Brakes that howled like a pig getting ****ed by an elephant while being about as effective as dragging a foot on the ground.
Got to say I do NOT miss the old days at all. Shit brakes, shit tyres, steep angles, bar ends and those gods awful outfits some wore. MTBing has never been better I'd argue.
I don't miss sketchy 26" bikes with long stems but I did always like how they made the average local trail a challenge and I still have MTBs like that in the garage now. A simple, rigid bike that gets the best out of micro-tech in the woods. When I look at retrobike occasionally I realise that what I've always liked in bikes was an impression of durable simplicity. It's something a bike can still have now along with better fit + geometry, decent tyres, brakes that work etc.
Brakes that howled like a pig getting ****ed by an elephant while being about as effective as dragging a foot on the ground
I was with you until I saw the picture of V brakes. I had years of cantilever brakes before V brakes came along and V brakes were absolutely awesome (in comparison to cantis)
I don't miss sketchy 26" bikes
Mostly this. I still have my old Chinese Ti frame, now built up as a SS "pub" bike, but the smaller wheel size was a rubbish choice as a standard. It just gets hooked up too much in anything rough, rooty, rocky. Even 27.5 was a big improvement.
You lot are far too young to remember cotterpins or rod brakes and Sturmey Archer 3 speeds , by comparison my 1995 Marin Bobcat Trail was from another dimension! 😁
I'm only early 50s but my first new bike (Raleigh Bomber) had both cottered cranks and a Sturmey hub 😀
Went to the fabulous MTB museum in Arnhem and realised nostalgia isn't just the bikes https://mountainbikemuseum.nl. It was everything that went with them - the race scene, lifelong friends, wildly experimental bike designs etc. Mrs was lucky enough to race xc at two world championships - back when there were 175 starters on the grid and BC would enter a decent sized team (even if you weren't a medal prospect).
What really struck me in the museum was the mix of amazing engineering and woeful flimsiness - often in the same bike! The Mantis below is a fine example - beautiful sturdy fabrication around the swingarm pivot, but two (visibly bent) cantilevered M6 bolts for the seatstay to dropout pivot.
Family out for a spin up the hill today, muddy, rooty bridleway. Mother and two kids on BSOs but at least had big wheels, front suspension and disc brakes. Dad at the rear on his top of the line hardtail from the early 90's "still does the job!" Knew what he had before I saw the bike just from his head down, stretched out wibbly wobbly stance and brake squeal. The three in front were fairly zipping along and enjoying themselves far, far more than he was. I still have my original 26" Clockwork, but have been scared to take it out for at least 12 years now, where once it was my only bike for years, and I would do 100 miles a week on the thing.
^Nice GT next to the Mantis.
I'm nostalgic for the fun I had but not the crappy bikes which used to break all the time.
"There used to be a fantastic downhill bit down here, it used to take 10 minutes of real technical riding, and when you got to the bottom with aching hands arms and legs it was a real high 5 moment, where's it gone?"
"That was it, the nondescript path we just rolled down, chatting".
That's progress for ya!
and fully enclosed chainsYou lot are far too young to remember cotterpins or rod brakes and Sturmey Archer 3 speeds
I so wanted a set of Cook Bros cranks back in the day
So i like the newer geo and the sure-footedness of slacker bikes but I haven’t had an OTB in prob 5 years - I might be a bit more wussy nowadays but telling the tale of an OTB was part of the post ride bantz - I had 3 OTBs in one day once - what a day! - and I still dine out on that adventure (see!) - and I think I miss them a little bit.Also front suspension, particularly on a hardtail, that didn’t really do very much. You’d clatter down a rocky escarpment, mostly out of control, and when you got to the bottom wonder at the numbness in your hands and the fact that you’re still alive.
this is why gravel bikes are so much fun. Modern MTBs just make trails boring. They are so efficient you barely notice the XC trails that used to be entertaining and made you love off road riding in the first place. On a Grav bike you get back that adrenalin rush that you might not still be attached to the bike by the end of the trail. of course if you ride the gravel bike on fireroads and actual gravel then yes it's boring but ride it somewhere innapropriate and that classic MTB vibes come rushing back.
OTB was still possible with the original 135mm stem!
Ahhh the joys of scraping autumnal leaves and dog egg out of the utter gash that was a u-brake.
The utter shite of polymers going hard in winter on girvin flex stems
The sheer amazement of going mad with biggest tyre you could get.....a mighty 2.1" making the farmer john look all narrow and rubbish
Oh the 90’s. Shite brakes and suspension. Admittedly v brakes were better but they still relied on wheels being near 100% true which they were for maybe a couple of hours when brand new. Good times but rubbish bikes. Don’t get me started on front mechs.
I seem to remember an article / editorial in the magazine a few years ago called.
Just because it's old doesn't mean it's not shit.
Or words to that effect. I recall it was a ride on vintage kit somewhere and the writer found it a largely joyless experience.
We liked riding stuff on those bikes because we didn't know what good bikes rode like!
A simple, rigid bike that gets the best out of micro-tech in the woods. When I look at retrobike occasionally I realise that what I've always liked in bikes was an impression of durable simplicity. It's something a bike can still have now along with better fit + geometry, decent tyres, brakes that work etc.
Which is why rigid bikes like Surlys and Stooges are popular.
Durable, simple, but with modern geometry and modern innovations like droppers, discs and decent tyres.
ah the good ol’ days - anyone else miss anything?
All nostalgia boils down to is wishing you were young and pain free again. 🙂
I saw three middle aged blokes ride past on BMXs today. They did not look cool.
this is why gravel bikes are so much fun. Modern MTBs just make trails boring.
Have you tried riding actual MTB trails and not just cruising around on gravel paths?
I don't believe that I need a less capable bike to make boring trails feel more dangerous. I take my modern bike to dangerous trails and love it.
Yeah but they were rubbish in a good way!
We went out, we had fun, we didn't know any better cos none of what is around now existed back then, there was a cool* race scene around it all...
*cool if you were in it - as with all things cool it was fine if you were one of the cool ones in your fluoro MTB leggings with your ETTO helmet, to everyone else you just looked like a ****.
Maybe it's the nostalgia of our first experience.
First whisky (I still have a penchant for Bell's) first windsurfers, I used to go every free minute in 1984 - I wouldn't step on a Sea Panther Star with regatta sail today even if it was the only thing available - first kiss - still fancy the girl I kissed in 1969. (Sitting down to dinner tonight with the same girl, our 3 kids, their partners and our 5 grandkids so some passions stay undimmed).
Not that I didn’t enjoy riding them, but the bikes were terrible.
I get that innovations like tyres, suspension and disc brakes took time to mature, but the fact that geometry was so bad is laughable. The people who we thought knew what they were doing or talking about didn’t know anything and very, very few seemed to question any of it.
I still keep these pictures on my phone. Most definitely bikes of ye olde times.
The guy was a collector, many examples of the first bikes with chains and discs from a bygone era, linkage brakes
Don’t get me started on front mechs.
Absolutely nothing wrong with them and a piece of cake to set up with even the most basic knowledge. I remember the 1x arguments and was always amazed the amount of people who seemed to find them difficult to adjust. I'm far from a champion spanner monkey btw.
Still rocking 150mm.
And a San Marco Rolls!
Fantastic piece of history but that bike looks lethal by modern standards. 😂
I do get what the OP is on about, but the last decade or so has been choc dull of “back to basics” bikes for me, I got a Gravel bike in 2015ish, I have a Rigid MTB, I also have a bouncy forked, slacker HT. the main things that none of these share with their 80/90’s predecessors is the brakes and tyres work and fail far less frequently… Oh and Droppers are a smidge better than the olde “Hite Rite”.
But yeah simple never went away, it just got a bit forgotten by people along the way, hence people now think they have to spunk £6k to get back into a once simpler hobby…
I saw three middle aged blokes ride past on BMXs today. They did not look cool.
I doubt they GAS about looking cool or what anyone else thinks plus, they were probably having fun. Imagine that.
I saw three middle aged blokes ride past on BMXs today. They did not look cool.
If they were doing laps of the town centre boy racer style (anyone else noticed the comeback in them?) then fair point but if they were doing some street trials/heading to the local bmx track then who cares how they looked?
Going back to the OP it is hard to restrain from a sarcastic comment about gravel bikes being what I rode as a teenager but just with drop bars. I think there is some truth in that position hence why many have switched back to them. I did take a few years out and dusting off my old 26in bike, which was basically a flat bar gravel bike, and starting back into it including strava etc, I then got a bonus and brought a 905 and first few rides ended up with personal record after personal record. Oddly enough when I finally got a full sus its PRs are a bit rarer possibly because most of what I ride is more pedally and its a 12sp vs a 2x10.
A crap bike is definitely more challenging and does have the advantage that when I do run out of skill its probably going to be less painful as the speed will be lower but overall I do tend towards liking nicer, newer bikes aside from when the service bill is sent.
I had a mk2 Soul, basically learned to ride on that thing, absolutely loved it, when I upgraded to it from my Scandal it felt like cheat mode. Absolutely covered it in brilliant kit, probably about as good as you could make a hardtail at the time. Thought it was incredible.
Couple of years back I bought a mk1 Soul. Managed to find a set of the same wheels. In a weird coincidence bought a set of the same revelations off ebay and it was my actual old forks. Found the old brakes in a box. It's a different colour but otherwise so, so close to being identical to that old Soul.
And it's pish. I totally thought I'd take it for some proper mountain biking, do some brave retro golfie runs on it, but no **** that. It has basically no redeeming features and does nothing well. I use it to ride to tesco.
I’m 33 so I missed the really crap bikes but I did ride in the mid to late 2000s when geometry still wasn’t really dialled, long stems were clinging around like a bad stain and front mechs were very much still on the scene. There was a certain innocence to it that I feel is missed these days, but I really don’t miss dropping a chain on every other rough trail and the bendiness of quick release wheels and 32mm forks.
^ ^ ^ What a load of absolute shite 😃 ^ ^ ^
We rode what we had and enjoyed ourselves.
^ ^ ^ What a load of absolute shite 😃 ^ ^ ^
We rode what we had and enjoyed ourselves.
I don’t think anyone has said they didn’t enjoy it at the time.
I don't miss rims made of cheese (I'm looking at you Mavic 517 rims). However, I did love many bikes that I rode back then, even my original Carrera Krakatoa. Ooh, I also don't miss adjusting a front mech for a triple ring up front and a "wide" cassette (42 tooth) out back. Nigh on impossible not to get that slightest bit of chain rub at some point in the range.
Other bike loves were a Diamond Back Ascent SE and the original Santa Cruz Blur (plus a Blur TRC).
I find the angles of an old bike more pleasing to the eye from an obsessive compulsive point of view. Seat and head tube angles that are similar just look nice. Compare that to a super steep seat angle and a super slack head angle ... bleurgh ... my eyes.
I find it quite funny how so many YouTube influencers seem to have their seats slammed right forward at the moment. Presumably because their long, low, and slack bikes are a bit too long for them. Not a problem I've ever had with monkey arms and equally long legs.
I never found OTB to be that much of an issue with old skool bikes as they were always too small for me so I ended up with my weight very far back combined with a long stem. Weird combination but it worked.
All in all, I've loved most of the MTBs I've ridden since the late 80s. It has always been more about getting out there than purely nadgery trails (riding down churned up steep cow fields was challenging on a fully rigid bike), so trail progression doesn't matter that much to me. I do find I have to do less spannering than I used to and I do fall off less than I used to (but when I do, it tends to be apocalyptic). That does indicate better, more reliable parts, and more capable bikes, but riding was fun and good for my soul all the time I've been MTBing ... just different shades of fun.
I do miss more interesting paint jobs though (my Diamond Back had a lovely blue cracked egg shell effect and the Carrera was plainly inspired by Jackson Pollock) 😉
Surely there's a joy in riding while that you precisely pick a line through a trail, rather than just steamrollering through it?
The sense of satisfaction that comes from negotiating your way down is fantastic.
My'97 Kilauea is still the most fun to ride on my local trails, and the trails haven't really changed that much.
Also. If you have to actually ride the trail, and choose a line, you'll likely be going slower, thus less likely to hospitaliae yourself in a crash.
Which is why rigid bikes like Surlys and Stooges are popular.
Durable, simple, but with modern geometry and modern innovations like droppers, discs and decent tyres.
Exactly. Niche interest but viable bikes. I've had a Jones 29er for almost 15 years now it's the OG 'proper' rigid MTB imo. It's not the only MTB I ride but it's a great constant to go back to, never feels old. Not what you'd call 'modern' geometry but the geometry certainly works.
Mark coined the retro shit phrase. I'm about to do another piece comparing a modern gravel bike with an old MTB on the Burma Road up Aviemore way. I want to see just how capable old bikes are when lined up against an ATB of yore. It's a classic MTB route so we should have a giggle. The ATB is an original Raleigh Maverick. The gravel bike and OPEN wide.
Cheers
Sanny
@Sanny are you also going to rip up the surface of the Burma Road in order to restore it to its retro condition? The part from Lynwilg to the Dulnain is a bit like a motorway at the moment. You'd get a more nostalgic ride heading up and down nearby Carn Sleamhuinn.
Alternatively, I can save you a trip and tell you that a XC 29er hardtail is better than either. 🤪
My first 29er with qr 120mm Reba forks and a re-purposed touring rim. I could twist handlebars one way and bike would steer another. I've a friend with a photo showing about 120 angle between bars and wheel as I batter down Stanage Plantation....
I think most of it was down to the Reba...
- Thinking of anti clockwise to descend via the Alive descent to add a bit of tech spice! Oh and you are of course correct re the 29er. Of course it is better but that's not the point of the exercise. 🤣
Just re-read my post. Bloody phones.Atb v gravel. Not Atb v MTB. Doh!
Just re-read my post. Bloody phones.Atb v gravel. Not Atb v MTB. Doh!
ATB = Absolutely Terrible Bike?
That would adequately describe the Raleigh. Will it have one of those early 52/42/32 triples?
Will it have one of those early 52/42/32 triples?
My first proper MTB (1993-ish) had a 28/38/48 triple. 😳
descend via the Alive descent
Ah. In which case they'll both be shit. (Thinking on it, is there a gate in the new deer fence there?)
Which is why rigid bikes like Surlys and Stooges are popular.
Durable, simple, but with modern geometry and modern innovations like droppers, discs and decent tyres.
Exactly. Niche interest but viable bikes. I've had a Jones 29er for almost 15 years now it's the OG 'proper' rigid MTB imo. It's not the only MTB I ride but it's a great constant to go back to, never feels old. Not what you'd call 'modern' geometry but the geometry certainly works.
I hanker after a Stooge but then when I ride my first generation Longitude, it’s such a good bike I wonder what I’d gain…