[Closed] Road bikes with disks are ugly?

Why do people think power is the only benefit of disc brakes?

Why do people think power is the only benefit of disc brakes?

Shortsightedness

They're ugly and unsightly and a pita to change/maintain and I can't see them heading that way for racing for a good number of years yet, if ever.
Hey ho

No more a pain than setting up pads onto a rim if you have a modicum of skill

Trimming hydraulic brakes hoses is a more involved job than trimming mechanical cables, there's no question of that. Mechanical sets don't need bled either or suffer from leaking seals etc. There's less maintenance required no matter your skill level.

I know pro racing tends to drive the development of road bikes, However, in this case it should be the needs of the public that should drive the development of the type of bikes they will be buying.

here is mine

it’s not exactly a looker is it?

The public don't need disc brakes on road bikes

Some of us do.

Have you honestly never tried to brake whilst going down a 1:5 in pouring rain and had nothing happen? I'd love a simple pad change to go from nothing to disc-like stopping power, but extensive experience with cantis on MTBs has left me sceptical.

As for being market driven - I've been wishing for road discs for years, just search my forum history.

There's been a few times on the road where I've wanted better brakes but they've either been on a CX bike with cantis or a 30 year old road bike with 30 year old brakes and wheels. On my nice road bike with Campag brakes braking has never been a problem. I am totally convinced that it's not discs that are the answer, just that cheap brakes don't tend to be very good.

I've also never had my road brakes fade on a long alpine descents, unlike some disc brakes on a mountain bike.

With molgrips on this - I've wanted discs for a number of years since knackering a rim when some swarf/metal from the road got stuck in my brake block and scored the rim track badly. Thankfully it was a cheap wheelset.

Hand strength can make the difference. A mate, who is at least 6 stone heavier than me with identical brakes, lever and blocks stops significantly faster than me. Like a cars length at 15mph when I shout stop when we are riding side by side. I put that down to short stubby fingers that can only just reach the levers and thus don't get a decent pull. Throw in the fact that this means that I have to cover them more which means aches on long descents and it is absolutely no contest.
I don't see the rim issue a big thing although I have worn through several. 10k miles isn't too bad every 2 year per bike .ie 5 k per year each. Its meant a front rim a year and a rear one every two spread over two bikes.

Good to see Spec and Trek heading in different directions...

The public don't need disc brakes on road bikes.

Just done a wet Fred Whitton on discs. The gap between me and the rim brake crowd was just enormous. If you think you don't need discs that's fine, but you won't keep up with me 😉

I last wished for brakes on a tight 1:4 country lane with sharp bends, no sight and finishing on a T junction with a busy road. The kind of thing you don't get in races.

there are obviously a lot of fair weather riders here who are only basing "my rim brakes are just as good as discs" on the fact that they only ride when the sun shines, if you ride in all weathers on the rough muck strewn roads that some of us ride on you'd bend over backwards for brakes that aren't affected by those conditions

as a rider who has topped out at 23 stone (now 18.5), and who has always toured on and offroad, i can say, without a shadow of doubt, that disc brakes on any bike are by far the best upgrade/bit of kit that money can buy.
show me a man who would go back to vee's or cantis, and i will show you a idiot...... 😀

Or people who never need to do emergency stops when it's wet.

Ton - I have to say that the Vs on my commuter are remarkably good. I've ridden it with 25kg on the back and never had any trouble stopping wet or dry. Well - apart from the usual few revolutions of nothing you get in proper wet weather with rim brakes. However - they eat pads when it's wet and need adjusting between pad changes, and they still aren't as good as discs. So I'd upgrade to discs in a shot if I had mounts on the frame and forks.

Finally, a decent looking racing bike... The new S-Works Tarmac.

[img] [/img]

Proper angles and a stem that's not mounted on a foot of spacers and pointing skywards...

Just done a wet Fred Whitton on discs. The gap between me and the rim brake crowd was just enormous. If you think you don't need discs that's fine, but you won't keep up with me

I recently upgraded my CX bike. Went from a canti-braked one to a disc one. First day out was a nice gentle spin to bed the discs in and get used to it all. Next day I went down Winnats Pass - I don't especially like it as a descent but needs must. About 10 seconds in front of me was a guy on a road bike. Now I'm no demon descender; quite the opposite in fact. But before the bend 2/3rds of the way I'd caught him easily. He was having to drag his rim brakes all the way down to moderate his speed. I could let the brakes off completely and one tap of the levers would bring it back instantly. No skidding, no locked wheels, just instant consistent reliable power.

Can't believe people are still coming up with the same arguments that were made about discs on the MTB scene 15 years ago...

a stem that's not mounted on a foot of spacers and pointing skywards...

No, but the STIs are looking that way.

If you think you don't need discs that's fine, but you won't keep up with me

U is awesomnez 😆

[quote=bails ]

Indeed, which is why rim brakes don't rely on that. I've never had to replace a rim on a road bike due to brake wear

No - here's what I was replying to:

To have a braking system that relies on wearing away a fundamental structural element of the bike each time they are used is ridiculous.

Rim brakes don't rely on wearing away the rim - that is just a side effect in some conditions - they would work just fine if the rim was a totally non-wear surface. In most conditions the rim wear on a road bike is actually negligible - it's the pads which wear as they're the part which is designed to. Nothing at all ridiculous about brakes acting there - in a weight conscious situation it makes sense for parts to have multiple uses where possible.

That doesn't mean that I'm claiming rims don't wear - I've worn them out on MTBs and CX bikes, but not on road bikes, though I can understand some people do, it's far from common.

[quote=molgrips ]Have you honestly never tried to brake whilst going down a 1:5 in pouring rain and had nothing happen?

Nope. I've done that and had my brakes work fine though.

[quote=crazy-legs ]Finally, a decent looking racing bike... The new S-Works Tarmac.

Probably the nicest looking on this thread, though that's not really saying much. Honestly though, it would look better with rim brakes, wouldn't it?

Next day I went down Winnats Pass - I don't especially like it as a descent but needs must. About 10 seconds in front of me was a guy on a road bike. Now I'm no demon descender; quite the opposite in fact. But before the bend 2/3rds of the way I'd caught him easily. He was having to drag his rim brakes all the way down to moderate his speed. I could let the brakes off completely and one tap of the levers would bring it back instantly. No skidding, no locked wheels, just instant consistent reliable power.

Nice anecdote. Clearly if he was dragging all the way down he was a worse descender than you. Can't say I've ever had a problem with getting rim brakes to slow me down for the corners on a road like that - if anything on that sort of descent you're even more limited by the geometry, so any half decent brake ought to be able to slow you down just as fast.

Can't believe people are still coming up with the same arguments that were made about discs on the MTB scene 15 years ago...

I can't believe people still don't understand the difference between MTB and road in terms of the impact on rim braking. I don't very often ride a road bike through the sort of mud which convinced me discs were a good idea on a MTB (which was 14 years ago, at which point discs were still extremely uncommon).

Went from a canti-braked one to a disc one.

well there's your problem. Cantis on CX bikes do tend to be a bit rubbish on the road. Proper road brakes like these not only look stunning but work very very well, yes, even in the rain:

[img] [/img]

Everyone complaining needs to invest in some better brake blocks.

I have Swisstop green pads on ultegra calipers. Disc brakes are better.

I'm seriously considering one of those Orbea Avants for my next bike.

I've done that and had my brakes work fine though.

I doubt it. Your criteria for 'good braking' are clearly different from mine.

What are these miracle brakes and pads you use that can vapourise water instantly?

Are [url= http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/shimano-ultegra-6810-brakes/rp-prod108759 ]these Ultegra ones[/url] miracle brakes?

Everyone complaining needs to invest in some better brake blocks.

shiny road bike: i've got swissstop green pads, in 105 calipers.

commuter: ancient bb5's, with neglected cables, and the cheapest pads i could buy.

guess which bike has great brakes?

(clue: it's not 'both of them')

rOcKeTdOg - Member
there are obviously a lot of fair weather riders here who are only basing "my rim brakes are just as good as discs" on the fact that they only ride when the sun shines, if you ride in all weathers on the rough muck strewn roads that some of us ride on you'd bend over backwards for brakes that aren't affected by those conditions

Hmmmm.. some ride when its dry and fine, some like me ride all year in the Downs where I can g'tee the lanes are not "fine and dry", far from it.
Anyway, looks like this thread contains a few who commute or only occasionally ride road bikes and would prefer if all road bikes came with disks (based upon thier own MTB's or background/attitude)
Oh well, off you go on your Sportive or Endurance bikes then, bothers me not, if you enjoy riding bikes thats all that matters. But, but trying to proclaim "ALL" road bikes shoud come with discs is a bit like saying we should all like eating Artichokes...

Ride what ya like.

That spesh Tarmac looks nice but easily pass for a chinese carbon job !!!

Anyway, looks like this thread contains a few who commute or only occasionally ride road bikes and would prefer if all road bikes came with disks

Lol.. you're surely not including me in that? I don't give a flying **** if all bikes came with discs (what a bizarre thing to say) nor do I care what anyone else uses - I just want discs for my bike. If I were shopping for a new road bike I'd get one with discs. Because (unless I've managed to avoid these secret amazing brakes and pads in all my years of cycling) they work better. That's it.

Anyway - what brakes do you have on your road bikes, bikebouy and aracer?

If you want to ride on the road and still have discs but a CX bike with discs. The option is there.

Anyway, looks like this thread contains a few who commute or only occasionally ride road bikes and would prefer if all road bikes came with disks (based upon thier own MTB's or background/attitude)

I ride road bikes through winter, through the night and in all weathers. I would prefer my next bike to have discs, because they are better. I suppose if you get your turbo trainer out at the first sign of rain, then it's less of an issue.

As an aside, I found Alpine descents in the dry were absolutely fine with calipers, but cruddy UK lanes in the middle of winter? Discs every time.

molgrips - Member

Anyway, looks like this thread contains a few who commute or only occasionally ride road bikes and would prefer if all road bikes came with disks

Lol.. you're surely not including me in that? I don't give a flying **** if all bikes came with discs (what a bizarre thing to say) nor do I care what anyone else uses - I just want discs for my bike. If I were shopping for a new road bike I'd get one with discs. Because (unless I've managed to avoid these secret amazing brakes and pads in all my years of cycling) they work better. That's it.

Anyway - what brakes do you have on your road bikes, bikebouy and aracer?

SRAM Red 22 with Swisstop Yellows on Carbone M40C's, been stopping mighty fine thanks.

If you want discs for your roadie, buy a bike with them on no one's stopping you there, certainly not me.

From my POV the threads being hijacked by the "you must have discs on your roadie from now on because I say they're betterer" It's tosh and a very single minded POV.. but hey this is STW.

No-one's said anything of the sort ffs. Lots of people saying they want the option, and others saying 'the public' don't need that option.

So completely the opposite of what you've said.

bikebouy - Member

From my POV the threads being hijacked by the "you must have discs on your roadie from now on because I say they're betterer" It's tosh and a very single minded POV.. but hey this is STW.

have you been reading a different thread?

THIS thread started off as a 'let's look at some shiney new bikes' thread; before being hijacked by the "i don't like or need discs, so nor should you" brigade...

THIS thread started off as a 'let's look at some shiney new bikes' thread; before being hijacked by the "i don't like or need discs, so nor should you" brigade...

Yup.

"If you think discs are better, you're not trying hard enough."

then

"If you don't think discs are better, you're not trying hard enough."

THIS thread started off as a 'let's look at some shiney new bikes' thread; before being hijacked by the "i don't like or need discs, so nor should you" brigade...

It started as a not all road bikes with discs are ugly discussion, and if this thread has proved one thing, it has proved that they are.

It started as a not all road bikes with discs are ugly discussion, and if this thread has proved one thing, it has proved that they are.

In your opinion.

Not really looked at this in any great detail but how many disc compatible Road frames/forks still come with a bridge/drilling to take a rim calliper?

I only ask because thinking back a decade or so in MTBs, the transition from V-brakes to discs was helped along by manufacturers selling their lower price point bikes with both ISO disc and V/Canti posts on the frames, and that would be even easier on road bikes, OK you'd need 135mm rear spacing but the rear spacing isn't dictated by the UCI is it?

So such hypothetical frames would be UCI competition compliant if you fitted rim brakes, and if/when discs were allowed you have the option of either on the same frame...

From looking at the publicity shots of the "Tarmac", "Secteur", "Domain" and other "Flagship" disc brake models it seems they've not considered "Backwards compatibility"... I reckon they might be hampering their own efforts to get the things adopted TBH...

Or is I talking Mental?

Not really looked at this in any great detail but how many disc compatible Road frames/forks still come with a bridge/drilling to take a rim calliper?

The Orbea Avant does, though the rear caliper is direct mount on the chainstay.

Just depends whether you like the beauty of an uncluttered hub, or uncluttered fork crown and stays.

Given that the rear hub is pretty cluttered anyway, you've got a 2/1 win for discs on the clutter front.

we should all like eating Artichokes

I love artichokes

Artichokes make me fart something rotten.

Not sure what that has to do with discs on road bikes, but just thought I'd let you know.

I do too.

Ok, maybe I've gone off on a tangent, not the first time. But I thought I read the thread well enough to comment.

Wouldn't the addition of a disc on the front inhibbit the wheelie option? You know with all that weight up front??

Just sayin. 😛

Or is I talking Mental?

Just depends whether you like the beauty of an uncluttered hub, or uncluttered fork crown and stays.

bikebouy - Member

Wouldn't the addition of a disc on the front inhibbit the wheelie option? You know with all that weight up front??

Just sayin.

1) i'm rubbish at wheelies.

2) my commuter has disc brakes.

3) i can wheelie my commuter for several metres at a time.

conclusion: road bikes with discs are easier to wheelie than mountain bikes, maybe...

I can't wheelie at all.. 😆

obviously you need a road bike with disc brakes.

Cheers jameso, I can see the logic there, the CDF is perhaps a different market to the latest bunch of big brand, disc specific road bikes, the point about clutter is probably the main thing more than the two 6" stainless steel disc stuck to either hub Roadies won't be keen on lots of Cable/hoses all over the shop...

Aesthetically "Clean" bikes generally appeal more, TBH hydraulic, hidden rim brakes should have a better chance in that respect but I doubt they'll take the market by storm...

nedrapier - Member
Just depends whether you like the beauty of an uncluttered hub, or uncluttered fork crown and stays.
Given that the rear hub is pretty cluttered anyway, you've got a 2/1 win for discs on the clutter front.
POSTED 38 MINUTES AGO # REPORT-POST

Using that logic, the new crop of aero frames with hidden calipers trump the lot.

CDF is a different kind of bike yes, I think the logic still works though as I did consider the same 'feature' on a recent Alu framed disc bike for Pinnacle - came to the same conclusions 6 or 7 years later, rightly or wrongly. For a carbon frame it makes more sense, for current market conditions having made a frame work with both would have saved the cost of a set of molds, but I think most brands now see a clear line between disc and non-disc road bikes, non-disc is fast becoming the mark of a race-spec bike or a lighter bike where gearing / frame+fork spec VFM is important, discs for anything else a drop-bar bike can do.
I don't think aesthetics come into it, there's good examples of both now (ie I think that new Spesh looks fantastic, fwiw)

Using that logic, the new crop of aero frames with hidden calipers trump the lot.

Several of them have rubbish (but aero!) braking as a result...

I don't think aesthetics come into it, there's good examples of both now (ie I think that new Spesh looks fantastic, fwiw)

+1, I'd love one of those.

My main worry about discs is that they haven't been around for long (on road bikes, obvs), I think it's still early days to be able to offer real guarantees about how they'll hold up in all conditions.

Give them a couple of years to sort out any bugs, and the clear advantages disks have (better control/modulation, less maintenance) will lead to the death of callipers.

They may not have been in use widely but I reckon they've been in use long enough that the major issues (though I can't really think of any) have been found. BB7 roads have loads of miles behind them for example.

You're talking more specifically of hydraulic versions I reckon, a la SRAM which unquestionably are new.

You're talking more specifically of hydraulic versions I reckon, a la SRAM which unquestionably are new.

Sorry, should have been clearer - yes: I'm talking about the hydraulic ones.

And that's sort of a fair point though it still looks like that was an issue of specing seals that weren't up to the job rather than a fundamental issue. After all, they're essentially no different to mtb brakes.

I think it's still early days to be able to offer real guarantees about how they'll hold up in all conditions.

Aren't Shimano making them? Who have quite a lot of experience making disc brakes to be fair.

So do SRAM, though. And weren't there problems with the first generation of "Ice Tech" rotors that Shimano brought out?

So do SRAM, though.

Avid disc brakes aren't known for being reliable, are they?

Dunno, always used Shimano 🙂

Well the SRAM 2014 disc equiped bikes had to be recalled (my TCX Advanced1 is part of the recall... and still waiting 5 months on.... cough) because they blew a seal at -6C when the Euro CX boys started treating the brakes with less respect than SRAM thought they ought to.
We've all been assured the 2015 set will be sorted out and well, work propers like, yet until we receive them, we can't tell and our bikes sit lonely in the corner of the spare bedroom whilst SRAM sit drinking coffee.

It's a little annoying to say the least, but a plus point is that my SRAM Red22 equiped roadie has been rattling on fine and dandy in the Downs.

Sometimes (most of the time) simple things just work.

Be prepared for another recall or two I say. 😉

Those with discs, what pad life are you getting?
I did a big day in the Pyrenees last year, four cols in horrendous weather and the front pads were almost on the wear limit at the end. Had I been using discs, would I have had to change pads on the road? Not trolling, just curious as I've done a pair of MTB pads in a day in gritty conditions.

I have a bike for wet weather riding commuting and the winter it has disks because they work great when the weather is filthy and I have 15kgs of groceries on my back.

I have a lovely road bike that only ever gets used in the summer for unloaded riding, it certainly doesn't need disks even Zero Gravity brakes seem to be enough to stop even my level of fat incompetence in dry conditions.

IME it's the grit that kills MTB pads when it's wet enough for a film of water to sit between pad and disc holding grit. I doubt you'd see than on road ever.

Short answer for me is "loads" I recently swapped calipers from BB7s to TRP Spyres and expected the BB7s to be worn nearly to the pad and they're 50% worn I reckon. That's at least 2 years' use on and off road (it's a winter road bike and CX bike)

bob_summers - Member

Those with discs, what pad life are you getting?

about 5000km hilly commuting - about 1 year.

or, just doing some maths...

about 1000x 25-0 (mph) stops.

(i live at the top of a big hill, there are lots of traffic lights / junctions between me and the bottom of the hill)

yeah I get about a year on the commuter. It's not an issue in the slightest.

just to illustrate the difference, in 2013 I rode the Fred Whitton on a Giant TCR with rim brakes and descended Wrynose in the wet in 4.07 mins. This year I also descended it in the wet but this time I ran hydro discs. My time was 3.07.

This isn't willy waving. I'm just trying to interject some objectivity into this. Discs are faster, and thus safer.

Bit more tech detail on the Tarmac disc. I must say it looks on paper and pic, pretty good.
http://www.bikeradar.com/road/news/article/specialized-tarmac-disc-and-new-rim-brake-tarmac-released-40998/

just to illustrate the difference, in 2013 I rode the Fred Whitton on a Giant TCR with rim brakes and descended Wrynose in the wet in 4.07 mins. This year I also descended it in the wet but this time I ran hydro discs. My time was 3.07.

This isn't willy waving. I'm just trying to interject some objectivity into this. Discs are faster, and thus safer.

It shows absolutely nothing as you've ridden the course before and know what's coming up. There is no way that using disc brakes account for over 1 minute of difference on such a short descent.

The problem with the tarmac, (apart from the fact that's pretty plain looking) is that the rim braked one looks better.

This is the old one but the point stands. http://www.flickr.com/photos/mariohartmanncom/4510814848/in/photostream/

It shows absolutely nothing

well it shows I was quicker on the disc bike in the wet....

On a different day with non-identical conditions, different riders around you - oh and as wnb mentions different levels of experience. Not exactly a double blind trial is it?

There is no way that using disc brakes account for over 1 minute of difference on such a short descent.

Yes there is. If your brakes are shite you can't gain speed, cos you know you're not going to be able to lose it again so you have to mince.

BORING

Thread is about aesthetics, it does not require logic.

Yeah, but the title of the thread has already been well proven, so the disc brake disciples are having to try and prove there is some point to them.

Bless. I still think disc brakes look cleaner then fussy old calipers.

[img] https://www.flickr.com/photos/pjsaevans/13985949350/ ][img] https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7331/13985949350_ed3623456d.jp g" target="_blank">https://www.flickr.com/photos/pjsaevans/13985949350/ ][img] https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7331/13985949350_ed3623456d.jp g"/> [/img][/url] [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/pjsaevans/13985949350/ ]image[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/people/pjsaevans/ ]N Paul Evans[/url], on Flickr[/img]

I bought this with the 2014 Fred Whitton in mind. I have to say, having come from an mtb background it was remarkably comforting to have the disc brakes on the descents of Hardknott and Wrynose. I am by no means a good descender on the road bike but I certainly overtook more riders on these two descents than those that came past me.

the disc brake disciples are having to try and prove there is some point to them.

It's not that. It's just that I can't stand bollocks 😉

So many riser bar'd mega gates....not really helping the cause.

That Roubaix looks alright. It'd look a lot better if you put it in the big ring and slammed the stem...

And yes, I know it's an "endurance" bike, it's just that those high front ends look a bit wrong. IMHO. That's more offensive to my eyes (and my OCD) than discs!

Also, what brakes are they? Looks like Di2 so are they the new Ultegra hydraulics? What are they like?

And yes, I know it's an "endurance" bike, it's just that those high front ends look a bit wrong. IMHO. That's more offensive to my eyes (and my OCD) than discs!

sorry, but i have to agree, sod the brakes, that front end is ridiculous!

Please accept my apologies if the front end of the bike offends!

The brakes are BB7's but your correct, the groupset is Di2. Absolutely fantastic bit of kit - encourages you to work on and maintain your cadence over undulating roads due to the shifts being so positive and 'easy'.

Would have gone for a Tarmac, but having had 4 lumber discs removed and 5 vertebrae fused an element of comfort was deemed to be preferable to vanity!

Been riding road for about 12 months now - how long until I become intollerable of other peoples choices, reasoned or not!