Fans getting out of hand at the Tour

It's always annoyed me the way they push in and leave very little space for the riders., but I have heard that the riders doon't mind the fans getting as close and cheering them on.

Well, maybe not the ones who hit the ground and have the peloton ride over them.

For me it's part of the race. They could do 1000 laps of the track instead. The fans, the atmosphere, the locations, etc make it what it is.

I think they are getting out of hand.. it’s getting to the stage where riders can’t make an attack because there isn’t the space to get by.

I also have to admit I find them extremely annoying. Especially the ones holding their flags in front of the riders and then pulling them away. Given the reputation of the gendarmerie I question why a few of them haven’t had a well aimed boot in the nuts.

Boils my piss. It's a bike race not a circus. Fan behaviour that directly impedes or makes a rider think twice about making a move is out of order. Apologists go on about atmosphere and sponsors but other sports have these without bare arsed idiots hampering elite athletes by running alongside, setting off smoke flares or waving phones or flags in their faces. What top athlete wants a pissed up idiot screaming in their ear as they are busting a lung up an Alpine Col? Any part of the route that isn't wide enough for a rider with a support / medical vehicle beside them shouldn't have fans anywhere near it. While I'm ranting, why do we need two grown men on a petrol motorbike a few feet in front of riders needing oxygen? Electric motorbikes are pretty good now, as are remote cameras producing a live feed that can easily mount on the back of said leccy motorbike. It's a wonder my tellybox doesn't have a foot shaped hole in it!

Ah, that's better.

A fine example of the observer effect.

I think each rider needs a big lad on a full fat ebike with 1000mm bars riding in front to barge the spec****ters out of the way. Possibly with Boudicca bar ends.

+1 on why are they still using petrol motorbikes.

Fans do make the event. However, it does seem to be creeping up that they are closer, probably now hindering and intimidating rather than cheering.

Maybe needs a 'no feet on the road to be a good spectator' type campaign/ guidance?

At times it looks like the worst type of Stag/Hen parties trying to be the most attention seeking sports fans.

though I’ve yet to leg it up the road in a mankini.

Call yourself a fan? Pah!

While I’m ranting, why do we need two grown men on a petrol motorbike a few feet in front of riders needing oxygen?

One was a press moto (still photos), one was a TV bike. I have no idea how many of them there are (there seems to be loads!) but you need the footage and the photos from the race and the motos are subject to the same blockages and snags from fans as well. I've seen motos fall over on mountain roads like that (which is why they started introducing those motos with 2 wheels at the front, more stability).

It's notable how poor e-bikes and e-cars are within races due to range and charging infrastructure.
It's not just the race they have to do, it's hotel to start, the whole race distance, then finish to hotel and that can be a very long way at times. Turning up at a hotel with 100 bikes needing charging is not feasible.

A vehicle sponsor gave us an e-thing once which was terrible. It simply didn't have the range to do the full race distance for Women's race in the morning, Mens in the afternoon and trying to charge it at lunchtime using a regular power source (not one of the specific supercharger units that it really needs) gave it an extra 3% or something. We had to swap it for a diesel car in the final race.

Thoroughly agree with you about the fans though. Some of them simply need pushing off the mountain.

"Full fat bike clearance...."

Get Dredd on secondment.  Sorted.

Whilst the Briton in me wonders why they can't just stand by the roadside, cheering politely, like a rational human being, those mad mountain crowds have been part of the race for as long as I can remember. I'd be interested to better understand the reason that you can have fans on a narrow stretch of alone road but couldn't have them standing on the track side for the funicular on Puy de Dome.

As for the fancy dress, running alongside idiots? You just can't legislate for a man who's spent to long sitting in the sun drinking with his mates. Snipers in tv 'copters?

From what I’ve heard, electric vehicles batteries won’t reliably last a Tour De France mountain stage.

There’s a balance with the fans though. They’re part of what makes the tour such an experience, and the craziness comes with that.

Lets be honest, as a spectacle it is pretty incredible to see all the fans on the mountains, Dutch Corner etc.

Apart from anything else I guess smart phones do not help matters and have made a difference compared to previously- at least in the past fans would be facing forward to see the riders but so many now seem to be looking up the road into their phones for a selfie with the riders behind them, arm outsretched into the road etc.

If the fans weren't there, if the cars and motos that get in the way, and worse weren't there then the riders wouldn't be there either.
It's the popularity that brings the sponsors and TV rights which pays the riders.

It looks like a slower, slightly safer (for the fans) version of what was happening with some WRC races in the 90s, Portugal sticks in my mind. IIRC there were stages cancelled back then because the spectators were all over the road, and the drivers were the ones who were most vocal about it. So if it's actually an issue that the riders want to deal with they have to be the ones to make that clear and push for something to happen.

Sure, some fans have clearly been drinking all day by the time the lead riders appear, and it looks crazy, but in reality, it almost never has an impact on the riders, all of them have said as much in the past, and let's be honest; as soon as the riders get to the barriers, the atmosphere just disappears.

It's been good to see some self policing by the fans with the runners being pulled off to the side.  I enjoy it every time you see one suddenly disappear. It's disrespectful to other fans as well as they have been waiting at the side only to have their view blocked by someone's arse

It' not getting worse it's just how it's always been. Often it's the odd bit of stupidity which considering the amount of people watching and the distance covered it's amazing how few incidents there are.

Yes I wish they wouldn't run alongside the leaders when it's densly packed but I can't actually recall an incident where a runner knocked someone off. I'm sure it's happened. (not including the daft bloke who pushed someone off in the Giro trying to give a hand)

1988 fans/motos/can't attack

1994 Jalabert taken out by a policeman taking a photo

1999 Guerini taken out by a person taking a photo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dBvJkqv0DM

Lance getting taken out by a bag strap

Etc

Without the madness of the fans we get the Puy de Dome dullness.

With fans we get the Benoit Consefroy dancing and chugging beer mid race and race cars getting bounced about. Even the Murdoch loved being in the Sky car and getting up close and personal with the fans in the mountains who had no love for the team.

it’s getting to the stage where riders can’t make an attack because there isn’t the space to get by.

It certainly looked that way yesterday, almost like attacks are planned for when the barrier sections arrive.

Without the madness of the fans we get the Puy de Dome dullness.

Personally I thought the Puy de Dome was great. More of the same please

I think perhaps it's a little worse, and as above largely because people are waving phones around and not watching what they or the riders are really doing. I wonder though if part of the problem is that we are getting older and less tolerant. I used to chuckle at the pissed up nob-ends running up the road in mankinis, these days I'm outraged.

The thing I really don't get is the idiots letting off flares, surely that's the last thing the riders need.

leffeboy
Full Member
It’s been good to see some self policing by the fans with the runners being pulled off to the side.

A good example of this was on Saturday's stage, though the runner looked a bit pissed off he was pulled to the side by a spectator. I'm all for the enthusiastic fans but it's the ones that insist on running next to the riders screaming inches from their face for as long as they can that annoy me.

Without the madness of the fans we get the Puy de Dome dullness.
Personally I thought the Puy de Dome was great. More of the same please

The last 4km was basically a taking a Mountain TT but taking away the atmosphere. See last TT of the Giro on how that should have been. The crowds at the bottom were amazing. The sad lonely mascot on the train at the bottom also equally amazing.

There's an estimate of 12-15M spectators watch the TdF roadside, over the 20-odd stages - so between 600K and 750K per stage. Inevitably more on the mountains, to see the action over a longer period than outside an industrial park in Lens where they'll be past in about 20s in a blur. Without those folks turning up it wouldn't be half the spectacle, anywhere near as appealing for towns to host stages, etc.

I'm amazed there aren't more incidents but fact is that there aren't so draconian solutions like no spectators are totally unwarranted, real baby and bathwater stuff. I think the phone and selfie generation is part of the issue, if you come to watch it live then watch it FFS, then you're much less likely to inadvertently cause an issue. But as said above, Lance's bag strap and errant coppers have always been there, it's just the new phenomenon.

Is the crowd actually such an intrinsic part of the parcours? In cricket you have to adjust your game based on weather for example and it's felt to be part of it. Being able to think on the move and when you can and can't attack, to maximum effect, is that not also part of the smarts?

1986

Keep watching for the runners

Electric motorbikes are pretty good now, as are remote cameras producing a live feed that can easily mount on the back of said leccy motorbike. It’s a wonder my tellybox doesn’t have a foot shaped hole in it!

As a sometime remote camera op for prime-time TV, nope. It'd certainly be possible to figure something out that was controllable and probably had better stability as well. But from a direction perspective, you'd not have a clue what was going on out of frame. It's sometimes hard enough to keep track of a (mostly) sat down interview across a few cameras without having to figure out that the race winning break just went up your left hand side whilst you got some generic shots of Froome looking at his stem again.

And from a technical perspective you'd need multiple remote cameras mounted front, back, sides, high and low to get the variety of shots required.

I don't think they'll be replacing them with a robot anytime soon.

Is the crowd actually such an intrinsic part of the parcours? In cricket you have to adjust your game based on weather for example and it’s felt to be part of it. Being able to think on the move and when you can and can’t attack, to maximum effect, is that not also part of the smarts?

I saw Pogaca being interviewed about the moto "incident" yesterday and I think he may actually take this view, up to a point. He was really (on the surface anyway) quite relaxed about it and seemed quite philosophical about the whole thing. Perhaps he will feel different if he loses the tour by 7 seconds, who knows.

I am sure on the flip side riders must dig deeper on a climb due to the atmosphere compared to an empty road- if my local hills looked like that on a Sunday morning I am sure I would grab a few Strava PRs.

I think it was one of the interviews in Unchained where they were talking about the crowds, one of the riders commented that you can smell the beer on their breath, but that for the most part it helps them and drives them on.

If you haven't watched Tour de France Unchained yet I can highly recommend it.

Fans by the side of the road is one thing, but the people running alongside the riders I always hope accidentally trip and fall off the mountain.

Or something like this...

I wonder though if part of the problem is that we are getting older and less tolerant. I used to chuckle at the pissed up nob-ends running up the road in mankinis, these days I’m outraged.

The thing I really don’t get is the idiots letting off flares, surely that’s the last thing the riders need.

All this. But I love the fans on the mountain stages, still. Been there once and it's amazing. Beats a flatter town viewing point 100x. But running along with a flare ... probably a daft thing to do.

Then again the coloured smoke and flags of the Arenburg gives me goosebumps, one day I'll be there. Anywhere cycling raises such an atmosphere is something special.

Or something like this…

proper lol at that pic, everything about it is just brilliant

It's been like this for decades

They should bring this behaviour into Redbull Hardline

Just watching this on YT, footage from heli and as the rider goes down, both sides of the crowd move back. Almost like they know they are encroaching on the riders and know they shouldnt.

In recent years we've seen race changing incidents with Vincenzo Nibali and Primoz Roglic, both getting whacked out of position by a camera and large cardboard 'message'.
Yesterday with Sepp Kuss and Nathan Van Hooydonc didn't change the race but it could have been so much worse.

The real cycling fans won't run a long side, pull a flare, throw a cup of urine or run up the road with their bare bottom hanging out (seems like a recent thing).

Yes it's exciting seeing your sporting heroes close to and cheering them on (there aren't many sports where we can do that), but it's putting peoples lives in danger and at the very least could have career ending consequences.

Most of the drunken idiots just want to be on telly.

I'm really torn, one of the great democratic things about grand tours is that any Joe Schmoe can just rock up at the roadside and watch, in an age of ever more intense monetization of sport that's a rare and wonderful thing, how many of today's best riders were skint spotty youths standing by the roadside 15-20 years ago?

The way the fans turn random high mountain passes into massive parties is one of the most iconic sights in cycle racing.

However his does inevitably give 'that one idiot' the chance to wreck utter havoc and if it was me facing a career ending injury I probably wouldn't be quite so philosophical.

Apparently they're already calling the Puy De Dome 'The Silent Mountain' which is very evocative, hope that sticks.

There's probably a large element of "Fans had more respect back in the good old days" at play here, but that said I do think that maybe social media has actually made it  a bit worse. If nobody up there had a smartphone I think maybe there'd be fewer people going too far for TikTok or whatever.

But then there was that gendarme who took out Abdoujaparov in the 80s when getting a photo (I think?) so it's always been there.

I think  high speed peloton crashes due to idiots with signs, phones and banners has increased - the reason everyone remembers the policeman taking a photo despite it happening years ago was that it was unusual. This year alone we've had at least 3 similar incidents. Yes, you are always going to have the odd situation (dogs running out and a muppet filling his pool and leaving water all over the road spring to mind in recent years) but its almost a given now that there will be a mass crash due to a spectator encroaching on the road and this will be race changing. I think this can be legislated against fairly easily with massive fines, deportations if foreign nationals etc without spoiling any of the true fandom. The same goes for flares - there are enough gendarmes around to sort anyone out lighting flares or touching a rider.

The same goes for flares – there are enough gendarmes around to sort anyone out lighting flares or touching a rider.

There aren't. Also, moving up and down the mountain to get to said miscreant is near impossible, there's nowhere to safely detain them and not a lot you can do with them.

I'm in favour of shooting them but apparently that's not acceptable.

The woman holding that ridiculous Opi Ami sign last year was in line for a colossal fine but it somehow got reduced to about €1000 - still not insignificant but a far cry from the original intention to make her criminally liable for damage to the bikes and loss of earnings for the riders.

"The woman holding that ridiculous Opi Ami sign last year was in line for a colossal fine but it somehow got reduced to about €1000 – still not insignificant but a far cry from the original intention to make her criminally liable for damage to the bikes and loss of earnings for the riders."

And there we have a perfect example. She was let off by the tour organization who basically decided they didn't want the bad press of going for her. She was not French and could have been kicked out of the country, never allowed back in and fined a **** load - probably a bit unfair but would have sent a signal that you can't stand at the side of the road looking the wrong way with a ****ing great board out into the carriageway....actually it probably wouldn't...morons will moron that's why they are..you know...morons!

Most of the incidents appear to be caused by people who are doing some kind of self promotion such as a selfie or trying to get a sign on TV footage, rather than actually being a fan who is looking at the riders.

Perhaps building an envionment of  low tolerance for non-fan behaviour amongst the fans would be a good start.

It is kind of unique to cycling because it is impracticable to barrier and manage the 1000s of km of route, e.g. compared to a marathon which is only 42km.

BBC radio just now saying that the spectator has been identified (possibly "turned himself in" - initially said was a woman but I think they confused with the Opi Omi crash) and may be prosecuted (well of course they may be) but also JV said to be considering their next move

Perhaps building an envionment of low tolerance for non-fan behaviour amongst the fans would be a good start

To be fair, I've noticed a lot of fans pulling the running mankini flag wavers forcibly out of the way this year. Think it was the last stage that said runner who was screaming in Pog's ear looked like he took offence to being manhandled out of the way. Sadly the camera moved so didn't see if he got a smack in the chops for his trouble.

may be prosecuted (well of course they may be) but also JV said to be considering their next move

Good.
If they had to stump up for 2 or 3 wrecked Cervelo bikes, I'm sure they'd reconsider their urgent need to take a selfie at that point.

FWIW, French TV has been running lots of adverts about keeping dogs on a leash (or not taking them to the race at all!) and respecting the riders, giving them space to race etc but as is the way with those adverts, the people that pay attention to them already do that, the rest kind of forget that info once they're into their 3rd bottle of vin rouge and surrounded by 50,000 other drunken flag waving morons

think they should employ Didi for crowd control- electrify his trident and give him free reign to punish infringements

At 25:30, I was reminded of this one on the highlights last night - guy in the number 10 shirt had been annoying folk all afternoon running up and down as the riders came through (twice). Quite a few were having words with him but didn't seem to make any difference.

Had a smile to myself when I got home and watched the recording.

In recent years we’ve seen race changing incidents with Vincenzo Nibali and Primoz Roglic, both getting whacked out of position by a camera and large cardboard ‘message’.
Yesterday with Sepp Kuss and Nathan Van Hooydonc didn’t change the race but it could have been so much worse.

Merckx got punched by a fan in 1975 during the Puy De Dome stage.

Motorbike taken out by the crowd 🙄

Was it? or did it stall and they were trying to move it?

Damn those Victorian ladies!

I thought it stalled and they were trying to move it too.

Motorbike taken out by the crowd 🙄

proper lol at that pic, everything about it is just brilliant

Agreed, but it would be less brilliant if the dickhead got squished by the Skoda that's following about 3m behind.

The only people whose opinion really matters in this is the riders and they seem ok with it so..

There have always been big crowds, runners and mishaps but now there are more ****ers who just want to be on telly.

papamountain

Free Member
The only people whose opinion really matters in this is the riders and they seem ok with it so.

Do you think any of them want to be known as the rider who said "They're all c***s and need shooting by UCI snipers in the helicopter"?

Or do you think they'll give some bland response and keep the team PR people and fans onside and not get bottles of piss thrown at them?

Geraint Thomas calls one of them a 'kn*bhead' on the recent Netflix TdF documentary.

So according to Escape Collective there was Van De Velde on a Moto. Voeckler on a Moto. Shimano car. Directors car. Unkown amount of video camera bikes (may have been just behind thogh). No doubt at least one still camera bikes.

Definitely just the fans fault though!

https://escapecollective.com/everyone-everywhere-all-at-once/

So most of the incidents that have affected the GC battle have been vehicle not fan related. So maybe me watching at home is causing as many problems as spectators on the road?

Not sure why posters above are blaming fans for the stalled motorbike yesterday

From what I can see the fan thing has got worse because of the selfie problem. The rest send unchanged since the 1980s when I started watching

Anyone else see the fella chuck a 'cup' full of liquid right in Gaudu's face? At least the bloke with the pizza just offered it to O'Connor (looked nice too 😀)

Yeah, Gaudu's stunned reaction was something else.
That pizza looked top-notch; just goes to show how hard O'Connor must've gone to be in no place to take a slice. Could practically hear Sean Kelly salivating.

So most of the incidents that have affected the GC battle have been vehicle not fan related.

Most of them have been motorbike riders choosing not to run over people blocking their path. Perhaps that should change?

The pizza chef running beside Ben O'connor had me in stitches.

The pizza chef running beside Ben O’connor had me in stitches.

Really? Too bad Ben didn't have time to stop and lamp him. Idiot.

So most of the incidents that have affected the GC battle have been vehicle not fan related.
Most of them have been motorbike riders choosing not to run over people blocking their path. Perhaps that should change?

Or as we've not actually seen (well I haven't) what happened the Moto may have been going so slow because the riders it was following was going so slow it stalled/fell over. Not the fans fault.

You know how wide a motorbike is (even lying on its side) and how wide a mountain road is.

The fans decided to crowd the moto rather than clear a path for the pursuing riders.

Really? Too bad Ben didn’t have time to stop and lamp him. Idiot.

I'd be surprised if Ben even noticed him. He'd done a massive turn up the lower slopes, a lot of work in the breakaway before (and it all paid off because Felix Gall got a stage win as impressive as Pidcock's win up Alpe d'Huez last year).

Bet Ben was cross-eyed with exhaustion at the point he pulled off, he did the classic thing of sitting on the front until he could give no more, pulled off and absolutely parked up.

Plus riders aren't allowed to take offered food in case it's been spiked. Rule 1, you never ever take bottles, food etc from anyone other than official team staff. At anti-doping control, there must be multiple sealed bottles of water and the athlete has to choose their own; AD staff, chaperones etc are not allowed to offer them a bottle, the athlete has to select it from a choice.

You know how wide a motorbike is (even lying on its side) and how wide a mountain road is.

The fans decided to crowd the moto rather than clear a path for the pursuing riders.

Double width bike path and there was a car stuck. How were they going to clear a path wide enough?

From article above

Still, it took race officials to really make things go pear-shaped. According to Vande Velde, “the red car tried to pass us inside. And now everyone’s completely blocked. If he were to just pull behind us, there’s an alleyway for everyone to go up.”

Heat of the moment panic sets in. Just ask Jumbo DS's about that...

Voeckler was fined for the motor bike incident

https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/voeckler-suspended-from-tour-de-france-after-moto-stalls-in-front-of-vingegaard/

Rule 1, you never ever take bottles, food etc from anyone other than official team staff.

What was cosnefroy drinking when he joined his fans on the joux plane?

https://twitter.com/Julientrivero/status/1680242366681063424