[Closed] Ignorant MTB'ers -Derwent/Ladybower, yesterday.

Allways reckon if they cant hear hope pro 11 hub they won't hear a bell never really have a problem up here is Scotland I allway slow right down and I allway say thankyou as I pass

I was out in the Peaks yesterday, did about 35 miles up and down most of the popular climbs and descents in the Edale and Derwent areas. Saw absolutely loads of bikers and walkers and most walkers were very polite and stepped aside, many even held gates open for us, but there's always a group, normally, senior chaps, who spot you coming and then get into formation to block your path!
Having checked Memory Map when I got back I realise we'd ridden up the footpath to the top of Mam Tor, not one rambler seemed to object and most gave encouragement.
It does p155 me off when you get 1 or 2 toss pots who spoil it for the rest of us!

Old people can't hear very well and they don't really hear bells either, they get scared as they couldn't hear you approach and then even passing the other side of a double track at low speed can give them a fright...

They'll believe the world isn't what it used too be and young whippersnappers are going to fast, they'll get back to car / coach and finish the sudoku in the Daily Mail / Telegraph then proceed to drive at 40 mph through every 30 mph camera on the way home and claim its a conspiracy if they get a ticket.

This was my experience at the weekend.

i'm not anti-bells, but using a bell is not automagically 'polite'. If you approach a group of walkers and you know that you need to stop/slow down/etc then just stop/slow down/etc - don't start pinging and expect anyone to move for you. How many of us like it when we have to use the road and a car comes up behind us giving it a polite 'move over i'm coming through' on the car horn?! If you want long flowing trails without walkers then go find them.

Everyone just buy Hope Pro II's.

Bells - you can tell when they have heard you 'cos they react. A single Ping from 30m away then another at 10 m away if they haven't reacted. Couple this with "just letting you know I am here" - you are not using the bell to tell them to get out of your way but to alert them to your presence. then a thanks - if they let you past easily.

Be polite as well.

I do find the reactions much better when using a bell in this way. Walkers expect a bell to mean a bike is about

I have to agree with TJ. I don't just ping the bell and hope, you may have to do it again and i always say thankyou or have a quick chat with them as I/ we pass.
Its not hard to be polite; i think thats whats missing in the majority of cases.

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or the next best thing.... a Hope ProII freehub.

. The little pingy bell give about 90dB SPL at 1 metre. If you ding your be at about 16 metres your sound level will be diminished by about 24dB giving about 66dB add in wind factors, hearing loss (Many older people have a high frequency hearing loss) hoods and the fact that lots of walkers spend a lot of time talking and not listening for your nice polite bell, there is little chance they will hear you.

If you have something loud enough for them to detect you will probably scare them

Bell? Gay. I find speeding up to the back of them and then doing a massive skid, spraying them with grit and mud soon gets them moving. Makes me look cool too. BBBBRRRAAAAAP!

If you want to be an all day speed junkie spring & summer weekends then go to a trail centre not the Peaks.

If you want to be a speed junkie & use the Rights of Way in the Peaks spring & summer weekends, get up early & get out on the trails early. Currently my trail buddy & I start at 6.00 AM & get in a good four hour ride before things fill up. Or for day time riding outside of school holidays book a weekday off, Tuesdays & Wednesdays seam particularly people free.

On the Bridleway we the cyclist are supposed to Give Way to horse riders & walkers so if I am approaching a group spread out across the way that is what I do give way. If trying to overtake a group I use my bell & a friendly excuse me & if they chose not to let me pass easily I’ll shoulder the bike & walk past or wait for them to clear a section.

Two parties being ignorant of each other will remain two ignorant parties, be nice to all on the trail even if they are not. If necessary engage others in conversation & take off your cycle helmet & shades so you look less like an aggressor.

I have been around long enough to see my old past time of the 1970’s, motorcycle trail riding, marginalised by the introduction of aggressive scrambler type bikes, dress, & attitude. We walk, cycle, etc in the Peaks as a past time not as a sport. Embrace all because divided we are conquered & the National Park Quango’s will seek to legislate us out.

Keith T
Marple

take off your cycle helmet & shades so you look less like an aggressor.

or,

get one of these,
[img] [/img]

and one of these,
[img] [/img]

and walk with them!!

Buy an Orange, particularly the 5 or Patriot. They sound like machine gun fire on even the smoothest trails and even the most ardent of blocking parties will simply sh1t them selves at the sound of its approach (reminds them of the war you see).

I wonder if these old farts who deliberately block BW's do so to fell runners who are going much faster than themselves and can someone please tell me why the hell do a bunch of walkers go to both sides of a trail after seeing you coming down? It's great that they make room to let you pass then someone just moves back to the other side so reduces the amount of distance between you and them considerably - they really are worse than sheep sometimes --- AAAAAARRRRRGGGGGG

Get a stuka siren for downhills and an air raid siren for the level/ups. Sorted. Next problem.

All human life really is here isn't it?

Ozzo, perhaps their mystical powers of deduction have been ruined by too much Sanatogen and too many Werther's Originals? How dare they not know which side you intend to pass!

Thanks for all the replies, nice to get an overview of the STW attitude on this issue.

Funny how the older posters and those who are also walkers/climbers seem to be the most empathetic. Youth really is wasted on the young isn't it? 😉

Get a stuka siren for downhills and an air raid siren for the level/ups. Sorted. Next problem.

Bruce - Member

........................ there is little chance they will hear you.

If you have something loud enough for them to detect you will probably scare them

Not my experience at all. I find the polite bell works wonders - from 30 m away then repeated when closer if they haven't reacted. I am sure 90% of time it works well - coupled with being polite anyway

bigyinn

No, no war zone; but if I am going to chew the fat with a non-MTB trail user, yes frequently I take off my lid & glasses I just think its more friendly; also at 55 years of age I need an excuse to rest!
Keith T

As a walk leader. I have the same problems as the o.p. in trying to convince my mostly over 60s walking group that we mbters are a friendy bunch, who don't want to run them over, ruin the paths and like them are out to enjoy the countryside. It's been a long process, not helped by the odd numpty who witnessed by me has plowed though them.

I.M.O I find the walkers in the Lake District feel they own the trails and we shouldn't be on them.

We all have to get on. Our countryside is much used ( a good thing) and with an ever growing population, these sorts of things are going to become more of a problem.

Some people are just grumpy
We had a walker in the peaks take our photo and insist we were on a footpath and shouldn't be there (and was quite rude about it all). We told him that if he thought this was a footpath then he was clearly lost! (we had map to prove it) 🙂

On the otherhand we did Jacobs ladder route on Sunday and on the final section we waited for some walkers and they kindly told us thay were the last people for a bit and to go for it - nice people 😛

I just say hello to all the people I encounter and find 90% of they say hi back and we all get on with our days

Walkers have right of way. Fact.
Be polite to them regardless of how they might be to you. Try to avoid pissing the reasonable ones off. Some can't be helped.
If you don't want crowds don't ride around Ladybower on a sunny Sunday.
Use some common sense.
Enjoy the light nights - that's the time to mash-it-uuup.

Not so complicated. Ahh, common sense - complicated for some folk.

How dare they not know which side you intend to pass!

he doesn't care, he'd just like not to have to squeeze through the middle 🙁

Funny how the older posters and those who are also walkers/climbers seem to be the most empathetic.

hollow laughter in the case of distinctly middleaged [b]ozzo[/b] 🙂

Move to Scotland where walkers are in the minority and expect to be abused.

Move to Scotland

yeah but it's infested with Scottish people 🙁

In my experience a loud hub is much better than a bell. I've been in situations where I've rung the bell at walkers, only to have "get a bell" shouted at me as I ride past. On several occasions.

It got very annoying. For a while I actually started to suspected that humans were incapable of hearing the sound of a bike bell if it comes from behind them.

humans were incapable of hearing the sound of a bike bell if it comes from behind them

[b]FACT[/b]

i find that some walkers will deliberatley block you others will get out the way / talk to you etc i tend to slow down till they notice and then go past , i did nearly hit a women at firholmes who stepped out in front of me on the road some walkers do appear to be in a world of their own. I like to ride in the evening after about 4/5 get trails to myself just out interest can you ride all the way up to the top of win hill or from hope cross.

X2marple
i dont think people should dictate how and when people use the countryside within the confines if the law, i am a walker, climber and mtber and used to be a 4x4 (till someone nicked my landrover) in the peaks and should be allowed to use the countryside whenever i choose wearing what ever i want, should muslim women be asked to remove their vails when encountering walkers??? There are far more footpaths than bridleways, more bridleways than greenlanes yet the group that has the most access to the countryside and fought (literally) for their right to roam is the group that tries most to limit other peoples access to it.

Mass Ride up kinder on footpaths anyone?

Stonemonkey
You state “and should be allowed to use the countryside whenever i choose wearing what ever i want, should Muslim women be asked to remove their veils when encountering walkers???”

It was divisive & unfair of you to attempt to link my point of view with asking a Muslim woman wearing a veil to remove it when encountering walkers. The point I attempted to make was that many of us dress (including me with my reflective shades) in a manner that rightly or wrongly (like youths in hoodies) others can find threatening & that as my hat & glasses are worn for safety if I chose to stop to engage someone in conversation, be it about the weather, the scenery, the UK economy, or why I am on that particular trail, I just consider it friendly to remove my cycling hat & shades if the conversation develops into more than a few seconds.

My other point was to promote unity with other trail user’s not entrenched isolationism. Many riders I talk to & as you yourself state, pursue other outdoor pastimes like walking, climbing, canoeing, horse riding etc & there is a great commonality of interest, this needs to be exploited for the common good.

Neither did I put forward a view that you should not use the countryside whenever you choose. I put forward a point of view that riding at non-peak times (early morning/early evening) it is still possible to be one of a few on the trail not the many.

However, if I choose to ride out between 10.00hrs-17.00hrs I do recognize that on sunny weekends in spring & summer there will be many other trail users who want access to the same space as me & I tailor my riding style, route & route length accordingly.

You state “the group that has the most access to the countryside and fought (literally) for their right to roam is the group that tries most to limit other people’s access to it”
I agree with your sentiments. Without doubt bridleway use here on the west side of the Dark Peak, where I live, has increasing many fold particularly in the last decade, & usage conflicts will & do occur. However division & alienated from other user groups will make us vulnerable to the attempts of other parties who might seek to influence/lobby the National Park Body to apply specific legislate to restrict trail access within the boundaries of the National Park to cyclists.

Constructive debate & enlightenment remains the long game, but if more direct action was needed I would be there. Mass trespass has been done, how about a mass MTB ride on one of the Peak Districts A roads….

Keith T

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Hi keith

my muslim women comment was unfair , it was a bt of a joke in response to all the "racist" threads on here recently. I agree that when the peak is busy we need to be careful, i am certainly not the type of rider who goes speeding up to walkers but i do get the feeling we are much more tolerant of them than they are of us.

Anyway thinking of heading up bleaklow / crowden way ive heard its much quieter up there so if anyone knows any good routes.

Might see you on the hills keith

Mike ( grey turner 5 spot)

IIRC you can't ride all the way to the top of Win Hill from Hope Cross, only about 2/3 of the way up.

yeah but it's infested with Scottish people

But some of us English are weaseling our way in, ripe for a take-over 🙂

TBH I rarely meet walkers on trails up here and when I do they seem happy to see me and me them. Only really noticed trail militia down on the pennines if I'm honest.

I have a ping bell on all my bikes and ring ring on my tourer!

I still have hte pi$$ taken out of me till we approach walkers.

I don't care, I'll still have my bell on my XTR kitted bike!

Pook - Member

IIRC you can't ride all the way to the top of Win Hill from Hope Cross, only about 2/3 of the way up

Pook - Member

IIRC you can't ride all the way to the top of Win Hill from Hope Cross, only about 2/3 of the way up.

Cheers but you can ride all the way from the top down though , thats the best bit. 😀