It does. It sours the spectacle, it tarnishes his reputation, it bores the arse off anyone who's focused on the racing and it gives some deeply tedious people an opportunity to work themselves up into a dunning-kruger circle jerk which spunks gooey droplets of hearsay and rumour all over the delicious biscuits of threads like this.
See, I don't see it like that. As you can see from the thread, I have bloody loved the racing today and will be all over every other stage as well. But I'm old enough to have had a few hero's fall (Lance, Pantani, Ulrich, etc.) and therefore feel I should question it. Maybe it's a defence mechanism, maybe I'm just cautious, I don't know.
But, I understand your point and perspective and think it is completely fair. I shall now keep that train of thought off this and other similar threads in the future.
But, as the adrenaline has died down, the thought lingers, is this all a bit late 90's? Putting 2 mins into a rival is fine, putting into 2 rivals is OK too, but into 4? And having 2 team mates in the top 10 as well? Well, it "not normal"...
Big time gaps aren't a sign of doping at all, though, really. Big gaps happened pre-EPO all the time. Merckx put 8 minutes into the entire TdF field in a single stage once, for example. Yeah, that was Merckx, but still, you get my point. And the big gaps in the doping era were all against a similarly juiced-up field, it's not like Armstrong doped and everyone else was on bread and water. All things being equal, you get big gaps in bike races from time to time, doped or undoped.
And anyone impugning G's integrity can * the * off, frankly.
a dunning-kruger circle jerk which spunks gooey droplets of hearsay and rumour all over the delicious biscuits of threads like this.
*polite applause*
The dude just gave out an ass kicking of the highest order thanks to his team dragging themselves up that hill. There will always be doubters, IMHO if one team is still doping they are all still at it.
I reckon the manner in which he won this stage, and the way he communicates back to the journos will has a massive positive impact on the UK fans, whilst he's not Wiggo, he has just shown us he's an absolute machine when it comes to racing, and that is what its all about.
BJ
And anyone impugning G's integrity can * the * off, frankly.
That's fair as well, my apologies.
I genuinely don't believe Sky are doping. I do believe they have a monetary advantage though and achieve many of the same things that doping does, but within the rules.
From a selfish point of view I would prefer a closer race, with more people in the mix. Hopefully the gap between them will tighten up in the 3rd week.
Thomas is still my favourite rider.
Lets not drug it down Guys, please.
😕
And anyone impugning G's integrity can * the * off, frankly.
Why? Seriously, what makes him so specially clean?
There are lots of people on these threads who sound like the worst of the Armstrong apologists.
I do believe they have a monetary advantage though and achieve many of the same things that doping does, but within the rules.
iirc sky are only the 2 or 3rd best funded team. 1 thing they do have though is Brailsford, I think there are very very few people like him in any sport.
And lets face it, Contador has mad Tinkof telling him to race every grand tour, as much a disadvantage as Brailsford is an advantage
The dude just gave out an ass kicking of the highest order thanks to his team dragging themselves up that hill.
Was the team the difference? It could simply be good management that has delivered not only lots of marginal gains but a great team too? I haven't watched it yet but it doesn't sound like the others had such good help from their teams?
1 thing they do have though is Brailsford
Comparable maybe to Ferguson or Woodward?
I dont think we'll see much today. Quintana and Contador will try to keep powder dry for bigger days to come. A break could go and survive up the final climb. Sky wont mind losing yellow as long as the main players are in the bunch so they wont want to chase.
Panned out almost exactly as I predicted. Uncanny.
😆
I didn't get it much better mind...
nemesis - Member
My prediction - about 5k to go, Quintana goes, Froome goes with him and shadows him until the line. AC dropped but loses a relatively small amount of time.POSTED 1 HOUR AGO #
Woodward, Woodward? They guy who almost destroyed the Lions? Must mean a different one surely?
Contador should of got his rest day steak here!![img] 
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Lunge, totally understand where you are coming from. It's the result of the baggage that pro-cycling has always carried with it. But..lets enjoy the fact there were 3 Brits in the top 7 today and 2 of the top 5 on GC.
'Hat' to Adam Yates for his ride too. First ever TdF Mountain stage and he burns off some of the best climbers in the world. Blimey. Image if Froome was a twin......
+1 great ride from Adam Yates.
I didn't publish my thoughts, but I had everyone marking each other and a french rider winning. Ah well.
I'm not a fan of Voekler so was glad to be spared his gurning.
You don't like this?
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c'mon, what's wrong with you? 🙂
I'm not a housewife 🙂
If I did that to housewives I'd be arrested!
it gives some deeply tedious people an opportunity to work themselves up into a dunning-kruger circle jerk which spunks gooey droplets of hearsay and rumour all over the delicious biscuits of threads like this.
quite magnificent....
Possibly the best comment on here ...ever....:-)
Bring on the Tourmalet and co tomorrow I say! Loving it.
You know what I'd really like to see. Sky consolidate Froome's lead while allowing G to ride up into a podium position. A 2-pronged attack like that would keep CF relatively fresh and safe, force rivals into chasing down G and hopefully give Sky if not a 1-2 then a 1-3. Be fantastic to see G up there, he really deserves it.
1 thing they do have though is Brailsford
Comparable maybe to Ferguson or Woodward?
Easily!
I love that Porte was told to go and steal bonus seconds from Quintana.
I thought there weren't any time bonuses* ?
*[Sean]bonifications[/Sean]
A 2-pronged attack like that would keep CF relatively fresh and safe, force rivals into chasing down G and hopefully give Sky if not a 1-2 then a 1-3. Be fantastic to see G up there, he really deserves it.
Sky's third rider is 39 minutes back, that would be quite an effort...
I don't think you can read too much into time gaps. When climbing at the limit, when they crack, they crack, and then time gaps become unrepresentative of the relevant capabilities. It's not linear, go just above your limit and you can blow in no time.
If they'd time trialled up the hill, I bet the differences would be less, it's just they had to follow Froome on account of already being behind, cracked, and thereafter it's a struggle to make the line never mind make it in good time. I think that's where Porte and G got back on, by riding to a point and then easing back instead of riding too far beyond the point of no return.
We might not have liked Brad for it but that's where he had strength to not follow these big attacks and just TT up to end with a small loss overall that he could make back elsewhere.
Hell of a ride. Be interesting to see the stats in comparison to the 'flawed geniuses' of the past; I hope they allay some of the (sadly inevitable) whispering that i'm pretty sure is already starting.
Just caught the highlights, I see sky fitted his good stem today.
think that's where Porte and G got back on, by riding to a point and then easing back instead of riding too far beyond the point of no return.
I doubt that any of them rode to the point where they bonked, to the point of no return, because with 3 days of big mountains and then some lumpy days, they just wouldn't recover.
Jesus! I believe I said before something about Porte being no.2 @ BMC...I reckon TJVG just seen his leadership ride up the road!!
Damn, too many what if's from the Giro in my head now!
Someone said above about letting G ride, that would be bloody fantastic, hope it happens!!
Interesting that it was Movistar that done the exploding, Quintana interview made me think He believes the Tour is over!
One day into the mountains? Anything can happen - Froome could blow completely, get ill, get injured. He can't believe that surely?
Just the way he was talking, watch the highlights on ITV4+1, just starting. I've over egged it a bit but watch his face!
Haha - edit, you'll have to watch pretty hard, the poker face is strong...
:D. After stage 1 I thought that Dowsett was weirdly upset that he hadn't won. I've since seen that it's his natural manner to seem devastated.
[doping] That was uber dodgy, it was very US Postal. And (don't pap) to see G up there as a classic specialist is even moar roapy IMO. I'm in two minds, Sky have just destroyed the Peloton with 3 riders, nearly 1-2-3'n (if they'd been Iranian everyone would be screaming EPO) against the very best which in classic cycling fan land = extreme doping but I just can't see how they'd keep it secret, naively, in this day and age I can't believe there isn't someone out there willing to sell their story, the £€$ would be huge and also (maybe?) extremely damaging the Murdoch empire. [/doping]
yawn...... yeah i believe the moon landings were a hoax to, negative BS.
PS. Froome is real.
Can't keep the finger out of the pie...
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The only way Team Sky is doping is if the riders themselves know nothing about it. Something ingested, undetectable and unknown to the riders themselves? I seriously doubt it; this is the Tour de France, not Batman.
In plain sight.
Excellent Lads.. lets deteriorate this into a speculation drugs speculation speculative fest.
Nice.
Go play somewhere else and take your ego balls with you.
vinnyeh - MemberCan't keep the finger out of the pie...
What a helmet (the doper not vinnyeh)
Come on it's fun, choose a side,
1) ZOMG Froomestrong is a massive doperer and dopez all day 'cos teh UCI is corrupt!!1!
2) Froom is so clean he's squeaky clean, English speakers don't dope, it's just those dirty Spaniards/Italians that dope. Marginal gains man, marginal gains.
3) Dunno.
Well said Bikebuoy.
Awesome performance and would have loved to have watched it as it happened rather than the highlights after not getting to the radio in time to not hear the result.
Amazing to see Thomas, Froome and Porte ride on and drop the rest.
EDIT: Who the **** follows LA on ****ter anyway? 😯
Sky's third rider is 39 minutes back, that would be quite an effort
He means 1st and 3rd, not 1st/2nd/3rd.
I for one concur, Geraint is a top rider and a great bloke, and is riding a stunning race, would love to see it rewarded. Doubt he'll last like that though sadly.
He means 1st and 3rd, not 1st/2nd/3rd.
D'oh, of course!
I suggest we have a doping discussion thread, separate from the daily race threads.
I shall start one now.
Excellent Lads.. lets deteriorate this into a speculation drugs speculation speculative fest.Nice.
Go play somewhere else and take your ego balls with you.
And exactly whose fault is it that a performance like that raises eyebrows amongst the 'fans' now? Only the extremely naive, the stupid or those who have been on Pluto waiting for communication to arrive for the last ten years would not at the very least have PEDs cross their mind watching todays stage. Face facts - on the surface Sky look like a modern day USP more than any other team. I don't want to think it, but I've seen too many epic performances proven erroneous not to be a bit cynical just because the team is British.
If you want to talk doping, why not just nip over to "The Clinic"... 😈
If we're banning doping talk can we also ban all those that haven't contributed to the other Tour threads, it feels like they're just jumping on the Froomestrong bandwagon 😉
And exactly whose fault is it that a performance like that raises eyebrows amongst the 'fans' now? Only the extremely naive, the stupid or those who have been on Pluto waiting for communication to arrive for the last ten years would not at the very least have PEDs cross their mind watching todays stage. Face facts - on the surface Sky look like a modern day USP more than any other team. I don't want to think it, but I've seen too many epic performances proven erroneous not to be a bit cynical just because the team is British.
+1
My problem isn't with Froome dominating the stage, or Porte riding well. They did what they are paid to do. They are both great climbers.
BUT add G to the mix. G is a great rider but he's not a great climber. He still managed to destroy the pure climbers and GC riders today though. That's where I get suspicious. It's all a little too much like when Hincapie started beating the climbers.
To be fair G has been excellent all year and has apparently lost a good bit of weight +
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Volta_ao_Algarve
Not mountains but hilly.
Thomas came in with yates, who's not exactly a gc rider, gallopin whom he beat in paris nice and valverde who been attacking on the final climb, not exactly out of his peer group. I think a lot of the supposed gc riders, Nibali and Uran for example have been shown up as not having any real form, Nibali has been shipping time for days
Froome would then have to be the only doper (or him, G and Porte).. just watching the highlights now and everyone else looks wrecked.
Hi,
This is my first year watching The Tour of France. My favourite rider is Chris Froome; my favourite team is Team Sky; me and my girlfriend both wear our Team Sky shirts when we go cycling together. Please can someone explain the different coloured jerseys? And also why the man wearing red and black is in second place and not Cav who has won more finishes than him?
Thanks
I'm now going to go and read up on doping in cycling; I'll come back tomorrow (when I know more about it) to share lots of my opinions.
I'm sorry for you. I’m sorry that you can’t dream big. I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles. But this is one hell of a race. This is a great sporting event and you should stand around and believe it. You should believe in these athletes, and you should believe in these people. I'll be a fan of the Tour de France for as long as I live. And there are no secrets — this is a hard sporting event and hard work wins it. So Vive le Tour forever!
Not sure who's is better, David's or Kinkkong's?
Today's thread has offered many chuckles 🙂
Not sure how I feel about today's race. Awesome stuff from Port and G. And Adam Yates as well. Totally love the fact that Froomey bluffed it out, telling the media it's not his job to attack, then acting like he's dying on the mountain, just before lighting up and hammering nails into everyone's coffins. But the rest has suddenly become a bit less exciting because of it 😕
Still looking forward to tomorrow though.
Race ain't over yet. We've yet to find out if Sky put too much effort in today.
I expected Porte and Thomas to coast up once Froome had gone - conserve as much energy as possible, but Thomas was still chasing attacks well down the field, while Porte put spectacular effort into coming second.
Let's see a few more days before we call this.
That said a quiet day tomorrow and an attack on the next Froome-ish stage and this could all be over before the Alps.
Porte wasn't involved much on the flat stages, or at least i don't remember him being in the Sky train which would explain his freshness. Thomas was (hence his GC placing atm), but i expect him to feel it over the next few days.
How much racing did Thomas do after the classics?
Oh, and Armstrong and his conspirators have a hell of a lot to answer for. We're in a situation now where one performance leads to accusations of doping.
Porte wasn't involved much on the flat stages, or at least i don't remember him being in the Sky train which would explain his freshness. Thomas was (hence his GC placing atm), but i expect him to feel it over the next few days.
About exactly what they have said, GT for the first week support, RP for the mountains.
Also looks like we need a Polka Dot Sky Jersey for tomorrow
Overall best climber classification
Total distance covered: 1510.8 KM
RANK RIDER RIDER NO. TEAM POINTS
1. GBRFROOME Christopher 31 TEAM SKY 51 pts
2. AUSPORTE Richie 35 TEAM SKY 40 pts
3. COLQUINTANA ROJAS Nairo Alexander 51 MOVISTAR TEAM 32 pts
[quote=monkeyfudger ]To be fair G has been excellent all year and has apparently lost a good bit of weight
Yeah, I remember other riders doing remarkably well because they'd "lost a good bit of weight"
Apologies for my cynicism - I wish I wasn't
LA has a lot to answer for.
Twunt.
Epic ride today, made me goosebumply..! 🙂
no_eyed_deer - Member
[s]LA[/s][b]The huge numbers of top riders who doped[/b] has a lot to answer for.
FIFY
Keeping dopings poster boy as the focus means others walk by quietly.
For Sky's side
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/9638483/Sean-Yates-parts-company-with-Team-Sky-as-Dave-Brailsfords-doping-cull-continues.html
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2014/jul/17/jonathan-tiernan-locke-ban-sacked-team-sky-cycling
The dope and we want nothing to do with you policy is a stance that is good for the wider sport.
However is was a great stage 🙂
I like that Gesink enjoyed himself so much he turned round and rode back down the hill:
https://app.strava.com/activities/345923267
aracer - Member
monkeyfudger » To be fair G has been excellent all year and has apparently lost a good bit of weight
Yeah, I remember other riders doing remarkably well because they'd "lost a good bit of weight"Apologies for my cynicism - I wish I wasn't
I'm with you on this.
Got to say that Froome is handling the media speculation really well – respect to the guy (and his PR team I assume)...
"I am sympathetic, but at the same time there needs to be a certain level of respect also."
I'm increasingly annoyed that I missed out on the stage everyone else watched yesterday. I watched froome put a decent but ultimately fairly small amount of time into his main rival whilst a few the other big names had terrible days.
Meanwhile everyone else seems to have watched some sort of epic duel between the GC contendors before Chris Froome Wheelied away from them at warp 1 whilst Voguing. I can't help but feel that as much as I enjoyed it, everyone else got to see something better.
As I saw it there was a 140km drag race which in the end blew up in the face of those that thought they could force sky into something bad, shame they left too much on the road. The bit that made it look more spectacular was the big names falling back almost crushed by the weight of their expectation.
no way in hell is G on the juice.
unless the entire sky outfit is running on premium (which i seriously doubt*) he'd be mental to risk his future and the history he has with sky, british cycling, the olympics, the track, etc...i challenge anyone who thinks otherwise outside for a girlie slap fight!
http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/le-tour-dopingspeculationrumourconjecture-thread
more slapping than Max Mosely on a quiet night out
more slapping than Max Mosely on a quiet night out
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I'm increasingly annoyed that I missed out on the stage everyone else watched yesterday. I watched froome put a decent but ultimately fairly small amount of time into his main rival whilst a few the other big names had terrible days.
Meanwhile everyone else seems to have watched some sort of epic duel between the GC contendors before Chris Froome Wheelied away from them at warp 1 whilst Voguing. I can't help but feel that as much as I enjoyed it, everyone else got to see something better.
Did you see it live or just the highlights?
Live
Very surprised then – it didn't come across well on the highlights but live I found it really exciting.
Sorry you didn't.
I did find it tremendously exciting, it just wasn't the race that the coverage seems to be touting it as.