Right, I've had enough, my Canyon Spectral is going.
What can I get that is slightly higher and won't annoy me with pedal strikes?
I only ride in The Peak.
Cheers,
Mick
Have you looked at crank length/pedal type/sag? What setup do you have right now?
My guess is a Canyon will have a conservatively high bottom bracket already so most similar bikes will be as lo or lower.
What George said.
Shimano make a nice SLX crankset in 165mm - which I've recently fitted to my bikes.
Assuming you're not a beanpole, there's a school of thought that most people are on too long cranks anyway.
I only ride in The Peak
Wasn't there a funny video/song about that?
AFAIK there’s nothing unusual about any Spectral’s BB height, so I doubt you’ll find anything that’s a lot higher. Running less sag can raise your BB more than swapping to a higher bike so I’d try that first.
You’re doing it wrong
How much sag, how much compression and what length cranks (and pedal width)?
Yeah yeah, I know I've heard all that bad technique nonsense before. Not interested in those types of comments.
I don't think it's sag, I have shoved loads more air in and it doesn't help.
Cranks are 170.
Yeah pedals don't help. I'm on big plastic flats at the moment, I might swap to egg beaters.
Is there a 165mm crankset available anywhere?
What can I get that is slightly higher and won’t annoy me with pedal strikes?
Ignore BB, concentrate of the suspension action. If the Spectral (which has a perfectly average BB height) isn't doing it for you, then it's either 1. those big flappy pedals, 2. suspension not being supportive just where it needs to be or lastly 3, pedals at 12/6 o'clock.
“ I don’t think it’s sag, I have shoved loads more air in and it doesn’t help.”
That doesn’t make a lot of sense. Roughly speaking, 150mm bike with a low BB is at 330mm static. Typical is 340mm. High is 350mm.
Run 20% sag and the bike sits 30mm lower. 25% and it’s 37.5mm. 30% and it’s 45mm. 35% and it’s 52.5mm (I run about this much sag on my full-sus).
330mm BB with 20% sag is 300mm BB when you’re on the bike.
350mm BB with 30% sag is 305mm BB when you’re on the bike.
Then pedal it up a hill and the bike with less sag will squish less when under power and/or angled uphill, making the suspension set-up even more significant.
I know I’ve heard all that bad technique nonsense before.
It's not nonsense.
Is there a 165mm crankset available anywhere?
Set up stock alerts with your retailers of choice, I found they came in stock quite quickly (then sold quickly too).
And does your bike feel wallowy / prone to bobbing?
Do you have the ability to dial more LSC on the shock?
When are you getting pedal strikes?
You could video your self on a section where you are getting pedal strikes to see what is really going on.
There is so much to look at before spending money on fixing the problem.
Could be rebound damping is too slow or compression damping too fast, what volume spacers have you got in?
Is your suspension setup correctly if you have tried adding loads of air?
You could raise the back end with offset bushing in the shock mounts and probably increase fork travel a little, these would raise the bike but still keep suspension in the right sag setup.
I get them most when I'm climbing. Last night we were in and out of 3 Shires.
Yes, I can avoid using technique but I love technical climbing and this bike is making it too frustrating to really push in the challenging climbs. It makes climbs which are already hard even harder.
A quick measure suggests that the centre of the BB is 330mm unloaded.
No volume spacers. I'm 77kg.
Not sure if it is correctly setup, I have tinkered with it several times. This is my first full suss.
The instructions suggest 180psi based on my weight. I have tried that.
I currently have 200psi in.
If I setup 20% sag, this is less that 180psi which I have also tried.
Mick
Is it the model of spectral(2018?) that originally came specc'd with 2.6" tyres and have you since swapped them for something smaller?
Shorter cranks
Offset bushing
Shock tokens
Cheaper and less hassle than a new bike.
I had this issue with my Occam which needs a ridiculous psi in the shock for my 70kgs. Also fitted a bigger shock token which helped. I still get the odd strike when descending with pedals level but it's much less frequent.
Do you lock it out for climbs? Makes a massive difference.
It's the 2019 original tyres 2.40.
What rear hub is on there, and how many poe?
I also ride the peak and agree that technical climb pedal strikes can be a pain but having a rear hub with a fairly quick pick up helps a lot with being able to usefully clock the cranks to avoid pedal strikes.
Yes I do lock it out.
Found an MBR review which measures the BB height of that one at 331mm so you’re correct in it being very much on the low side of normal.
Can you use offset bushings backwards to lengthen the shock or do they always rotate round to the shortest length? Longer shock? Longer fork? Bigger tyres?
What sag % are you measuring on the shock? Seated or standing?
Liteville frames used to have a higher BB than most.
Throwing in another variable.
I have found that a rear hub with superfast engagement, like an I9 Hydra, is a huge help on tech climbs. You can always adjust you cranks and have instant drive so you naturally get less strikes.
You could go for bigger tyres as well then, eh?
Yes you can use offset bushings to make it longer, I've even used them at the side to get more clearance for a wider shock body to stop it fouling on the frame with no problems.
I think I'm just going to get rid.
I've put up with it for two years and I hate it. I'm not going to spend more cash to try and fix it. It's a downhill bike despite what the marketing says.
I prefer my 10 year old Yellowstone.
Er, has it just gone on eBay?
Fair enough.
So returning to the thread title, Cotic make a point of having high-ish BBs, IIRC.
They specifically say it's because the Peak is a bit bumpy.
I prefer my 10 year old Yellowstone.
What's that?
If you want something higher, most bikes will be (don’t get the last Stumpjumper Evo!) A lot of bikes have flipchips so you can raise them a bit. Banshee Spitfire would be a safe swap, I think all the parts fit, 160mm fork, set the dropouts high and it’ll stay higher as you pedal too.
a downhill bike despite what the marketing says
🤣😂 You have some strange ideas.
Nope not on eBay until I find a replacement.
It's more of a downhill bike than it is an xc bike so I see what you're getting at. Sounds like a short travel 29er would be more suitable.
Sounds like a short travel 29er would be a good option - you’ll just have to look at geometry charts to look for one with the least bb drop possible. ‘Down-country’ as a niche probably fits the Peaks well - but may have low bb’s for railing corners.
Stuff like:
Trek Top Fuel
Transition Spur
YT Izzo
Orbea Oiz
Might be worth a look.
As an outside cheaper option it might be worth checking the Sonder Cortex.
Edit - geometry geeks website is useful for comparing bike geometry - out of the above lists it suggest the Trek Top Fuel has the highest BB at 343mm.The rest are very close to what you have already.
The Cotic Flaremax is very close to the Top Fuel bb height - but it’ll be quite significantly heavier.
Yeah I was thinking of a budget one. £2k rather that £4k.
Do you want jam on it as well lol?
Secondhand Top Fuel maybe?
Maybe just have a play around with geometry geeks and see if you can find something unusually high off the ground that’s also in stock and cheap 🤷♂️
A DH bike might be more what you are after, to be fair…
So returning to the thread title, Cotic make a point of having high-ish BBs, IIRC.
Do they?
FWIW my Flaremax feels a low BB, and with a -2 headset feels even lower.
I prefer low, makes it more stable on the steep/rocky/fast trails around here.
Wouldn't even mind going back to a hardtail.
Do they?
I clearly remember them literally claiming that they avoid low BBs because of the uniquely demanding nature of the riding in the Peak District 😉
Current FlareMAX is listed at 32mm BB drop. Not particularly low for a short-ish travel 29er.
"I clearly remember them literally claiming that they avoid low BBs because of the uniquely demanding nature of the riding in the Peak District 😉"
Yes, although they've gradually been getting lower, year by year!
YT Izzo maybe an option.
Why didn't you just say you now want a trendy down country bike?
A what?
