There are fairly regular threads on here about how to train. Along with subsequent threads about how things are going downhill and always feeling tired.
I came across this piece on the BBC https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p07fcfds . Obviously the interviewee is making the claims in support of her book but it's interesting nonetheless. Fifty minutes long BTW.
TL:DL? Basically let your body dictate how you recover and also dictate how you drink and eat during and after exercise. So drink when you are thirsty, eat when hungry and so on. Organise yourself so you get a decent night's sleep. No proven need for any of the sports/drinks supplements or vitamin pills - expensive pee.
I’d agree just finishing 3 months touring. Good sleep and food number 1 & 2 priority for recovery. Absolutely no need for supplements. Good diet, hydration and sleep. You need to listen to the body. Sometimes it needs more/less.
Interesting, could maybe have done with a slightly more challenging interviewer.
It’s a subject close to my heart, as I seem to at an age where if I listen to my body telling me I’m tired I’d never get out of the door 🙂
On training and going downhill I find it’s an indication of a boring training regime. Same old distances, effort etc. You need to keep the regime interesting and exciting. Personally I recommend a pyramid type approach over long periods. Touring I change the distance effort etc everyday.
Once you complete your goal having a break is also essential. Don’t need to stop completely but cafe and fun 🙂
if I listen to my body telling me I’m tired I’d never get out of the door
This. This in spades!
@Pawsey_Bear - I remember reading about Josh Kato after he won the TDR - he basically didn't ride his bike for six months other than a few gentle pootles to one of his local streams to go fishing. We are back to every ride having a purpose, even if that purpose is just a sunny evening's meander to the pub and back.
Agree about a more challenging interviewer, it sounded like she'd done a sort of meta review on the various papers supporting one regime over another and come to the conclusion that the scope of the "benefits" actually lay within natural variance of doing what your body wanted.
There's a great book titled Rest
The most productive people like Darwin had a lot of downtime.
@handybar - in the piece linked she mentions the importance of proper rest, i.e. not watching TV, listening to music, posting on web forums but just doing nothing and properly de-stressing and relaxing.
There’s a great book titled Rest
The most productive people like Darwin had a lot of downtime.
Proust lay in his scratcher all day long.
I guess you can buzz around middle management working like a demon all life long, but once you're talking serious levels of creativity it's a different output.
I've been reading a book called "Why We Sleep" once you read that, its quite clear why loafing around and sleeping is so very much more productive that the modern expectation of life.
Did Darwin and Proust win any bike races?
....the scope of the “benefits” actually lay within natural variance of doing what your body wanted.
Based on zero sports science knowledge but some experience of riding or training to a point that causes a fair bit of fatigue, I suspect this is right. 'you can't train a tired muscle' and how recovery is what makes you stronger, not the stress itself - the stress just produces a recovery action, are two points I took from advice and some basic training research. Both seem to back up natural variance idea, as well as perhaps why many of us will know some Type A people with training regimes who don't seem to get that far and some more take-it-as-it-comes types doing well from a basically-sound structure that is readily adapted.
Well I’m nearly 61 the getting out the door problem we’ve all experienced. From my experience and anecdotal evidence if you make training enjoyable you will train and gain more. I put a lot of training in. It’s not a problem. If I’m out on a ride and it’s not going well I’m not afraid to listen to my body and cut it short and or add another coffee stop. Conversely if it’s going well I step it up.
It’s keeping it enjoyable that’s important. That can and should include hard sessions. Cross training to. I quite like indoor rowing. Helps to provide a whole body workout.
Type A people? I wonder sometimes if they actually like themselves:-D I know a few. Boom and bust and tend to be injury prone.
One other area that affects you is staying in the ‘training zone’. How many times have you looked at someone’s Strava and they say zone 1 - 2 recovery and to look and it’s mostly zone 3. It’s really hard to stay in the training zone. For me zones 4-5 are mostly turbo where you can safely do intervals
Very much agree with the training zones comment - my standard refrain is that "people don't train hard enough nor rest easily enough" So rather than efforts around zone 4/5 then resting at zone 1/2 they'll "train" at the upper end of zone 3 and "recover" at the lower end of zone 3. I've found that it's virtually impossible to stick in zones 1 & 2 if you are riding with someone, you've got to do them alone.
Will have a look at that later, thanks.
Anyone using Whoop?
I'm assuming Whoop is an app? There's a short section in the podcast about apps and their reliability.
There is a link between mental rest and physical endurance just look how stress takes away your energy levels.
The eastern Europeans undérstand this with their spas.
In the UK everyone is forced to work like a loony but productivity remains low so they just replace you once your burnt out with a new person to burn out!
I’m assuming Whoop is an app? There’s a short section in the podcast about apps and their reliability.
(people don’t train hard enough nor rest easily enough” )
Like it, that encapsulates my entire view on zones
Cross training to. I quite like indoor rowing. Helps to provide a whole body workout.
I'd be interested to know how much resistance training people do as they get older - I've recently started doing some kettlebell exercises to try to improve my core strength and it's made a huge difference to my riding and general well being, especially with regard to reducing back pain.
Have you tried sleeping naked?
Northernsoul - 48yo here and I'm a big fan of a variety of resistance training, aiming for around 3 sessions per week. Whilst weight training obviously has benefits I do find it quite dull so try to mix it up with circuit training/Insanity type stuff.
If you're suffering from back pain (as I do) then I can't recommend flexibility/yoga/core work enough. I have a book called Yoga for Cyclists by Lexie Williamson and an hour long, slow and relaxing stretching session is one of my favourite workouts now.
I seem to see loads of people who train for no apparent reason. I have always just ridden my bike. Sometimes I would ride more. But you may rightly say you've never won a race, which is true (although I have come second a few times) but many of the people I see training hard never race at all. It seems joyless being locked in a garage on Zwift for hours when you could be out on a windy rainy dark night spotting owls or deer or foxes.
Less training more fun I say.
OP, really enjoyed that podcast - she really does take apart most stuff.
Diceded to get the book and go further with this.
The inflammation bit I found most fascinating. I'm not sure how the medical world will feel about that one, but she did say tests were still being done.
@northernsoul I find Abi Carter's yoga videos really good. They're also aimed at sports people (inc. some specific MTB routines) and she explains why they work/are relevant. She leaves the spirituality mumbo-jumbo out of it too.
many of the people I see training hard never race at all. It seems joyless being locked in a garage on Zwift for hours
This spying on people in garages needs to stop.
This spying on people in garages needs to stop.
I'm not spying, I locked them in there!!!
Better a good session on Zwift. Mines permanently set up in the spare room. Big computer screen. It’s ideal. Concept 2 rower as well. I find having it all set up means I use it more often. Fans, drinks. I don’t train in the wet anymore. No need to. Zwift is great fun. I don’t race on road but I do on Zwift. Probably one of the hardest workouts I do!
@spoonmeister - thanks will follow that up too.
To bring it back a little to the OP, one thing that has taken a bit of getting used to is that in my 20s I could easily do three or 4 big sessions in a week, something that I can't do now because of the longer recovery needed (plus I had a period of a few years with little intensive exercise, related to starting a family, and have been a little caught out by the intervening loss of muscle tone).
Typically you need twice the recovery as you get older. You should also help recovery with a good diet. Older people must take on more protein after exercise to aid muscle repair.
I agree with some of the comments above about keeping it interesting.
For the last few months riding the bike has seemed a real chore. So started back in the gym - skipping rope & hitting the bags. Whilst not at the same intensity as what I previously put into riding the bike; it at least is getting me to feel like exercising.
Even doing what you love gets boring after awhile, so change is as good as a rest.
@Pawsy_Bear, how did you work that amount of recovery into a 3 month tour? I’m a similar age and planning a multi month tour next year, trying to work out how many days to ride/rest.
Well for example before I did Liege-Bastogne-Liege I took the day off. Other times ferry crossing meant short days. I’ve cycled every day from Barcelona in the heat wave, Pyrenees and up to St Malo. I get into the hotel about 16:00 shower, eat and bed. Up at 07:00 normally on the road by 09;00. For rest I plan short days like to day 70k. Spent the morning in Lorient Navy museum. Cycled just the afternoon. I saw the Giro at various stages and stayed in Verona to see the finish. Day off there 🙂 Make you days off coincide with things you want to see or do. Short day into Rome, went on the hop on off bus see the sites.
You need to plan your route. In the mountains halve the distance because of the climb. Be well organised and carry little as possible. My bag is 2kg. Phone GPS money etc 1kg. Only have rear saddle bag. You must stay aero. I plan mine over the winter. I find I can do 100-140km a day non stop any climb. Vary your distances.
Food is really important. Continental breakfast just isn’t enough. Bread and juice coffee! Sleep, in bed by 21:00.
Be well organised good admin
Maintain your bike - plan when you need a chain or pad change. After 6500k I changed tyres to.
Fatigue has set in for me after Spain and France heatwaves. Tomorrow is 120km then all day on ferry. Night in Portsmouth and then 210km to home
Additional:
I stop for coffee lunch and afternoon ice cream if I can ha ha Stops are handy. Relaxes you. Refuel water bottle. Only carry one. There’s plenty of places to top up. Don’t carry the extra weight lessens fatigue.
Thanks for that, great advice. Wife and I did a 3 month tour 7 years ago, but with full camping gear and panniers, nearest we got to aero was made out of chocolate 🙂 That time we were aiming less for distance more just the experience of travelling by bike. We still covered a fair distance but at a very relaxed pace. We want to try to find a middle ground this time and cover a bit more distance, so I’ll take your advice on board...but maybe a little less disciplined 😉
Less training more fun I say.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^