I'm considering getting an ebike soon and whilst I've more or less decided on full fat I keep coming back to the alloy Orbea Rise LT with the EP801 RS motor and 630W battery. It's seems to offer almost FF power but with considerably less weight. All the reviews seem very positive but the only thing putting me off it is the rattle/clunk that the Shimano motors are known for... but is it that big of a deal? Any Rise owners on here?
If not the Rise I'd be after a Bosch CX Gen 5 bike, and the two currently on my list are an Orbea Wild H20 and a Cube Stereo One44 Race. The Whyte E-160 RS ticks all the boxes too but it's fugly.
I did consider an alloy Levo SL as I am partial to the big S but it's perhaps under powered.
So... as per title, budget is 4K max and I need 4 pot brakes and no less than a Fox 36, Marz Z1 or RS Lyrik... so no Suntours, RS 35s or Psylos etc. I prefer Shimano drivetrains but not averse to SRAM.
Cheers!
What rattle clunk? Mine doesn't have that feature.
Ive got an LT H10 with the 600 battery. It's silly fun.
I have a climb that takes 15mins using leg power. It's sub 5 on the rise and it's just as fast downhill and I did 1200m of climb yesterday and still had 50% battery. Only issue is I lost the stash tool after about 6 rides.
I'm selling kenevo because I'm never riding it again the rise is too much fun.
Some other Bosch options, depending what size you need. With plenty of change for a range extender.
https://winstanleysbikes.co.uk/norco-fluid-vlt-c1-140-2024-electric-bike
What rattle clunk? Mine doesn't have that feature.
Ive got an LT H10 with the 600 battery. It's silly fun.
I have a climb that takes 15mins using leg power. It's sub 5 on the rise and it's just as fast downhill and I did 1200m of climb yesterday and still had 50% battery. Only issue is I lost the stash tool after about 6 rides.
I'm selling kenevo because I'm never riding it again the rise is too much fun.
Good to hear yours doesn't rattle, and that you're enjoying the bike.
From what I've read the noise happens when you're not pedalling and the motor's clutch disengages. Its worse on bumpy terrain apparently.
Here's an example...
Some people are more sensitive to it than others, but I like a silent bike so a noise like that would wind me up.
Some other Bosch options, depending what size you need. With plenty of change for a range extender.
https://winstanleysbikes.co.uk/norco-fluid-vlt-c1-140-2024-electric-bike
Neither are in my size unfortunately, and both SX rather than CX... but thanks for taking the time to look!
it is the rattle/clunk that the Shimano motors are known for... but is itthatbig of a deal? Any Rise owners on here?
Eh ?
My 2024 Orbea Rise creaked like a bastard when I got it. I couldn't face the local stockist so got an ebike specialist to sort it. (John at Electric Bike Clinic, Stirling) and it's all good now. Just needed the bolts torqued greased and fitted correctly.
Had an absolute hoot. I can only get 800m of climbing out of mine but the Ochils are steep and I'm trying to keep up with full-fat eebs.
(If you can afford the extra £k I'd go Amflow).
I've done 2800km in the last year and have had so much fun 🙂
Here's an example...
From three years ago. Not heard a Shimano motor do that for longer than that, myself.
it is the rattle/clunk that the Shimano motors are known for... but is itthatbig of a deal? Any Rise owners on here?
Eh ?
My 2024 Orbea Rise creaked like a bastard when I got it. I couldn't face the local stockist so got an ebike specialist to sort it. (John at Electric Bike Clinic, Stirling) and it's all good now. Just needed the bolts torqued greased and fitted correctly.
Had an absolute hoot. I can only get 800m of climbing out of mine but the Ochils are steep and I'm trying to keep up with full-fat eebs.
(If you can afford the extra £k I'd go Amflow).
I've done 2800km in the last year and have had so much fun 🙂
No noise from the motor at all? Other than the electronic whirr obviously. I posted a video above that demonstrates it.
I don't mine torquing and greasing bolts. Had to do it every few rides on my old Demo 8 😆
Glad you like the bike though. If sticking to "buy the bike you like not the motor" then the Rise is what I'm after, although I reckon I'd still be happy with a Wild too.
No noise from the motor at all?
There is when it's assisting but not the loudest by any means (my friends have a mix of motors). Tyre thrumb and various shrieks and cries as riders topple is all part of the symphony.
More of a whirr than anything.
I've just been through this dilemma.
After borrowing a Levo SL and an Orbea Rise (turned up to 85nm) and hiring a Kenevo SL I decided I needed a full power big battery bike. For context when I borrowed the Rise I was with a mates on an Amflow and a Gen 3 Turbo Levo, I couldn't keep up on the hills and I was running out of battery towards the end of the ride - they had plenty left.
Couldn't stretch to an Amflow so I decided I wanted something Bosch Gen 5 or maybe a Brose Turbo Levo. I definitely didn't want headset routing because it's just a stupid idea, so that knocked the Orbea Wild, Cube 177 and a few others off my list.
I eventually went with a Bosch CX Gen5 Whyte Kado RS, it's not the best looking ebike, it's not the spec I would have chosen - basic Zeb fork, basic shock, Sram DB8 brakes and Sram T type drivetrain (prefer Shimano) but hopefully the frame is designed to cope with UK conditions.
And it rides really well despite the basic fork and shock. The last few weeks I've ridden more than I have done in a long time. I've even started commuting again a couple of times a week. I love it.
Only downside is the 25kg weight when you need to lift it over a gate or fence but that's going to be the same with any full power bike with an 800wh battery unless you up the budget and buy an Amflow or other DJI powered bike.
I’ve had various rattles on my Rise, some of it from the motor, but mostly from worn pivot bearings, as it’s eaten ANOTHER set. The new LT version looks to have addressed the inherent lack of frame stiffness that causes this though (plus I’m fat). I’ve never felt the need for more motor power than it has (and it’s still on factory settings so does have a little more available). Range-wise I can get 1000m+ elevation if I’m careful (carbon frame, so smaller battery). Easily over 1000m with the range extender plugged in. The worst issue I’ve had is that the stock Race Face wheels were utter shite - freehubs failing after only a few miles (I went through three). Credit here to Leisure Lakes for sorting me with shiny new Hope wheels FOC. Oh, and the battery just stopped working for no apparent reason one day - sorted quickly under warranty. Motor still fine after two years. Although now I’ve said that, it will almost certainly shit itself and die today.
Just a cursory check on tinterweb 99 Bikes have the H10 Rise at £4300 reduced from £5999 that gives you the Fox 36 and the EP8 motor .
But as I always advise any potential EBike buyers you need to buy local if you can , how near they are to you I don't know ?
As for 4 pot brakes , when I bought mine 3 years ago the shop asked if I wanted to upgrade , I said I'd see how I got on , 3 years on zero issues braking wise but then I don't charge hard !
Your original question motor rattle, not something I get overly bothered about personally, frame bearings have been fine . Had a motor issue this year out of warranty Madison replaced it FOC with a 2 year warranty 👍Had to pay the shop the labour etc but I would have had to any.
Also headset cable routing? I somehow dodged a bullet there , I've got the Acros headset but it's external cabling , yay ! 👍
I originally had a full fat Kona Remote felt like a supertanker which I think you'll find will be the same for a lot of them although the weights have come down.
The Rise appealed to me but it was carbon and expensive when first launched , the alloy version is more sensibly priced and you'd be hard pushed to tell it's not carbon such is the finish . Quite a few people have been surprised as well . I'm not a fan of carbon MTBs anyway so it suits me .
In summary it's like a trail bike with a little help , I'm never going to keep up with full fats on it but never expected to.
What do you mean underpowered? As in, you want the bike to be doing all the work?
I’ve got a Rise m10 LT 630wh. it has the ep801 motor
There is no rattle on the ep801 I think the older ep8’s were less reliable and more noisy.
I love how it rides. And I think it’s more efficient than an Amflow but that’s where it’s all guessing
Quality control is shite on them, the headset is pure junk (as is the manufacturing tolerance of the headset cup), and the rear suspension creaks (when not maintained) and it’s a bugger to setup.
I test rode the last gen Levo, and the Whyte . At tat time the Rise was the best compromise of everything for me
Power is definitely helpful IMO. Ether that’s going up super steep stuff, or dispatching boring climb fireroads
The Rise ep801 is 85nm 400 watts max . Most full fat are 600w + Yes you do notice it. I followed a couple of Avinox bikes up the first Llandegla first 3 mile gentle climb a couple of days back. I could keep up with them just. I was blowing out of my arse at the top and they were just chatting.
Talking to people who have Avinox bikes they don’t use all the power all the time, but it’s nice to have it.
I would stretch to that H10 above if you can.
I had a gen 1 Rise M10 and have a 2025 M10 LT with the EP801 motor.
Power - it depends on your expectations and who you're riding with. The full torque/limited power of the Rise means you'll get up stuff that's just as steep, only not quite as quickly. If you're riding with people on full fat bikes at full pace you're going to have to put a bit more effort in than they are but you can do it.
Weight - that's what tipped it for me. A few extra kg on a bike is noticeable in how it handles - it does become more of a steamroller, less agile, and more tiring (on the shoulders/upper body) to ride. OP mentions the Wild - that's a great bike, but it is very different to the Rise. (The default Wild is much more of an Enduro sled than a trail bike, but there's also a short travel Wild that you'd *think* might be more like a full power Rise. 8.40 in this review )
Range - I'm 85kg on the 630 battery and I get a load more range than full power bikes on 750 or bigger. It's really hard to measure because it does depend on HOW you're riding. If you're at the sweet spot cadence where the bikes giving most assistance all the time then you get less, but my 'rangefinding' ride when I first got it gave me 1600m, 50km with 20% remaining on Trail the whole time. The Avinox motor is definitely impressive but if you use that power it really eats the battery. A mate who has one has ended up tuning it down because he was struggling to get more than 1000m of climb out of his 800 battery (which puts the bike more than a kg heavier than a Rise M10 as well)
Noise - theres some whine from the motor and there is some 'clatter' when you're freewheeling/descending on rough ground. I'd not consider it an issue, and definitely wouldn't be a deciding factor for me. I tend to be focused on other things when I'm actually doing anything interesting on the bike.
Ask nearly anyone and they'll tell you that the part of riding that is most important is the descents and Singletrack and that's actually when the motor in an e-bike is least important.
Ask nearly anyone and they'll tell you that the part of riding that is most important is the descents and Singletrack and that's actually when the motor in an e-bike is least important.
Said it loads of time on here. People are generally far too focused on the 'e' and not enough on the 'bike'. It needs, primarily, to be a good handling, well designed, well specced Trail / Enduro MTB, with geometry that works for your body shape and size. And then make sure the motor and battery is a good option.
Loads of big, naff lumps around with compromised suspension and geometry that are selling because they have an enormous battery and the most powerful motor option.
Ask nearly anyone and they'll tell you that the part of riding that is most important is the descents and Singletrack and that's actually when the motor in an e-bike is least important.Loads of big, naff lumps around with compromised suspension and geometry that are selling because they have an enormous battery and the most powerful motor option.
Base model Levo 4. I'm sure the geometry is completely sorted and the motor should now have solved all the issues with earlier spec stuff, and it's got a huge 840wh battery.
But the *claimed* weight is 26kg and you've got to add pedals to that and possibly heavier tyres and fluid. I'm really tempted by a Haibike Pinion but it's the weight that puts me off (and they're still supposed to be under 25kg and theres some real benefit to it)
A mate has a carbon Rise, not sure which model but it has Fox factory fork and shock. He waited almost 8 months (warranty claim) for a new battery when the original failed (specific size and shape that will only fit a Rise) after less than a year and has also had to replace the battery connection since the warranty ran out. He's said he wouldn't buy another one
I've just been through this dilemma.
After borrowing a Levo SL and an Orbea Rise (turned up to 85nm) and hiring a Kenevo SL I decided I needed a full power big battery bike. For context when I borrowed the Rise I was with a mates on an Amflow and a Gen 3 Turbo Levo, I couldn't keep up on the hills and I was running out of battery towards the end of the ride - they had plenty left.
Couldn't stretch to an Amflow so I decided I wanted something Bosch Gen 5 or maybe a Brose Turbo Levo. I definitely didn't want headset routing because it's just a stupid idea, so that knocked the Orbea Wild, Cube 177 and a few others off my list.
I eventually went with a Bosch CX Gen5 Whyte Kado RS, it's not the best looking ebike, it's not the spec I would have chosen - basic Zeb fork, basic shock, Sram DB8 brakes and Sram T type drivetrain (prefer Shimano) but hopefully the frame is designed to cope with UK conditions.
And it rides really well despite the basic fork and shock. The last few weeks I've ridden more than I have done in a long time. I've even started commuting again a couple of times a week. I love it.
Only downside is the 25kg weight when you need to lift it over a gate or fence but that's going to be the same with any full power bike with an 800wh battery unless you up the budget and buy an Amflow or other DJI powered bike.
Appreciate the reply.
I ride alone 99% of the time and the one guy I do occasionally ride with has no desire for an eBike (he's a TT racer so fit as a fiddle!), so I think the range on the Rise would be enough with the bigger or the two available batteries.
The Whytes do seem very good for the money. The E-160 I was looking at comes with Fox 38, SRAM AXS and DT Swiss wheels which is a compelling package.
What do you mean underpowered? As in, you want the bike to be doing all the work?
Yes, I'd likely be doing more work on steeper climbs and worried about range on bigger days out.
Same reason I'm discounting any TQ equipped bikes like the Trek Fuel EXE XT (which would otherwise be ideal).
I’ve had various rattles on my Rise, some of it from the motor, but mostly from worn pivot bearings, as it’s eaten ANOTHER set. The new LT version looks to have addressed the inherent lack of frame stiffness that causes this though (plus I’m fat). I’ve never felt the need for more motor power than it has (and it’s still on factory settings so does have a little more available). Range-wise I can get 1000m+ elevation if I’m careful (carbon frame, so smaller battery). Easily over 1000m with the range extender plugged in. The worst issue I’ve had is that the stock Race Face wheels were utter shite - freehubs failing after only a few miles (I went through three). Credit here to Leisure Lakes for sorting me with shiny new Hope wheels FOC. Oh, and the battery just stopped working for no apparent reason one day - sorted quickly under warranty. Motor still fine after two years. Although now I’ve said that, it will almost certainly shit itself and die today.
That's a bit concerning about the wheels. Race Face usually make some solid stuff. Are the hubs Shimano?
I'm not as light as I was!
As for 4 pot brakes , when I bought mine 3 years ago the shop asked if I wanted to upgrade , I said I'd see how I got on , 3 years on zero issues braking wise but then I don't charge hard !
Your original question motor rattle, not something I get overly bothered about personally, frame bearings have been fine . Had a motor issue this year out of warranty Madison replaced it FOC with a 2 year warranty 👍Had to pay the shop the labour etc but I would have had to any.
Also headset cable routing? I somehow dodged a bullet there , I've got the Acros headset but it's external cabling , yay ! 👍
I originally had a full fat Kona Remote felt like a supertanker which I think you'll find will be the same for a lot of them although the weights have come down.
The Rise appealed to me but it was carbon and expensive when first launched , the alloy version is more sensibly priced and you'd be hard pushed to tell it's not carbon such is the finish . Quite a few people have been surprised as well . I'm not a fan of carbon MTBs anyway so it suits me .
In summary it's like a trail bike with a little help , I'm never going to keep up with full fats on it but never expected to.
I had 2 pot brakes on a previous bike and they were fine (and have cable TRP Spyres on my gravel bike) but my last two MTBs have had 4 pots and I like the confidence they give in those "oh shit!" moments!
It's funny, from the replies so far the noise doesn't seem to be a issue but I asked the same question on the emtb forum and responses have been the opposite.
Headset routing is less than ideal but I'd just pay a shop to do any cable work if I had to.
I'm the same, would much prefer an alloy frame as I'd be constantly worried every little scratch was a crack. I know that's daft but that's just me.
As above, the only person I need to keep up with is myself. I'm pretty much Billy No Mates when it comes to biking. Part of me wants a nimble trail bike and part of me wants something to just plough through everything.
I’ve got a Rise m10 LT 630wh. it has the ep801 motor
There is no rattle on the ep801 I think the older ep8’s were less reliable and more noisy.
I love how it rides. And I think it’s more efficient than an Amflow but that’s where it’s all guessing
Quality control is shite on them, the headset is pure junk (as is the manufacturing tolerance of the headset cup), and the rear suspension creaks (when not maintained) and it’s a bugger to setup.
I test rode the last gen Levo, and the Whyte . At tat time the Rise was the best compromise of everything for me
Power is definitely helpful IMO. Ether that’s going up super steep stuff, or dispatching boring climb fireroads
The Rise ep801 is 85nm 400 watts max . Most full fat are 600w + Yes you do notice it. I followed a couple of Avinox bikes up the first Llandegla first 3 mile gentle climb a couple of days back. I could keep up with them just. I was blowing out of my arse at the top and they were just chatting.
Talking to people who have Avinox bikes they don’t use all the power all the time, but it’s nice to have it.
I would stretch to that H10 above if you can.
Good to know you're happy with the EP801 on yours.
As you say, the bike does appear to be a great compromise of everything.
I have read elsewhere that Orbea QC is a bit shit, but once rebuilt properly they seem fine. It's the same with the Cube One series too I believe. Badly torqued and under greased from the factory. Less than ideal but easy to remedy.
I had a gen 1 Rise M10 and have a 2025 M10 LT with the EP801 motor.
Power - it depends on your expectations and who you're riding with. The full torque/limited power of the Rise means you'll get up stuff that's just as steep, only not quite as quickly. If you're riding with people on full fat bikes at full pace you're going to have to put a bit more effort in than they are but you can do it.
Weight - that's what tipped it for me. A few extra kg on a bike is noticeable in how it handles - it does become more of a steamroller, less agile, and more tiring (on the shoulders/upper body) to ride. OP mentions the Wild - that's a great bike, but it is very different to the Rise. (The default Wild is much more of an Enduro sled than a trail bike, but there's also a short travel Wild that you'd *think* might be more like a full power Rise. 8.40 in this review )
Range - I'm 85kg on the 630 battery and I get a load more range than full power bikes on 750 or bigger. It's really hard to measure because it does depend on HOW you're riding. If you're at the sweet spot cadence where the bikes giving most assistance all the time then you get less, but my 'rangefinding' ride when I first got it gave me 1600m, 50km with 20% remaining on Trail the whole time. The Avinox motor is definitely impressive but if you use that power it really eats the battery. A mate who has one has ended up tuning it down because he was struggling to get more than 1000m of climb out of his 800 battery (which puts the bike more than a kg heavier than a Rise M10 as well)
Noise - theres some whine from the motor and there is some 'clatter' when you're freewheeling/descending on rough ground. I'd not consider it an issue, and definitely wouldn't be a deciding factor for me. I tend to be focused on other things when I'm actually doing anything interesting on the bike.
Ask nearly anyone and they'll tell you that the part of riding that is most important is the descents and Singletrack and that's actually when the motor in an e-bike is least important.
That's really good info, thank you.
For riding on my own, on the trails I usually ride I do think the Rise would be almost perfect.
I've got a dodgy knee and less time to ride than I used to so just need some extra help on the climbs and the ability to get a few more runs in.
I'll check out that review as I'm still considering the Wild (alloy ST version).
Ask nearly anyone and they'll tell you that the part of riding that is most important is the descents and Singletrack and that's actually when the motor in an e-bike is least important.Said it loads of time on here. People are generally far too focused on the 'e' and not enough on the 'bike'. It needs, primarily, to be a good handling, well designed, well specced Trail / Enduro MTB, with geometry that works for your body shape and size. And then make sure the motor and battery is a good option.
Loads of big, naff lumps around with compromised suspension and geometry that are selling because they have an enormous battery and the most powerful motor option.
I totally get that, but the Shimano motor is getting on a bit now and I believe not as easy to get serviced out of warranty.
The bike part of the Rise does seem pretty sorted though, as does the Wild.
Ask nearly anyone and they'll tell you that the part of riding that is most important is the descents and Singletrack and that's actually when the motor in an e-bike is least important.Loads of big, naff lumps around with compromised suspension and geometry that are selling because they have an enormous battery and the most powerful motor option.
Base model Levo 4. I'm sure the geometry is completely sorted and the motor should now have solved all the issues with earlier spec stuff, and it's got a huge 840wh battery.
But the *claimed* weight is 26kg and you've got to add pedals to that and possibly heavier tyres and fluid. I'm really tempted by a Haibike Pinion but it's the weight that puts me off (and they're still supposed to be under 25kg and theres some real benefit to it)
The alloy Levo 4 would be my very high on my list but it's over 5K. Then if I was spending that much I'd also be looking at the Avinox equipped Megamo Reason.
Someone mentioned buying local, which I'd live to but only have the option of Trek, Cube and Specialized... and no huge discounts like buying online.
A mate has a carbon Rise, not sure which model but it has Fox factory fork and shock. He waited almost 8 months (warranty claim) for a new battery when the original failed (specific size and shape that will only fit a Rise) after less than a year and has also had to replace the battery connection since the warranty ran out. He's said he wouldn't buy another one
That sucks. I have heard mixed reports on their after sales support.
That sucks. I have heard mixed reports on their after sales support.
Apparently the distributor/importer had no spare batteries in the UK at the time, buying it online from a shop 5 and a half hours drive away and having to sort it though phone calls and another Orbea dealer probably didn't help either (the shop that did the work charged him and Orbea would only cover the cost of the actual battery). I've seen some good deals on Whyte eltyes lately, could be an option but probably gonna be over budget if 4k max
There’s a few ex-display Treks on here at a good price and within your £4K budget.
There’s a few ex-display Treks on here at a good price and within your £4K budget.
I've got a Trek Roscoe 9 at the moment and love it, so would definitely consider the Rail at that price.
I'll go check out some reviews and videos.
I had a Gen1 Rise, it was an OK bike but things have moved on a lot from there in the eBike world... OK so the Gen2 Rise is better in many respects, but it still has the Shimano EP8 motor and a reputation for flexible back ends and poor bearing life.
Is £4k an absolute hard limit...? Do you NEED full power...?
If you can compromise on the budget, even just by £500, then look at finding a deal on a 2025 Mondraker Crafty R or a Whyte Kado RS... Both will give you a carbon frame, Gen5 CX motor, 800Wh battery, great geometry and decent spec... Both ride brilliantly too!
If you can compromise on the latter, then take a look here...
Lighter than the alloy rise, MUCH better chassis (I have one of these now), the Bosch SX motor doesn't have the same level of torque but my god it's a lot of fun to ride, and with 600W peak output, if you can spin those pedals fast enough it can keep up with full fat eBikes on less steep terrain! 400Wh battery isn't big, but you can get a 250Wh range extender to go on it which will give it similar range to the Rise with the bigger battery...
A little over budget but I'd choose one of these over a Rise personally
https://winstanleysbikes.co.uk/whyte-kado-rs-29-inch-2025-electric-bike#187=4593
If you have a Specialized dealer near you then they are awesome for warranty work, even if you've bought the bike elsewhere.
BC discount at Tredz can help nudge some more bikes under the 4k mark (and they accept NHS Cycle2Work if that's the reason for your 4k limit)
@mboy I can't go above 4K sadly.
I may be coming round to the Wild ST H20 or above linked ex-display Trek Rail 8 Gen 5 now. Both alloy, which I'd be happier with. The Trek in particular as it has pretty much the same spec as my Roscoe 9 and no cable tourism so easy to swap my Deity cockpit onto. Plus their warranty is very good and I have a dealer local to me. The Wild does seem like it would be more fun though.
Is the Wild a bearing muncher like the Rise?
I've never fancied a Canyon for some reason. Just never a brand I've felt drawn to. They've had battery issues recently too I hear?
@pothead That seems like a lot of bike for the money but sadly 400 notes over budget.
@eddd I do have a Spesh dealer nearby and they've been great in the past when I had a Demo 8 and SX Trail. I'd honestly love an alloy Levo 4 but I'm already stretching my limit at 4K. I'll be going the V12 finance route over 36 months so need to keep the repayments under a set amount.
All this talk about rubbish bearings is news to me , after 3 years with my Rise that's some thing I haven't had a problem with?
Early on I had issues with the suspension linkage which seemed to be a known fault, Orbea replaced mine and it's been fine ever since, maybe that's the cause?
I've never fancied a Canyon for some reason. Just never a brand I've felt drawn to. They've had battery issues recently too I hear?
Their own proprietary batteries they use on Shimano powered bikes, yes...
NOT Bosch powered ones, as Bosch don't allow 3rd party hardware to be used...
I may be coming round to the Wild ST H20 or above linked ex-display Trek Rail 8 Gen 5 now. Both alloy, which I'd be happier with.
Both bikes are MUCH heavier in alloy than in carbon for what it's worth...
If you can find a way to see an extra £500 onto the budget, both the Whyte Kado RS and the Mondraker Crafty R would be a good upgrade both in terms of weight and performance/spec over the alloy Wild or Rail... An extra £500 up front really isn't a lot in the grand scheme of things for a lighter, better specced bike that rides nicer IMO.
GT eForce Amp+ at Paul's cycles looks nice.Money left over for a few upgrades as well.
I'd get the Wild. The more affordable Rises aren't much lighter (due to specced parts as well as heavier ally frame)
But.. I'd also say that any choice will be correct and you won't regret any of those mentioned. All good eebs 👍
It does depend on what you want and a bit on you.
I'm 70kg and rode a kenevo sl which is 5kg lighter than a friend's old wild. The wild is a heavy beast.
My kenevo was pretty fun but the rise is slightly lighter, has a much bigger battery and range, at least double +, but for me it rides differently.
The kenevo steamrollers stuff, that low centre of mass is quite impressive. The new carbon rise feels more poppy, more lively if you will.
@monkeycmonkeydo That looks cool but I'd be worried about the warranty situation with GT since they no longer exist. I know their parent company will honour it, but they will only have a finite amount of frames and essential spares in stock.
@Ben_Haworth Would you take the Wild over the Rail 8 Gen 5?
@onehundredthidiot Two of my favourite bikes have been Specialized and I'd love another, but the small battery on the SL models puts me off them. Plus I'm 90ish KG at the moment thanks to WFH since 2019, and being too close to the biscuit tin 😋
Wild yep. Better geometry IMO.
Thanks Ben. Another question, it was mentioned above that Rise can be a bit unkind to frame bearings. Is that the case with the Wild too?
@monkeycmonkeydo That looks cool but I'd be worried about the warranty situation with GT since they no longer exist. I know their parent company will honour it, but they will only have a finite amount of frames and essential spares in stock.
Wouldn't worry too much as they own so many other brands I'm sure they'd find you something nice to replace a burst GT.
There are some great Bosch SX bikes ducking under 4 grand now - if you naturally like to pedal at a high cadence and with the latest software these are great options. Probably my choice to replace my Levo SL Gen 2.
On the other hand, my experience is that the SX should be reserved for commuting, road and gravel bikes. It just doesn’t support you when making those crunch moves on proper MTB climbs. Fine if you’re exclusively a winch up the fire roads kind of rider I suppose. Shimano motor tuned down and paired with a small battery works much better for climbing trails. Or go the other way with the CX.
I have an SX powered bike and can’t relate at all to what Kelvin says above. I’ve not ridden any other e-bike system in anger but the SX does all I need. The app allows the motor to be fine tuned to respond and react however you like. The power output feels wonderful, more than enough, IMO.
I had a 2022 orbea rise the bike rode great, like really nice very good bike capable of more than it should have been. shimano motor was spot on the battery lasted well.
Typical orbea issues, half arsed that will do design no quality control. linkage creak and wear due to a stupid design (pinch bolts where they couldnt really do any pinching). Bearings in the chainstays not thought about properly meant with a bit of wear they floated about and let the seat and chainstays rub together at teh axle end, one side had a circlip to retain the bearing the other side didn't - circlip still did a poor job and ive seen loads where its come out and people don't realise and were mistaking it for the usually linkage creak.
Chainstays cracked, replaced under warranty....new set didn't have the circlip groove machined out enough so the bearings floated about and let they stays rub together, i had to dremal it out so it would fit.
i loved and hated the bike, that been said i will NEVER buy another orbea again which is a shame as they ride great.
Replaced it with a Specialized levo, had it over a year now and absolutely zero issues and same for most people i know with them.
I'm not sure the SX would offer enough support to be honest, for me at least.
That's why I liked the idea of the Rise with EP801 in RS+ mode, but the CX Gen 5 is probably the better overall choice given its newer, quieter and easier to get serviced out of warranty.
I have a gravel bike for when I want to put the manual effort in (and will still be used more often), but for MTB I think I want easy mode for the climbs.
In the absence of getting an Amflow, due to budget, the CX is probably the most powerful. I did consider the ST H30 with the 600wh battery, as I believe this is a newer battery tech I think, with the improved watts/kg, so it should be a llittle lighter They are quite a heavy lump tho, more so with the 750wh battery of the H20 and the spec is at the lower end.
If this is the correct size - https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Specialized-Turbo-Levo-Comp-Carbon-Nearly-New-M-2025-Electric-Mountain-Bike_278813.htm?variations=colour:Black%20/%20Light%20Silver%20/%20Black - sign up for Topcashback and you should get £200 off!
Gen 3 Levo is a great bike.
CitizenLee I haven't put enough miles through an Orbea to give an answer either way. Sorry.
@rockhopper70 I think the downgrade in drivetrain and fork would offset the benefit of the newer battery. Probably cheaper and easier to upgrade the battery in the ST H20, if required.
@TroutWrestler I'm at the top limit of S3 at 5'11". Might work, but I'd have to compare reach etc to my current bike. Great deal though! I'm going to see if I can find any ex-display/ex-demo Gen 4s.
@Ben_Haworth No problem! I'm sure with routine checking and maintenance it would be fine.
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I saw this, and whilst it not a brand I'd ever normally consider, it's hard to look past the spec and price. Bosch CX, Lyriks, wireless SRAM, MT5s which could be changed to Shigura...
https://www.e-bikeshop.co.uk/products/electric-bike-haibike-allmtn-cf-9-2025
It certainly doesn't look as hideous as most Haibikes!
For another reference point on Orbea bearings, we had a pair of v1 Rises for 3 1/2 years and now a pair of 2025's. The main linkage axle was upgraded on the XL but not the medium. Snapped one main pivot axle on the XL. Replaced the most of the bearings after a couple of years. In terms of bearing wear no worse that other bikes I've owned.
I've not had any issues with the headsets on any of them either. A lots going to depend on the conditions you ride in and how you clean the bikes of course.
And another reference, we have 2 x early Rise m10’s that I’ve not replaced any parts/bearings other than the headsets and the e13 cranks.
Good to know guys, thanks.
Coming back around to a Rise or Wild (or something else) as the ex display Rail 8 from Balfes has been sold.
I have a wild and mate has a rise. After a ride with just the two of us the battery levels are pretty similar.
But when we rode with a group of ebikers he struggled to keep up with the group.
Both great bikes.
early Rise m10’s that I’ve not replaced any parts/bearings other than the headsets and the e13 cranks
Those cranks… trash! Cheapest possible Shimano ones went on my partner’s bike straight away. Took the opportunity to go 165mm. Hope bottom headset bearing fits by the way, for those looking to replace the junk one supplied. Top bearing is a different/odd size, but the original one is still going strong on her bike. As for frame bearings… I think it’s the “bigger” riders having the most problems. No problems for her. Yet.
Replaced the most of the bearings after a couple of years. In terms of bearing wear no worse that other bikes I've owned.
And, thinking about that, I almost certainly replaced far more than I needed to (as once I'd got the bike in bits and new bearings bought and on the bench it made sense just to fit them). It was only really the linkage bearing that was having issues and that had an external seal ring added when they changed the linkage design.
Those cranks… trash!
They really were. K bent one of the cranks on hers on the second ever ride, clipping a stump that didn't even take her off the bike. She had one odd shimano crank for ages, then replaced all of them when the issues with them cracking the motor axles emerged.
@citizenlee Just got back from a Quantocks ride , 19 miles , over 2,200 feet of climbing, " cheated" a lot today using Boost as I'm recovering from Xmas Lurgy ( that's my excuse!) Still on 3 bars when I finished but probably would have dropped to two shortly .
I too had the E13 cranks swapped out for Shimano, I bought mine in 2022 , at the time there was a spat between E13 and Shimano about the cranks both blaming each other . I thought there would be only one winner in that argument.
As others have said I haven't had issues with frame bearings 3 years in , maybe it is down to heavier riders ? I'm 74 kilos .
Yeah Orbea replaced my linkage double quick under warranty, they obviously realised there was an issue
Contrary to my earlier max budget comments, I'm seriously considering saying f--k it and going for an alloy Gen 4 Levo (found one for £4699) 😀
It's a heavy lump and the spec doesn't match the price compared to practically any other similarly or lower priced bike... but I've always been a bit of Specialized fanboi, have never ridden one I haven't liked and have a dealer 10 minutes away should any issues arise.
Terrible idea?
26kg?!! That's going to be a proper lump once you've added pedals, guards and wotnots. I wouldn't want that weight but you could use loads of assistance for hours.
I owned one of the first Orbea Rise H10 models (540wh battery). I thought that was a bit porky at about 22kg but it was great fun to ride. The linkages creaked terribly from new... I resolved that by modifying the parts and assembling correctly. It was always a bit flexy though (I'm 80kg+) and needed bearings doing annually.
Lots of good deals on lighter "SL" bikes... I guess they just aren't very popular. I've just bought a Norco Fluid VLT (Bosch SX with 400wh battery). Only ridden it once (yesterday). Feels great at under 20kg with pedals, guards, tools, etc., but nothing like the assistance of the bigger motors.
I guess it depends how you are going to use it: I use mine so I can do rides in the hills without battering myself; I'm not bothered if it's no faster than when I'm on a regular bike. Others may wish to ride faster, or with other speedsters, so I guess they need to go for a bigger motor and battery with the associated weight.
Realistically, my dream emtb would have an SL motor but with an easily swappable battery.
Amazing times we live in 🙂
Edit- I forgot... the Shimano motor rattled like a good 'un on descents! Never bothered me, although it's constant whine when climbing did!
The Bosch SX seems to have a slight knock when descending and a more acceptable "hum" when climbing. Early days though.
The power=weight thing is rather overstated (full power motors weigh about 1kg more than SL motor iirc). It's the battery that's the weight IME. FWIW a Bosch SX eeb with 400Wh battery (and decent geometry) would be my current pick. Can always add a range extender in future if need be. I've yet to see a DJI Avinox bike that ticks all my boxes (geometry being the main issue for me).
Totally agree Ben... the biggest weight increase is in the battery... and bigger motors need bigger batteries!
An SX motor (or TQ60?) with easily swappable batteries FTW. I think the latest Fuel EXE might be closest? But can only be used with one size of battery iirc.
Pity that the motor developers have given up on external batteries. That Shimano system (Cotic) is just too dated and ugly (imo). A modern battery could be made to look so much better than that old Shimano one.
The power=weight thing is rather overstated (full power motors weigh about 1kg more than SL motor iirc). It's the battery that's the weight IME. FWIW a Bosch SX eeb with 400Wh battery (and decent geometry) would be my current pick. Can always add a range extender in future if need be. I've yet to see a DJI Avinox bike that ticks all my boxes (geometry being the main issue for me).
The Motor weights differences are less than that -
TQ 2kg
DJI - 2.5
Shimano 2.7
Bosch CX 2.8
It's the ability to use a smaller battery that makes the bigger difference -
Rise 540 1.95kg, Rise 630 2.8kg
DJI 600 2.8kg, 800 3.7kg
Shimano 840wh 4.4kg (!)
Also you a reasonable chunk of weight saving from the frame having a non removable battery (and I think more pronounced on the alu bikes than carbon)
26kg?!! That's going to be a proper lump
My Whyte E-160 rsx is probably heavier but it doesn’t feel heavy when riding it (admittedly it does feel like riding through tar when on flat ground above the cut-off speed). The weight definitely helps in certain situations (rough high speed trails mainly) and it is a pain to lift over gates/fences so that is definitely something to consider. At the same time my mate can do similar distance/elevation on his Rise with the range extender, although he can't get up certain climbs that I can manage pretty easily with the extra torque/ power I get using the higher power settings. I doubt my next ebike will be as heavy as the Whyte but I wouldn't rule out a bike based on weight alone without at least riding one first
The power=weight thing is rather overstated (full power motors weigh about 1kg more than SL motor iirc). It's the battery that's the weight IME. FWIW a Bosch SX eeb with 400Wh battery (and decent geometry) would be my current pick. Can always add a range extender in future if need be. I've yet to see a DJI Avinox bike that ticks all my boxes (geometry being the main issue for me).
The Motor weights differences are less than that -
TQ 2kg
DJI - 2.5
Shimano 2.7
Bosch CX 2.8
It's the ability to use a smaller battery that makes the bigger difference -
Rise 540 1.95kg, Rise 630 2.8kg
DJI 600 2.8kg, 800 3.7kg
Shimano 840wh 4.4kg (!)
Also you a reasonable chunk of weight saving from the frame having a non removable battery (and I think more pronounced on the alu bikes than carbon)
A fellow I used to work with knew a lot about electric motor & generators. He said that Maxon were the daddies & held all the patents/IP. I've been keeping an eye on this & read about it in E Mountainbike's motor group test & they rated it highly, weight of a lightweight almost the power of a full. Current downside is it only has a 400wh battery.
https://ebike-mtb.com/en/emtb-motor-comparison/
I think Maxon are on exactly the right track… light, efficient, full torque, no motorbike mode… but with people starting to buy bikes like any other Chinese made white goods… they don’t have the right numbers for the marketing. The highest watts and an assist mode that is basically using the pedals as an accelerator… that’s what people seem to want to buy… fitted to average to dull bikes. How manufacturers persuade them to ride assisted mountain bikes with great handling rather than big numbers dull riding ebikes, I have no idea.
I'm another who thinks Bosch Sx and ~400wh battery is the sweet spot currently - If I was replacing my Lovel SL2 (I'm not, its brill) thats where I'd be looking.
Another crucial aspect that not many are focusing on is charging speed. Along with the ability to add a range extender, this makes the bikes much more adaptable. For many, many people that you see doing trail centre laps, the ability to quickly cram another 2 or 00wh in from your car or suchlike, whilst you eat your sandwich, would be really, really useful.
I have done this a fair bit usin my Ecoflow powerpack to bump my Levo, its super useful but the charging rates are not high enough yet.
I popped into Edinburgh Bike Co earlier and sat on a S4 Levo SL2. Sizing seemed perfect for me.
Weight wise, it felt like what I expected. The full fat Levo felt like an absolute tank though. In its defence the two chunky wheel stands were still attached when I lifted it.
Also looked at the Whyte Kado range but the skinny seat tube going into the bulbous motor housing is perhaps one of the least aesthetically pleasing things I've ever seen.
I'll pop into Evans next to see what the Treks and Cubes feel like.
I'd have to go to Inverness to check out Orbea, which isn't going to happen.
Been looking at the Giant Trance X Advanced E+ EL 2 but don't know anything about their motors, and I still have 2nd hand anger about how they handled that guy's warranty situation. It seems to review positively though.
Even though everyone here - including me - only rides on roads and bridleways, I would *imagine* lifting a 25kg+ over fences/walls etc gets pretty old, pretty quickly..
Even though everyone here - including me - only rides on roads and bridleways, I would *imagine* lifting a 25kg+ over fences/walls etc gets pretty old, pretty quickly..
Lifting bikes over stuff? Must be an English thing 😆
For research purposes, I'm now reading up on Bosch SX bikes. Some good looking options from Cube, Marin, Merida, Mondraker, Norco, etc, but all perhaps a bit weak compared to the EP801 with RS+ tune in the Orbea Rise. Just wish I could ride one or at least ride with someone who owns one to hear if the noise would bug me.
@citizenlee more than welcome to join me and have a go/listen if you're anywhere near Somerset.
@citizenlee just come back from a glorious Mendip ride , bike is a sweet spot for me 👌 540wh , around 20kg weight and a great halfway option, a trail bike with a little bit of help 👌
A little heavier (but not much) than some sl ebikes but it's also a bit more "enduro"
https://winstanleysbikes.co.uk/orange-phase-evo-le-mx-2024-electric-bike
Mates Orbea Rise on the left and my Orbea Wild on the right
I popped into Edinburgh Bike Co earlier and sat on a S4 Levo SL2. Sizing seemed perfect for me.
Weight wise, it felt like what I expected. The full fat Levo felt like an absolute tank though. In its defence the two chunky wheel stands were still attached when I lifted it.
For me, I think Spesh hit the sweet spot with the G3 Levo - 22.5kg for the top of the range S-Works - full fat and 700wh battery. The G4 got uglier and heavier, albeit a bit more powerful - was supposed to have more range, but people using the extra power were seeing less range than the G3.
Yes, there's an element of it being what I own - however, I knew what the G4 was going to be all about when I bought it and as such, paid £5k less than RRP as it was the outgoing model.
@oldfart I'd love to take you up on that offer but I'm over 500 miles North! Bike looks great by the way. It does seem like the perfect sweet spot bike.
@StuE Wow, that's a cracking deal! Fox Factory and Hope stuff for under 4K. I've been a bit of a critic of Orange's industrious frame design in the past but I think it suits the nature of the Phase. Certainly one to consider.
@flyingpotatoes Looking good together! Is your mate's Rise noisy? I can't get past the potential motor rattle when coasting otherwise it would be the bike for me. As the replies here show, it seems to vary from bike to bike and people's tolerance of it varies too. It's certainly audible on the POV videos I've watched, but then I'm not riding it and focused on the trail ahead.
For research purposes, I'm now reading up on Bosch SX bikes. Some good looking options from Cube, Marin, Merida, Mondraker, Norco, etc, but all perhaps a bit weak compared to the EP801 with RS+ tune in the Orbea Rise.
I’m not in a position to suggest you are procrastinating here, it only took me 18months or so to decide which e-bike to buy and eventually, a too-good-to-miss deal came up on an SX powered canyon that @mboy also bought. My point, in quoting you above, is that I cannot imagine the SX motor not being powerful enough to get up any thing where traction is lost first. In boost, it’s an absolute steam train uphill. Yes, the battery depletes, so if your intention is to go in boost everywhere, you are going to need a large battery, so an SX probably won’t suit as they seem to be always tied to the 400wh battery. If you just want a little help and a push along when needed, then SX is fine, IMO. For price/motor/battery, that Wild ST H30 was the best I came to. I didn’t go with it due to an immediate need to spend a decent chunk on it to get the spec ok. And the Canyon also popped up.
Also, anecdotally. I went out with a mate who has the original rise with the stock motor. On paper, mine and his should be similar but they are miles different in pulling power. The SX felt twice the power, absolutely no comparison.
Edit, that Orange looks good. Had I not got mine, that would be tempting. The only irk for me is the charging port is on the top tube, so well out of the way, but it would make an ungainly looking position to plug the range extender in to.
I popped into Edinburgh Bike Co earlier and sat on a S4 Levo SL2. Sizing seemed perfect for me.
Weight wise, it felt like what I expected. The full fat Levo felt like an absolute tank though. In its defence the two chunky wheel stands were still attached when I lifted it.
For me, I think Spesh hit the sweet spot with the G3 Levo - 22.5kg for the top of the range S-Works - full fat and 700wh battery. The G4 got uglier and heavier, albeit a bit more powerful - was supposed to have more range, but people using the extra power were seeing less range than the G3.
Yes, there's an element of it being what I own - however, I knew what the G4 was going to be all about when I bought it and as such, paid £5k less than RRP as it was the outgoing model.
I'd probably still consider a G3, and there was a good deal on one posted above, although it's S3 which may be a bit cramped.
I do actually like the look of the G4 though, despite it being porky.
For research purposes, I'm now reading up on Bosch SX bikes. Some good looking options from Cube, Marin, Merida, Mondraker, Norco, etc, but all perhaps a bit weak compared to the EP801 with RS+ tune in the Orbea Rise.
I’m not in a position to suggest you are procrastinating here, it only took me 18months or so to decide which e-bike to buy and eventually, a too-good-to-miss deal came up on an SX powered canyon that @mboy also bought. My point, in quoting you above, is that I cannot imagine the SX motor not being powerful enough to get up any thing where traction is lost first. In boost, it’s an absolute steam train uphill. Yes, the battery depletes, so if your intention is to go in boost everywhere, you are going to need a large battery, so an SX probably won’t suit as they seem to be always tied to the 400wh battery. If you just want a little help and a push along when needed, then SX is fine, IMO. For price/motor/battery, that Wild ST H30 was the best I came to. I didn’t go with it due to an immediate need to spend a decent chunk on it to get the spec ok. And the Canyon also popped up.
Also, anecdotally. I went out with a mate who has the original rise with the stock motor. On paper, mine and his should be similar but they are miles different in pulling power. The SX felt twice the power, absolutely no comparison.
Edit, that Orange looks good. Had I not got mine, that would be tempting. The only irk for me is the charging port is on the top tube, so well out of the way, but it would make an ungainly looking position to plug the range extender in to.
That's good info, thank you! Makes the SX equipped bikes seem more viable.
I'm kinda split... if I had a full fat then most of the time I probably would rip around in boost mode as I wouldn't need the range on my local trails. Then be more conservative when needed for bigger days out. On the other hand, if I had a lighter/mid powered bike I'd probably ride it like my normal bike and just use the boost when I actually need it. I'd rather not use a range extender as I don't like carrying water on my person.
FWIW, the only electric bike I've ever used was one of those atrocious city bike things, so I've got nothing to compare any decent eMTB to.
I'll go through all this debating and deliberating with myself as I do about everything, finally make a decision I think im happy with...then get refused finance 😆
No worries, I went through the same process trying to decide. Looking at specs etc is all well and good but if you have a budget the that also comes into consideration. I was very close to pulling the trigger on a Whyte eLyte works reduced from £10,000 (yes, Ten Thousand Pounds!!!) to £6.5K. I really should have given my head a wobble for even contemplating this! 🤣
In the end I spent £3,900 on the Canyon which had the perfect spec for me and I love it. I’ve since bought a range extender. Last big ride was 60km, 1,363m of elevation. I had 9% left, of the combined 650wh battery. It was a gloopy day too, and I was getting a bit nervous on the home straight as I live halfway up a steep valley side and I was spent. Had enough to boost all the way up the hill though!