[Closed] Ibis warranty dispute - chainstay damage to Ripmo V2

Just the remainder of that one ride without the plate?
I still think costmetic damage is pushing it a bit though, sorry.

clearly a manufacturing/design fault on the part of Ibis

Not necessarily. See it from the POV of a company who's probably seen a few of them jet-washed off, doused in bike cleaner that's killed the tape, etc.
It's a manufacturing defect if the tape was duff and it fell off but that's hard to prove either way. So while the damage isn't a warranty-able fault the reason the metal plate came off could be up for discussion.
Outcome might depends on the stock they have and how it's approached by you or the dealer - it may be down to goodwill rather than a clear warranty case.

Knowing this, they should have probably thought about reinforcing this area better against chain slap.

Looks like they did as it has the metal plate and to be fair to them it's a sensible way to do it. You could bolt it on but then some high chain pressure (a jam etc) might damage the carbon more easily. The way it's fitted is a bit like a mech hanger, it's a fail point / saver. Drawback is it needs spotting early before damage happens.

TBH that amount of chain slap on one ride suggests a poor choice of gears.

Just the remainder of that one ride without the plate?
I still think costmetic damage is pushing it a bit though, sorry.

I don't know exactly when the plate came off, but I would say 1-2 rides max, as I would have noticed the plate missing while doing a regular wash (it's been nothing but mud this summer). I live in the Alps and the trails here are rough, so this could easily happen within a single ride.

TBH that amount of chain slap on one ride suggests a poor choice of gears.

Please do explain...

Chain slap or chain suck that close to the chainring? I'd have thought slap occurs in the middle of the stay. Was it a new frame or full bike? Reason I'm asking is if it was an old drive chain that 'sucked' and knocked off the protector, then that's user error IMHO.

Not necessarily. See it from the POV of a company who’s probably seen a few of them jet-washed off, doused in bike cleaner that’s killed the tape, etc.
It’s a manufacturing defect if the tape was duff and it fell off but that’s hard to prove either way. So while the damage isn’t a warranty-able fault the reason the metal plate came off could be up for discussion.

A quick online search suggests that this is a pretty common problem on Ibis bikes:

https://www.mtbr.com/threads/ripley-v4-glued-parts-falling-off.1147837/

Chain slap or chain suck that close to the chainring? I’d have thought slap occurs in the middle of the stay. Was it a new frame or full bike? Reason I’m asking is if it was an old drive chain that ‘sucked’ and knocked off the protector, then that’s user error IMHO.

Brand new everything.

I don't have anything to offer in terms of whether it should be replaced or whatever, but I always get concerned when people talk about resale value of a bike - I don't understand why people buy a bike with thoughts of how much they'll get when it is sold on...I don't tend to buy stuff and look to sell it on as it tends to wear out, so I'm sure I'm not thinking the way I should be for resale value. It strikes me as odd.

A mountain bike ridden hard is going to show signs of usage, so accept it, enjoy the ride and don't rely on a massive amount as a resale amount if you do decide to sell it on.

Can you wrap that bit in inner tube? It will provide a bit of protection and could also dull the noice a bit.

I'm assuming you are running a clutch mech? If so, is the clutch on? I'd have guessed a clutch mech would reduce that amount of skelping - however, looking ta the picture, the stay does dip quite a lot so could be right at the point where the chain does 'flick' so strikes may be very common there.

I can see your frustration but from the POV of Ibis, I can't see that offering a whole new chainstay is reasonable for some scratched/chipped paint. The protector was a glued/taped on part rather than an integral part of the frame so comes under wear and tear I would suspect. Yes it failed early but perhaps it took a bit impact without you realising.

Use a better adhesive than Ibis did.

A quick online search suggests that this is a pretty common problem on Ibis bikes:
> https://www.mtbr.com/threads/ripley-v4-glued-parts-falling-off.1147837/

Regarding the above link, I think the OP's got a pretty good reason to be peeved off if this is a known problem and Ibis hasn't put out a general fix / notification to customers to keep an eye out for this issue.

Yes, we should all be checking our bikes over after each and every ride, but little things like this can and do get missed.

I wonder sometimes what you really get for your money with these ultra-premium, expensive brands. The glue-on chainstay protector on my lowly Giant has lasted 4 years, 3,000 miles and multiple washes and still hasn't budged an inch. That bike cost at most a third of what the OP probably paid for his Ibis so I'd be rightly narked off.

TBH even if they had offered to send you a new rear triangle (which as annoying as it is, IMO seems a bit much for some paint chips) you could be waiting months for it right now anyway.
Maybe you could ask them to send you some touch up paint as well as the new protector.

FWIW - Ibis have had the same or similar metal protector on their bikes since the original Mojos and the DW Link design with the dropped DS chainstay is also common.

To get that amount of chain rub/slap, you must've been toward the bottom of the cassette for a decent period of time...perhaps a bit more b-screw tension would've helped?

I don’t have anything to offer in terms of whether it should be replaced or whatever, but I always get concerned when people talk about resale value of a bike – I don’t understand why people buy a bike with thoughts of how much they’ll get when it is sold on…I don’t tend to buy stuff and look to sell it on as it tends to wear out, so I’m sure I’m not thinking the way I should be for resale value. It strikes me as odd.

Each to their own on this one. With bikes getting crazy expensive these days, I just like to reclaim some of their value and upgrade every 2-3 years. Exactly the same as most people do with cars. I think it's best to save this discussion for another thread though.

Can you wrap that bit in inner tube? It will provide a bit of protection and could also dull the noice a bit.

It's a good tip and exactly what I have done:

I’m assuming you are running a clutch mech? If so, is the clutch on? I’d have guessed a clutch mech would reduce that amount of skelping – however, looking ta the picture, the stay does dip quite a lot so could be right at the point where the chain does ‘flick’ so strikes may be very common there.

Yup, I always keep my clutch on while riding.

I think I'd be happy with a new plate and some form of written confirmation that if there's a future issue in that area the damage would not go against a warranty claim.

I wouldn't expect a new rear triangle - I think it's fair for Ibis to assume that you regularly check the bike over for defects like this before it does that sort of damage.

scotroutes

TBH that amount of chain slap on one ride suggests a poor choice of gears.

Yes, a slightly different gear would have changed the angle of the chain by several degrees, it could have been millimetres further from the chainstay

LOL

I've had a few Ibis's. Never suffered that problem but sticky things not sticking has definitely been an issue. Luckily with no consequences.

My V1 RipMo is 3 years old and after a year I noticed the (cosmetic) damage behind that plate under the DS chain stay. Ended up putting two layers of clear tape on there, and replacing when necessary.

I've not warrantied any of my Ibis's, but I have spoken/emailed them quite a lot and they've been fantastic (even sending me out need badge screws after mine fell out).

Ah, now I see the full photo, I can well imagine the slap. I'm not cosmetically precious about my bikes, but I'd be annoyed by that on a boutique steed.

I think I’d be happy with a new plate and some form of written confirmation that if there’s a future issue in that area the damage would not go against a warranty claim.

That is a good tip actually - thanks.

I wouldn’t expect a new rear triangle – I think it’s fair for Ibis to assume that you regularly check the bike over for defects like this before it does that sort of damage.

Again, this damage could easily have happened during the course of a single day out in the Alps. I frequently do uplift days, where I descend 5,000m+ in very rough terrain. This category of bike should be more than capable of taking this kind of riding. After all, the exact same frame is being raced in the EWS.

I’ve had a few Ibis’s. Never suffered that problem but sticky things not sticking has definitely been an issue. Luckily with no consequences.

My V1 RipMo is 3 years old and after a year I noticed the (cosmetic) damage behind that plate under the DS chain stay. Ended up putting two layers of clear tape on there, and replacing when necessary.

I’ve not warrantied any of my Ibis’s, but I have spoken/emailed them quite a lot and they’ve been fantastic (even sending me out need badge screws after mine fell out).

Thanks for sharing your experience. To be honest, I think that most bike brands are flooded with work due to the ongoing covid biking boom. I suspect my interaction with Ibis would have probably gone a little better under 'normal' circumstances.

Use a better adhesive than Ibis did.

I'll pass that message onto Ibis 😉

Daffy
Full Member

FWIW – Ibis have had the same or similar metal protector on their bikes since the original Mojos

Yup, and they've been falling off for most of that time too. The official fix used to be "araldite it back on and it'll stay on", which seemed to actually be true, which raises the question what the hell are they doing in the factory.

But that's a hell of a lot of chain slap damage for one ride. Not casting aspersions on the OP or anything but I suspect their warranty dude's looked at that and gone "one ride, my arse".

Ah, now I see the full photo, I can well imagine the slap. I’m not cosmetically precious about my bikes, but I’d be annoyed by that on a boutique steed.

Well, that's exactly it, I'd just expect better quality/attention to detail from the likes of Ibis.

But that’s a hell of a lot of chain slap damage for one ride. Not casting aspersions on the OP or anything but I suspect their warranty dude’s looked at that and gone “one ride, my arse”.

Fair point. I imported the bike from the UK, since it's impossible to get your hands on these in Switzerland until next year. The Ibis rep probably thinks that I ride it in the South Downs though (where the shop is located).

Whenever I buy a new bike I always add helicopter tape to the wear points on the frame, and a rubber/fabric chain stay protector that covers the lower chain stay. I wouldn’t trust one of those small aluminium stickers to offer adequate protection. I also like to keep my bikes looking decent so as to keep a decent 2nd hand value as I don’t keep my bikes forever.

Looking at the picture of the stay and chain in the lowest gear, you can see how close the stay is so I'm reckoning that is entirely possible in 1 or 2 rides of some real rough bumpy stuff. I hadn't realised it was quite that close, but hopefully the inner tube is going to do a decent job.

Not ideal, I can see how I'd be pissed off if I was you, but see their point too, it's not worthy of a new rear tri tbh.

I wonder if you could offer to get it repaired at a repairer, and see if they'd help out with costs?. Wouldn't really take much to make that good, my mate is a spray painter in aviation and does a bit of work with a local carbon frame repairer, you'd never tell the difference once he's done.

While you are protecting your chainstay I reccomend protecting the rear linkage as well.

I've followed what some Ibis owners reccomend and cut a neat flap of tape to divert small rocks from being chewed up in the linkage on my Ripmo AF.

I would be frustrated by that.

Having said that, I can also see why Ibis don't think it is new chainstay.

If I were you I would glue it back on, keep the tyre wrap going and in a couple of years time if you sell, it think it will be just part of the patina of a used bike.

FWIW, we just had a new Rocky Mountain fully wrapped and added chainstay inner tube before riding it.... I get protecting value, but it cost my son over £150 to get it sorted, and I am not sure if it will add that at resale.

While you are protecting your chainstay I reccomend protecting the rear linkage as well.

I’ve followed what some Ibis owners reccomend and cut a neat flap of tape to divert small rocks from being chewed up in the linkage on my Ripmo AF.

Thanks for the tip, but my V2 actually came with the Rock Flap pre-installed from Ibis. Saying that, let's see how long it lasts. My mate has one and lost it after his first ride.

FWIW, we just had a new Rocky Mountain fully wrapped and added chainstay inner tube before riding it…. I get protecting value, but it cost my son over £150 to get it sorted, and I am not sure if it will add that at resale.

I actually had the bike INVISIframed, but, ironically, the one area that it did not cover was this darn metal chainstay protector.

I wonder if you could offer to get it repaired at a repairer, and see if they’d help out with costs?. Wouldn’t really take much to make that good, my mate is a spray painter in aviation and does a bit of work with a local carbon frame repairer, you’d never tell the difference once he’s done.

I mean, I'd be happy with that. Problem is, it would probably cost more do get that done in Switzerland than for Ibis to just send me a new rear triangle XD

scotroutes

TBH that amount of chain slap on one ride suggests a poor choice of gears.

are you suggesting that he was in the granny when the big ring would have been better?

you have my sympathy op. things like this are irritating.

you have my sympathy op. things like this are irritating.

Thanks XD

IMO this is the problem with having to go via the bike shop for a warranty claim. You're never quite sure how well they convey the story to the manufacturer. It might be worth a direct email to Ibis explaining your point of view. Perhaps with some better photos to show that the carbon is damaged and not just stripped of paint. And maybe with some evidence of the distance it's covered - do you use anything like Strava or komoot for logging rides?

I would reverse the direction of the inner tube wrapping personally

IMO this is the problem with having to go via the bike shop for a warranty claim. You’re never quite sure how well they convey the story to the manufacturer.

With Kona both the shop and the manufacturer refused to inspect the frame. So the Kona warranty wss worthless to me. Friendly bike shop couldn't be bothered.

The area where most of your paint damage os isn't actually covered by the chainstay plate.

Its alot of damage for one ride regardless of where your riding id say though. In ibis' defence its for chain suck, not slap. You need to weigh up frame protection on your own i guess.

Also, its handy enough to repair, ive got two ibis bikes atm and ive installed the chain suck plate on one of them. Clean it, rough it up, fill the chips, paint and then bond the plate on. Make sure its all degreased and your epoxy is nice and warm. It'll never come off again.

Ibis warranty have been great with me in the past going above and beyond to help me out when they didn't have to.

I had a RipMo v1 and this exact same thing happened to me. Also happened on my HD3 and my HD, so yes it is an old issue that Ibis don't seem to want to resolve once and for all.

I've also had issues with support from 2Pure. Based in the Channel Islands, they won't deliver direct to me, recommend I go to my local store instead (fair enough) except they then tell my local store they won't ship to Jersey. I wouldn't buy another Ibis again until there is a different UK supplier.

Just for a bit of balance, I found a crack in the weld of my lower pivot on my Ripmo AF and as I'd bought it online from Sunset cycles in Wales (I'm near Brighton). I emailed 2pure with pictures of the crack and proof of purchase etc and asked if I could deal directly with them rather than have to deal via sunset.
They were super helpful and I had a response from Ibis via 2pure the very next morning and Ibis shipped the replacement front triangle a few days later from the US to 2pure, which arrived with me the week after.

Chain suck? in 2021? On a full sus with 1X gearing? Seriously? Not being sarky, is that really a thing on any bikes that modern?

Its a chainsuck plate, not a chain slap plate. Its function is to protect the frame in that scenario.

Fistly, this:

Chain suck? in 2021? On a full sus with 1X gearing? Seriously? Not being sarky, is that really a thing on any bikes that modern?

Secondly, even if chain suck was still a thing, that plate won't protect the frame from it - it's too far back and too low:

magoos_mate
Free Member
Its a chainsuck plate, not a chain slap plate. Its function is to protect the frame in that scenario.

It's not - even though it's called a chainsuck plate. The original plates which were designed to protect from chainsuck and slap used to completely wrap around the DS chainstay near to where the chainrings were. These ones are clearly now just to protect from chain whip damage - they're much reduced in height and longer in length.

Aside from the warranty question that's a tidy job with the inner tube. I'd leave it like that - I've always thought an inner tube around the chain stay speaks volumes about the owner, but appreciate that is a high-end frame and the aesthetics may not be to everyone's taste.

If it was a chain slap plate it would protect the frame from chain slap. It doesn't do that though as you can see from ops pic. They never have protected from wear in that area, it's simply not covered by the plate.

Its for chainsuck 100%, hence the name.

Pff, premium brand should come with premium warranty.

Remember shop telling me I’m riding in the wrong gear after this happening during demo basically pootling. My view is £10k bike I can ride any gear I damn well want. Even more so when website show riders hucking 10ft drops but I get into trouble bunny hopping off a curb.

Never had any of this silliness with modern Santa Cruz.

If a new plate doesn't cover up all the chips then the plate needs a bit of a re-design, moulded sticky backed protectors from other brands are pliable enough to work on several different brands and would look better than an innertube, some people on here have put nukeproof ones on their bird frames for example. Tiny chainrings add to the chipping issue, I only buy frames that can take up to a 34t chainring, some frames out there have a 30t max while simultaneously leaving the chainstay vulnerable.
Come to think of it, shouldn't a chain suck plate go behind the teeth of the chainring on the side of the stay to actually be of any use, its just not fit for purpose for a spread of gears chain slap or suck protection.

If it was a chain slap plate it would protect the frame from chain slap. It doesn’t do that though as you can see from ops pic. They never have protected from wear in that area, it’s simply not covered by the plate.

How would it have protected from chainslap if it wasn't there? Did you read the OP's post?

You can clearly see from the OP photos that had the plate been there, the chain would've hit the plate before hitting the small amount of exposed Cf on the inside of the DS chainstay. Hence it would've adequately protected from chainslap.

The majority of the damage is off to the right of where the plate sits. If the plate covered that area op wouldnt be so worried about the resale value as itd be covered by the plate.

Im on my third Ibis frame, ive repaired two in that area. 1 plate replacement and paint chips, and one just for paint chips.

Its really not a big deal imo 🤷

As above, when i buy a frame for over 3k i don't mind having to make repairs due to the manufacturers inability to design a product properly

Somebody upload a pic of the underside with the plate on so we can see how well covered the section is, going off the residue mark it doesn't look properly protected, maybe get a sample piece of titanium sheet of Ebay and fashion some extender pieces for the replacement plate for better coverage.