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Propedal? Because as above, I like my suspension smooth and plush for the downs, but I ride xc so I enjoy blasting up a good climb just as much so want a bike to feel fast and that doesn't bounce and wallow too much whilst it's doing it. That propedal switch allows this to happen, and for those who say get a better designed bike, I've not found one yet that feels ace both climbing hard and decending hard despite trying loads.
Hi the giant is amazing in the twisty stuff just flys however I just couldn't get it uphil anywhere near as quick as the epic and didn't like the 3x10 drive. See if you can get to one of the demo series events you'll get a ride of an epic fuel and anthem all worth a look.
trail centre mincing machines 😀
It might come as a surprise to some, but there are people who go out to ride bikes fast, they don't stop in the middle of the trail at the first sign of a climb to have a chat. Who are not interested in finding excuses as to why they can't ride up a hill. For whom a decent ride means finishing it in a quivering heap as the acid dissolves every muscle. A hard climb is one where you throw up.
+1 on that!
hi i ride a anthem x2 2010 had it six months and had no problem with it,but want to sell it becauce i want more travel so thinking of a lapere zesty.
Epic or maybe a Spark. Spark's a bit lighter but the Epic rides beautifully. I notice Biketreks have a 2010 carbon Epic on sale and a 2011 demo model too.
You shouldn't need propedal - if you do you should consider a better designed bike.
I thought anthem x's weren't suppossed to need it? I rode an anthem and it seemed not to. My flux certainly doesn't want it.
You shouldn't need propedal - if you do you should consider a better designed bike.
I refer you to my earlier comment, suspension isn't always a benefit, i know this seems difficult for many to understand. Pro-pedal allows suspension to be reduced when it is not a benefit.
Suspension is not just a factor of the bike, it is a factor of how the rider rides the bike.
I refer you to my earlier comment - you shouldn't need propedal anymore - not with anti-squat designs.
Suspension should be plush on the downs and not bob on the ups, and if you have to play with propedal to do this you are riding an outmoded design.
What is the point of putting propedal on for a climb as you are stiffening out the suspension and so it will act more like a hardtail on bumps and roots rather than digging in and giving more traction.
If you want a bike like this why do you not save weight and ride a compiant Ti HT design like the On-one?
I refer you to my earlier comment - you shouldn't need propedal anymore - not with anti-squat designs.Suspension should be plush on the downs and not bob on the ups, and if you have to play with propedal to do this you are riding an outmoded design.
What is the point of putting propedal on for a climb as you are stiffening out the suspension and so it will act more like a hardtail on bumps and roots rather than digging in and giving more traction.
If you want a bike like this why do you not save weight and ride a compiant Ti HT design like the On-one?
Suspension is better than it has been in the past, but it is still not perfect and never will be for every situation, give me a rigid bike for hammering up a fireroad, and suspension for bashing over roots, but no bike can do both perfectly. It is about compromise, Propedal is a decent solution
The majority of MTBs have three rings and nine sprockets, each and every combination results in different loads on the suspension, again you have to accept that no perfect solution can be achieved.
as for riders adapting style to suit the bike which is what is often brought up as a solution, sit down and spin etc. Riders build and muscle structure does determine the way a rider can ride a bike fast, whether they need to spin fast small gears, use slightly bigger gears etc. When your talking about XC race bikes the only determining factor is which bike gets you to the finish first. Put generally It is for the bike to adapt to the rider not the rider to adapt to the bike.
Propedal is a hack.
Hammering up a fireroad might be the only time propedal was ok, or maybe if you stand up a lot - although I stand on some climbs and can't feel any bob on my bike.
Otherwise I cannot see why you would want to compromise your suspension with it.
Look at user reviews of any of the dw-link bikes and you will be very lucky to find anyone who uses pro-pedal. Here's a link to start with:
http://www.mtbr.com/cat/bikes/xc-suspensio/turner/fluxdwlink/PRD_425925_1526crx.aspx
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Spark is a great all round bike, but still goes like stink. 😉
I bought an S-Works Epic in the sales from those lovely people at Bikescene 4/5 years ago and built it in to a great XC machine - very good at everything I pointed it at!
Have since sold though and back on to the HT weight-weenie challenge 😉
just clicked on the turner website, it states the flux comes with an rp23, a pro-pedal shock? What else can i see comments about the back end adding 1/2 pound to the frame weight. No i can't see anyone making comments about using the propedal, but then i look at the Top Fuel reviews and i can't see that detail either, yet i know i use the propedal when i want.
You say when you stand up, as if you don't?, suspension bikes tend to react badly when you get out of the saddle, but there are plenty of times when i get out of the saddle, maybe because i ride from my door and have to do road climbs on it. The propedal acts to damp the worst of my throwing the bike around when honking, in the same way a fork lock out means i can sprint and honk the bike without the front end getting wallowy. If i had no propedal the suspension would have to be setup harder to allow me to ride the bike the way i want, which would mean that it would be worse when i need the suspension
and because you can't see why anyone would want to compromise, or i would say optimise, there suspension doesn't mean others can't see why.
RP23 is there for marketing - people spending that amount of money will want an RP23 for some reason - I would rather not have it.
As I say, if I climb out of the saddle I still don't see the need for the propedal - but maybe that is the anti-squat nature of the suspension.
First comment i see on the trek top fuel say he wishes the suspension remained active when braking...
Merida 96. Just picked one up seems nice
Currently got a Ghost AMR on Demo took it around Kirroughtree yesterday and Mabie today.
Really enjoying it and a real change to the type of bikes I normally ride (it has much less travel), but I can see it working for most of my riding and it's a joy to ride, climbs nice and decends nice very confidence inspiring.
Shall be riding it again tomorrow too.
The Ghost would make a good XC bike.
Thanks for all the recommendations and great debate about pro pedal (i dont even know what that is)
First comment i see on the trek top fuel say he wishes the suspension remained active when braking...
Which Topfuel, they changed the design, newer ones are much nicer than the older ones. Personnally never noticed any issue with either of my top fuels.
Anyway to to OP, ride a few bikes where you intend to ride them, it is fair to say buying a 6" bike then riding it round the block is not going to be very informative, likewise if you do go and try a few bikes somewhere a bit rocky like Afan but your riding is on smooth singletrack more like Sherwood, you will get a little misled about a bike. And make sure you try and set the bike up, even if it is only roughly correct, a badly setup bike will never let you make an informed choice.
davidtaylforth - propedal is worth knowing about as the need to use it is the sign of a flawed suspension sytem!!!
It is a damping in the shock which acts against the tendancy for the bike to bob as the rider exerts pedalling effort. This happened a lot on early designs, like single-pivot, and is still present on some newer designs.
However even on a bob-prone design you may never need it if your pedalling style is good enough - for instance the Orange 5 is a single pivot bike that is very popular - some of the guys I ride with has Orange 5s and never put propedal on when climbing, but others might need it if they were not so accomplished.
On other bikes that require it you will feel the bike sapping energy on a climb until you switch it on - a Santa Cruz superlight felt like this to me - and people often spend a lot of time balancing shock setting and propedal to get a compromised performance that suits them.
There is a newer suspension design by Dave Weagle named dw-link (ignoring split-pivot) which appears to be one of the best at balancing all of the problems that a suspension system has to tackle, and it's main feature is so-called anti-squat, which simply put stops the bike squating down into its travel as a reaction to pedalling forces. dw-link bikes normally have short links to characterise them, and there are several companies using his design or using something that is a close copy to try to get round his patents.
The Giant Maestro system is a close copy and works well.
The recommendations on here to try the Anthem X are good - I love my Flux but it is more money and certainly more to compensate the 1lb more frame weight (although frame weight is not so important if the suspension is more efficient - hence people say a bike rides light).
Anybody who bobs the Anthem X probably could do with learning a better pedalling stroke...
Geometry counts for a lot, but you don't want to dump a load on an FS bike and then find later than it has flaws that bug you. You can change a lot about the feel of a bike with a different stem or even risers, but it is difficult to fix up a suspension design - changing shocks or getting them Pushed can be expensive.
So ride several bikes, but if you want it for XC pay attention to how it climbs.
oh dear...
Marketing this Marketing that, blah blah blah....
Take the decent advice and look at all the XC offerings from the major players, pick the ones in your budget and that you like the look of and then arrange some test rides.
That is the only way you will know which designs *you* get on with, but the bit about making sure you get them set up right for your eight etc before riding is good advice.
Singletrack reader in "suckered by marketing" shocker
move along....
I ummed and ahhd for ages last year about this and in the end i just had to start ignoring everyone giving me advice and i went with what felt right when i rode i, which turned out to be a Giant Trance in the end.
[url= http://www.canyon.com/_uk/mountainbikes/bike.html?b=2065 ]This looks nice[/url]
YOU don't need pro pedal on giant bikes. It will slow you down. The bikes have no pedal bob. al pro pedal does is make suspension worse so it doesn't climb as well
Maestro suspension makes you pedal though everything so you go very fast. It does not wallow at all. It's not a single pivot system. Try it.
who said Maestro was a single pivot system?
I sold my marin to get a Anthem X4 2010 and its the best bike decision I've made. Its been upgraded a fair bit but the bike feels so at home on singletrack and gives me the biggest grin every time I get on it.
Get whatever you can get a ride on and find works for you and you can afford.
Many people find the Anthem, Top Fuel, Epic to do this. Regardless of availability, if they didn't work, folks would look elsewhere - especially the Niche Mongers here!!
Despite TurnerGuy's preaching 🙄 it is nice to have the pro-pedal shock in there; if you don't use it, never mind. If you find you do, then you have the option. I have an RP2 on my Meta4 and use the pro-pedal on the road to and from the trail (10 miles!!) but it suits me to leave it fully active once I get offroad, up or down. Choices, choices...
Well at least the issue will hopefully be prominent in the OPs mind when test riding bikes 😀 And if the bike 'sits down' in its travel as he starts to pump up a climb he might figure out that it is a bad thing.