossed
The day of the big meeting is upon us. Off to see DCC this morning in very good company and we are well prepared. We will post our feedback from the meeting on the PDMTB website and in here. Thanks to everyone for your support.
Have a virtual clap and a pat on the back from me as you head at the door!
Don't forget to do that tiger thing in the mirror 😉
Thanks so far for all your and the wider team's efforts.
Good luck Roger and all involved hope it's goes well
Good luck chaps and a massive thanks for all your hard work 😀
Indeed. Best of British to you (us) all. May the little guy be victorious over the establishment.
Evening folks. Well, it's been a long day. Very interesting, at times heated, but overall useful meeting with DCC. For more details, go to
Peakdistrictmtb.org
A good effort from all involved.
Not a good response from DCC though. They seem to think that landscaping the peak district is acceptable and it just isn't. I feel for people that can't access certain areas of the peak but I don't think they should flatten everything to make it accessible to all. It should be left in a natural state so it can be appreciated for what it is, an area of outstanding natural beauty.
It isn't all bad though you should be able to hit some serious speed down there now though, and with some judicious digging, adding a bit of a jump here and there it should still be very challenging.
[url= http://peakdistrictmtb.org/ ]CLicky link to make things easier[/url]
Well done to all concerned
Obviously disappointed that DCC still insists on covering the steps. But if they don't have to abide by the wishes of the PDNPA then I guess the wishes of user groups will have even less weight. I guess it's a question of who has responsibility (and liability) and DCC are the highways agency.
Good luck with Hurst Clough - even if DCC agree to consult I can't imagine they will agree to anything less than a smooth track there
Just caught up with this thanks for putting in your time and being motivated enough to take action. .
and DCC are the highways [s]agency[/s] authority
FTFY
But if they don't have to abide by the wishes of the PDNPA then I guess the wishes of user groups will have even less weight. I guess it's a question of who has responsibility (and liability) and DCC are the highways agency.
This is what I want to know more about. Is that really the ultimate whip hand that DCC beats PDNPA down with to get their way? If so that needs addressing and vehemently arguing against and requires PDNPA to not rollover and take it in the bottom.
I think the only way forward is to get the press/ tv on to this its amazing how bad press makes things happen!!
Dissapointing outcome so far..no doubt you guys are thinking strategy here, my read is that we need to continue to be joined up, articulate and influencing those who influence DCC. Likely a long job but keep up the pressure and be ready to make lots of noise at appropriate points!
From an initially dismissive Derbyshire County Council we now have an apologetic Derbyshire County Council. I don't think anyone is under the illusion that this is anything but a long haul but I'd say that is a positive outcome. We've shown the weight of anger and support behind the Rushup Edge campaign cannot be ignored by them.
If all mountain hikers boycott the area for 2015 the revenue that the area loses would force the issue. Or would that mean they won?
An apologetic DCC doesn't make up for a destroyed rushup edge. Trip to the lakes anyone? I am done with the peak district.
I'll not rise to the obvious troll! :p
It's as Stilltortoise quite rightly points out - it's the long route, I was at a meeting last night with all the interested parties in mountain biking held at the NT Longshaw Estate - the attendee list was impressive: NT, PDNPA, BC, CTC, Sport Derbyshire, the local LAF, Ride Sheffield, PDMTB, Chinley Churners, Hope Sports, I think that was everyone. The general consensus is that we need to come together and have a collective voice for mountain bikers.
Someone said to me at one of the many meetings I seem to suddenly be attending, that we are the invisible visitors. People see walkers because the are everywhere, roadies are - well all over the roads, paragliders are visible overhead. We arrive and promptly disappear from sight as we bugger off up some muddy track. We have only just made it onto the DCC radar as a grown up and large user group.
We are trying to sort a post DCC meeting meeting (I may yet kill myself) to look at the next step. All is not lost on Rushup, it has not been completely buried, the steps are being levelled but we have an engineers report that contests the longevity of the methodology and we are awaiting a response from DCC to our rebuttal document - copy on the PDMTB website to download.
It's taken a lot of effort to get this far, the momentum is growing. If you want to chuck in the towel because of some work on one route then fine, but there's lots of us who will continue to fight our corner because there is still plenty of good trails round here and with a little work there could be many more.