So you’re not likely to get stranded unable to get it to inflate with a hand pump
Sadly, not my experience. I managed to break the bead during one puncture 'event'. It was funny tho. Our Club tubeless zealot had a tubeless puncture, didn't have a spare - had to borrow a tube, ran out of puff in his electric doo da - had to borrow a mini pump... Whilst this was going on, I punctured whilst stationary and broke the bead. I had a spare tube and mini pump so no drama apart from savaged fingers finding all the thorns from previous spontaneous repairs...
I've tried it, it kind of worked. But despite what others have said, I did get covered in sealant, sometimes you can't just stop! Cleaning sealant off bike, kit and legs hairs was a much bigger hassle, than <5mins to swap out a tube. The dried selant is hard to get off the frame once covered in dust.
Inner tubes take no time to swap.
I'm on Ridenow TPU, they're brilliant, and if you buy a few at a time direct from Ali, they're cheap as chips (£3.41 today)
They roll fast inside Conti GP5K, really nice.
They're tiny too, so carrying 2/3 spares is easy. And if you do puncture one, they wrap up so small it's easier popping that in your jersey pocket, than a mucky old butyl tube (which are bulky).
TPU is the answer.
Sadly, not my experience. I managed to break the bead during one puncture ‘event’.
Yea, IME my Shimano wheels (no tape) will grip the bead tenaciously.
The stans (taped) aren't so great.
On the tubed boiks, I’m still using Supersonics at ~50g. TPU’s can’t be that much lighter?Shirley being able to glue a patch if required is worth a few grammes?
~25g
They come with a set of glueless patches.
They don't lose any measurable pressure over a few days (at least when new).
Half the price (from China).
The other big advantage is they don't spontaneously deflate like butyl tubes. If you get a thorn it tends to then go down slowly over 5-10miles. The material is relatively inelastic so once inflated to the size of the tyre it holds that shape. So when it gets a hole in it the material isn't under tension and doesn't pull that hole open. The downside of that is it makes finding the hole more difficult as the hole is smaller and you can't just over-inflate the tube and listen for the hiss.
And touch wood I've not had any valve stems rip out of the tube which seemed to be a routine occurrence with supersonics. I eventually settled on the Michelin versions (ultralight?) which were more like 70g and a bit more durable.
It's a 3rd option really. A different set of benefits and drawbacks than either tubeless or butyl tubes.
I’ve tried it, it kind of worked. But despite what others have said, I did get covered in sealant, sometimes you can’t just stop! Cleaning sealant off bike, kit and legs hairs was a much bigger hassle, than <5mins to swap out a tube. The dried selant is hard to get off the frame once covered in dust.
IPA is good for getting it off.
IPA is good for getting dry sealant off, especially where it stains rims.
I agree though, tubes are at least a consistent faff. It's almost always going to be the same ~5minute job to swap one.
Tubeless is trading that 5minutes but more regular faffing for an occasional utter PITA.
If you get a thorn it tends to then go down slowly over 5-10miles.
I have had this experience too. If punctured, they deflate really slowy, to the point that you're thinking..is it soft...not sure..eventually it is obvious it's going down.
With good quality modern tyres, I find that road punctures are very rare and are easily fixed when they do happen, so I have never seen a compelling reason to go tubeless. I run 28mm tyres with conventional butyl tubes. I think the benefits for mtb/gravel are much clearer, and I have been running tubeless off road for 15 years.
Inner tubes take no time to swap.
Inner tubes take significantly more time to swap than not getting punctures in the first place, and if you do puncture tubeless, it's not really more time putting a tube in than it would be to swap a tube.
They come with a set of glueless patches.
I haven't had a huge amount of success patching TPU tubes, and zero success with the included RideNow patches. I guess they might hold long enough in an emergency to get you home, but I've not had one hold even overnight.
The downside of that is it makes finding the hole more difficult as the hole is smaller and you can’t just over-inflate the tube and listen for the hiss.
That's the other thing for me, you pretty much have to find punctures in a basin of water.
For me, spares are butyl because I don't rate TPU tubes as being field repairable, and I worry about having more punctures than tubes.
Downsides are it’s a pain in the arse to fit
I've had road tubeless ever since Schwalbe started doing it with their Tubeless Easy Pro Ones (2015?). Whether they are genuinely "easy" for every wheel or I just lucked out with mine (mavic ksyrium elite) but I've always been able to take them on/off with just my hands, so there's zero downside/faff for me! Less chance of a puncture (the only one I remember having was when all the sealant had totally dried out, now I just add more occasionally!), lower pressure, more comfortable/more efficient, what's not to like 🙂 Would not go back.
Inner tubes take significantly more time to swap than not getting punctures in the first place, and if you do puncture tubeless, it’s not really more time putting a tube in than it would be to swap a tube.
Except for:
giving in to a tube mid ride is messy and needs the tyre carcass carefully inspecting (usually with your fingers) for previously unseen, repaired incursions. It can be a real pain – literally.
I had a spare tube and mini pump so no drama apart from savaged fingers finding all the thorns from previous spontaneous repairs…
Unless the tyre is still fairly new then you can't just put a tube in. It's a slow, messy, faffy process pulling out all those thorns, especially as they'll have been ground down into the tyre so you have to push them out from the inside with tools.
Although I have wondered if one of those tyre liner strips would make a good emergency repair, one of those and a TPU tube wouldn't weigh much more than a full-fat butyl and probably more likely to work.
It’s a slow, messy, faffy process pulling out all those thorns
I mean, it's a bit messier, granted, but you still have to remove all the thorns if you're swapping a tube, and tubeless has obviously saved you from having to change a number of tubes beforehand.
Out of interest, what’s your issue with them?
Fitted carefully as per instructions, with barely a puff of air just to hold shape, by hand, no tyre levers or pinching. Brand new wheels and tyres.
One leaked immediately from the base of the valve stem at a split. One leaked at the overlap/joint and the other had mysterious pinholes around the inner face (rim tape face) despite no debris (new wheels and tubes, checked and wiped before install).
I wasn't inclined to send her out on the 4th so went for old faithful, which she completed coast to coast on with no issues. Perhaps she'd have been a minute or two quicker with Ride Now. Or an hour or two slower. Wasn't worth the risk!
If I end up with a tubeless mess or faff I might give then a go in my tubeless tyres but so far happy carrying a 50g butyl supersonic as a spare.
I mean, it’s a bit messier, granted, but you still have to remove all the thorns if you’re swapping a tube, and tubeless has obviously saved you from having to change a number of tubes beforehand.
Yea, but there's only ever 1 at a time.
And IME when a tubeless tyre doesn't seal the process is actually:
Pump it up and hope
Pump it up and hope again
Plug it and pump it up
Pump it up one last time
Give up and put a tube in having removed the biggest thorn in the carcass and not looked for more as by this point the whole group is cold and pissed off and you're trying to hurry up
Give up entirely having missed the other 6 and getting another flat tyre a few miles later.
Like I said, it's a different set of risks and faff's.
And regardless it's a small risk either way, Maybe 1 puncture every ~500km this time of year, less in summer? So an almost guaranteed 5-minute fix Vs a potential walk/taxi. I'll have tubeless again next month, not even any doubts over it as the bulk of the riding will be club runs and little over 200km. But for a 1000km Audax I'm not sure, my current thinking is a new set of tyres for the event regardless and probably TPU tubes because although it'll cost me time it should mean I finish. Or the double bagging approach, new tubeless tyres so if they do fail it'll be quicker to sort with a tube.
But for a 1000km Audax I’m not sure, my current thinking is a new set of tyres for the event regardless and probably TPU tubes because although it’ll cost me time it should mean I finish.
Funnily, longer rides are where I'm absolutely on tubeless. Wouldn't even consider tubes any more.
And IME when a tubeless tyre doesn’t seal the process is actually:
Pump it up and hope
Pump it up and hope again
Plug it and pump it up
Pump it up one last time
Give up and put a tube in having removed the biggest thorn in the carcass and not looked for more as by this point the whole group is cold and pissed off and you’re trying to hurry up
Give up entirely having missed the other 6 and getting another flat tyre a few miles later.
Ha! This my experience too. It either seals immediately or you're in for a world of pain. You get all belligerent/Mr Bean with it 'you will bloody seal...' etc. Then having faffed and fiddled for ages, spoilt your ride and lost ya pals, you give in to the inevitable and start getting sticky... I also have used tubeless off road since the days of ghetto and now, most of the time for gravel. I'm just not convinced the case is 100% black and white for road. Call me Mr Ambivalent if you will 🙂
Not going back to tubes. Actually it's over a decade since i rode tubes on the road, I used the biggest tubulars that'd fit in my frame until I hung up the road bike just prior to covid. Used tubeless on my MTB and gravel bike.
Back on the road now, and tubeless just works. Nobody I ride with uses tubes either. Winter setup is Schwalbe Pro One TLE with Decathlon own brand sealant, 4-500km a week, maybe there's a massive gotcha around the corner.
Disclaimer - there are neither hedgerows nor flint around here. My usual source of punctures is glass when riding into or out of town. On tubulars I would wipe down the tyres, deflate, and squeeze those small cuts to pick out the little bit of glass or stone that was working its way towards the inner sanctum, but now I don't even see the point of that.
I tried it on 25mm and 28mm tyres a good few years ago and it basically didn't work.
I gather the technology has moved on a bit now with the rims, tyres and sealants so I'm interested to give it another try on my next bike. I'm curious if the tubeless naysayers on this thread have tried road tubeless recently or if their opinion is based on the older less effective tech (like mine was).
