[Closed] Evans Cycles Bike Reviews Misleading Customers.

Depends if you followed there T&Cs and other what nots. What did you say?

Put the review here

What happens is the software doesn't post 1-star ratings at first, until they can be resolved on the basis that a '1' is a serious complaint that needs adressing. We've received both your reviews though, I've read them. I also replied to your email on the Pinnacle site and responded to your thread on here. I can reply to reviews directly (to the supplied email) but hadn't so far as it's the same email I'd replied to earlier.

If after further communication -a 1-star generally gets further follow-up- it's a valid complaint rather than a rant-vent or trolling they will be posted up. If you'd put a comment on the bike in general and added the bearing size info issue as a 3 or 4-star it'd go on right away. There are some 1-star reviews on the site, there's no avoiding it at times. In this case I'm waiting for some info from a supplier and will get it to you asap next week. if I don't have it by weds I'm in the workshop and will get a hub opened up to be sure. If after that you feel the bike rates as 1-star overall I'll make sure your review goes up.

Love these threads....

Very nice reply, I wish I had had such an honest approach fromr another Bike dealership based in Scotland when i felt there was a problem with the product.

I just checked the reviews section of our site, your (second attempt?) 2-star review with the same comment is 'pending', the 1-star is held as rejected for upload before further feedback. I the 2-star may well go up or I'll get a mail on Monday about it. There's other 4 and 5-star reviews on Arkoses in that same review report that are pending still, some keyword will have flagged them for a check rather than a direct approval. Not entirely sure how that side of it works tbh.

Curiosity piqued...
Did the bearings burst into flames?
Please tell us it involved fire somehow

I had a second rejection email this morning saying my 2 star review was not accepted.

We've received both your reviews though, I've read them. I also replied to your email on the Pinnacle site and responded to your thread on here. I can reply to reviews directly (to the supplied email) but hadn't so far as it's the same email I'd replied to earlier.

Cloudnine i couldnt give 2 monkeys if they did set on fire. The annoying thing is i cant get any information on hub and bearings used. Neither can Evans.

Just for clarity then, Evans could have, say, 100 1 star reviews from 101 sales of genuinely faulty product, but shoppers wouldn't see any of these reviews until each had been 'satisfactorily' resolved by Evans (at their discretion), potentially some months later?

In the meantime customers are being informed by a single 3 star review (that could be a typo) that just happens to meet some unknown rule that allowed it to get uploaded automatically.

If that's the case, I'm not inclined to spend much on the Evans site.

I read reviews and hope I can make my own judgement about whether they are reliable E.g. one star from a clown reviewer who bought something that wasn't compatible, in spite of clear descriptions on the site.

Genuine question, do people just look at the average review rating when making a decision, or do people go into the detail and read some of the comments?

The trouble is you will get negative bias. You buy something and it works so just use it. You buy something and it fails you go on the website and have a rant. At least this system gives the supplier a chance to fix things and weed out the people who's first action is to moan online. If it's still a valid complaint then the low feedback should go up, and I know there are plenty of sites where this doesn't happen.

Does anyone trust reviews on any user submitted website? I treat them with the same level of trust that I trust anything on the Internet, as a guide until I'm able to find other independent references or peer reviewed information.

If that's the case, I'm not inclined to spend much on the Evans site.

jacob46 - Member
Cloudnine i couldnt give 2 monkeys if they did set on fire. The annoying thing is i cant get any information on hub and bearings used. Neither can Evans

I don't know if you realise, but Jameso who responded above is the designer for pinnacle. So when he said he is trying to find the relevant info for you that's not a fob-off from a random shop guy, you will get that info!

Online reviews attract nutters like flies to sheezay.Apparently much like this post.

Are people really daft enough to buy a bike based only on the website review beneath it?!?

relevant-to-evans-but-off-topic-rant/

Yup, I've had some seriously bad customer service from them recently at the Reading store. Kept me waiting for an hour with no update and gave me a bike with an inferior lockout and scratched carbon bars, greasy frame and packaging still on it, bike not setup (bars & rear axle not tight) and gears not properly indexed and rubbing discs. I took the bike because I'd had a long day at work and needed to get back.

They put me in contact with the manager of the store, but after seeing his twitter account there is no way I'll be talking to him.

No way in hell I'll be going back to them. Almost gave the bike back but was the only one left in the country. Shame that my LBS didn't have stock. The free service will be useless too if it's the same mechanic working on it. He'll make it worse. I despair for any amateur cyclist buying a bike from there, that's if they get down the road alive after how mine was set up.

/rant

Great reply from Jameso - and as rightly stated, far too many online reviews are just rants where people emotionally unload, usually in spectacular fashion. This seems to be an internet "thing" - look at threads on with stupid openers like "I need to vent". No you don't.

Sounds like the review moderation system works well to not only weed out ranters but proactively drive resolutions. That's a bloody good thing.

We still don't know what this alleged bearing issue is and whether it's a 1 star worthy or not....... Enlighten us OP.

Sympathy for retailers to an extent here, in preventing the review system being distorted by irrational contributions (no judgement on OP).

I've moved into social media management for some large and unpopular companies recently and while it's not that hard to separate the irrational rants and troubled souls from the genuine grievances, it's not always a swift process and follow-up is invaluable. This is only really possible with engagement from the customer.

Post your review here OP, you can't flame a company with such vague evidence.

STATO, im sitting here waiting to find out what hub and bearings are on my bike. You must be able to see my frustration. I cycle to work and cant get my bike fixed.

Post a picture up here and let us look.

Can you see the bearings? Are they a cartridge type? If so, is a serial number visible?

Let's look for a solution here.

Yep and by what has been said somebody has replied twice to you giving both reasons a day trying to help you, seems you have tried to shout a lot and not talking to the person dealing with it. Sorry to sound harsh but it's what it reads like. Has your wheel collapsed and is unrideable?

I'm not sure trust is the right word.
I take note of web reviews more than magazine reviews. They're particularly helpful if there's a theme of "it fell appart after 13 months." etc

[i]STATO, im sitting here waiting to find out what hub and bearings are on my bike. You must be able to see my frustration. I cycle to work and cant get my bike fixed. [/i]

Ok, but when you took the wheel back did you ask (or demand if the bike is new/newish) a 'demo' wheel until yours is returned, as you NEED your transport?

Genuine question, do people just look at the average review rating when making a decision, or do people go into the detail and read some of the comments?

I click through to read the copy on a few reviews usually, as part of due diligence when considering a bike. Like to get a feel for the buyers' level of experience before I trust their rating TBH.

Why not take it to Evans and ask them to fix it instead of getting your knickers in a twist doing it yourself.

Evans are my first choice for bike bits.

Tbh I would be a bit annoyed if the wheel bearings went after 6 months as per op's other thread and more so if the shop and manufacturer couldn't tell me the size required to replace it.

I can see your frustration but you need someone to either take the hub apart or supply the numbers. You said on your other thread you can't take it apart and you didn't take it to the shop. It's an older model so they likely can't just look on the shop floor, short of waiting for Jameso you need to take it to a shop that can help, I know you tried halfords but they have many staff so likely you got the work experience guy. Try another shop or maybe even someone on here can help.

I tend to take online reviews with a pinch of salt although I do read them as you can get a rough idea of the general mood that people are expressing either happy experiences of sarcastic concern.

I've recently looked at rims, 100% of the posts I'd read confirmed they built into a strong wheel that needed little attention, 50% complained that the hard anodised surface on the rims braking surface wore off, 25% of the reviewers intimated it made its own braking surface I suppose the other 25% weren't bothered either way, Happy with this I went to buy only to find that the wheel builder had flamed them?

I posted a question on here re the wheels and got pretty much the same response as I'd already had.
Happy with this I bought the rims,

I,d post your concern on here, I bet there's some one who can assist,

At least in future you will know that on line reviews are skewed,

Tbh I would be a bit annoyed if the wheel bearings went after 6 months as per op's other thread and more so if the shop and manufacturer couldn't tell me the size required to replace it.

Jameso was directly trying to help you on the other thread, as were others. I'm sure he would have an answer for you at some point.

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/pinnacle-arkose-4-front-hub-bearings-help-please

How you think this issue is worth leaving a permanent highly negative review is beyond me.

That doesn't make it a 1-star product though does it.

I agree it Probably doesn't make it a one star bike, my commuter from decathlon had hubs in a grease free situation from new, a bit of faff to sort it out but still a good bike for the money. However for someone not keen on fettling it may make them see the bike as a one star model. Also People here expect / fear a certain level of service from halfords, Evans etc if you get this one of the ways you can moan / flag it up is a crappy review for the product, not necessarily fair but to some degree understandable. I am sure pinnacle bikes are on the whole great products, I keep contemplating the cheap 29er they do

@Cokie
Why did you take the bike if you weren't happy with it, it's your cash you're wasting.

I only know that my branch of Evans have been pretty good to me. Have to put them in a headlock to take money from me. Reviews are a bit of give and take. If reviews point out the same problem like 'cable rattle' or 'soft paint' I take notice, but I like seeing the bikes in the flesh and making up my own mind.

It's nice that a person who deals with the bike in question actually replied repeatedly to the OP. Things like that don't happen in real life.

Has there ever been one of these threads that has gone the way the OP hoped for?

Wish my commuters deore hubs last 6 months between 'servicing' and I only do 5 miles a day. Still, regular servicing every 4 to 5 months keeps on top of it falling to the side of the road. Cokie, you got that new bike sorted yet?

Phone evans in birmingham whom i bought the bike from and they were about as helpful as a fork serving up gravy. They said they wanted to see the wheel first before they could tell me how i go about buying new bearings.
Took the wheel to my local halfords and they were just the same. They said they only service caged bearings. Says a lot for boardman.

So basically you could have gone it, seen them and maybe got somewhere but instead you went to a other chain of shops. Have you tried a decent bike shop?

The best retailers are the ones who invite feedback, and publish that, not moderate what little they receive because they don't ask for out from every customer.

There is a reason so many people keep buying from Amazon. But there are also others, like M&S, who also encourage feedback, and post it almost raw.

This approach dilutes the nutter impact.

If people read all the reviews, they can make informed decisions. Hence I'm curious to know how many people read what is written.

For some products, web reviews are really, really helpful, not whole bikes necessarily, but stuff like consumables.

Reviews can give insight that retailers and manufacturers never provide. As someone with wide feet, I have to spend my life trawling the net to find bike shoes fit.

Why don't Evans publish the rants, respond openly online to those that merit some response, and let people make up their own mind about both the quality of the product AND the quality of their service?

That would be genuinely helpful, transparent and drive up standards all round?

And probably less resource-hungry than moderating every review in detail, so lower overheads too...

This^^^ the fact that evans is moderating 1 star reviews, despite the perceived reasonable response above from jameso, make me distrust them intensely.

The reviews are supposed to be for the product, not for service or for when a buyer can't get Halfords to fix their bike. I reckon they are right to check them. If the review says "the bike is pish because of x, y and z" then fair enough, if it's "the shop boy didn't know about every component part of an assembly I don't have the skills to fix" then that doesn't help at all with the product itself

It might help you get a feeling for the shop though. Anyway he said they don't publish 1 stars until they can resolve them. Hmmmm.

If after further communication -a 1-star generally gets further follow-up- it's a valid complaint rather than a rant-vent or trolling they will be posted up

^ Any complaint that is valid as a review or comment rather than something trolly etc, that's all that needs deciding.

Yes, but one man's troll is another man's complaint, better to be transparent, let the reader decide. Or can we not be trusted to tell the difference?

No. I've met some of the general public. *shudders* at the memory.

I think an awful lot of sites moderate very poor reviews. I've had some pulled for non bike stuff and only put up when I've complained loudly. They then disappear a few weeks later 🙁

The trick is to watch out for sites with lots of 2s but no 1s as you know something is missing. Most 1s are fairly obvious when the problem is partly user error so they should just stay up

So no one has a clue what size bearings go into these hubs?

That's a big plus for me. Obviously means they don't fail very often. If be more worried if they had 10 sets in a box in the workshop........

Not like my brother in laws wheels. 3 fronts and one rear failed in less than 2 months. The shop had actually got a small stock of warranty wheels, different wheels altogether, ready to go. (They don't make them anymore, not in that spoke count anyway! )

have you thought about looking at the bearings and searching for the number that will have been stamped on them?

also if its only been 6 months take the wheel back to evans and get it repaired free of charge under warranty or SOGA

Toys, what I mean is that comments get engaged with, pure trolly giberish isn't something I've seen on the bikes side of it.

I once left a 1 star review on a John Lewis brand freezer that looked like it had been built by a drunken sausage. They rejected it, so all companies do it.

And us lot on here, you included toys, are probably the ones in the minority that actually read the reviews, apply a bit of thought and decide for ourselves what sounds reasonable and what doesn't, but an awful lot of people just look at the overall star rating and form an opinion off that, and a few 1stars can bring that down quite quickly.

In principle I dislike the idea of moderated and censored reviews but I can see why companies do it and feel like they have to, this is a great example, the OP is giving a 1 star review which arguably is unfair, certainly unfair if he actually gave them a chance to support him properly and get his issue fixed, but that 1 star, and a few others could artificially affect the score that most people look at.

Surely 1 star should be reserved for the most rubbish of products that failed to meet your expectations in anyway and would have you chasing a refund? Having some bearings fail prematurely (for reasons wedont know) is an annoyance, and inconvenient sure, but hardly a 1 star, not even a 2 I'd have thought, it's a point to consider in the purchase but also the OP seems to be wanting to complain about the support service as well rather than reviewing this particular product it's bringing that individual store into it too.

One positive thing is that there is a review process, action taken to resolve the complaint if possible, and still allowed through if genuine, and that's been openly acknowledged on here, it could be worse they could just refuse 1 star, or even any negative reviews like some places do...

A few years ago I bought a pair of Hope Pro 3 hubs to build up for my winter road bike. One of the front bearings 'went' after the first ride. I looked online to see what size they are, bought a couple from my local bearing factors and replaced the dodgy one. Bearings are consumables, they 'go'. As it happens the same bearings are still going strong and haven't needed replacing again since. To me, the OP comes across as the kind of customer that shops actively dread.

Why don't you just completely remove the "1 star" rating and rate everything from 1-4, with 1 being equivalent to an old 2, thus completely solving the problem?

Or even better - have a system that goes right to 11!

Or even better - have a system that goes right to 11!

But starts at 7, where 7 is 1, and 11 is a helicopter.

Just remove the bearing and look at the ID markings on it. Buy a new bearing bang it in the hub.
Sometimes moaning about trivial shit just aint worth it.
You could have changed the bearing in less than the time it'd taken you to post your reviews/emails/forums moans.
As others have pointed out bearings are consumables, just think of it as an upgrade.

Even if there's no markings on it, you can still just measure the dimensions of the bearing and go from there. not sure why this is so hard for any shop to grasp.

This thread is making me despair.

-Customer asks shop for advice on a bearing in an old model hub. Shop, like most shops, doesn't know and needs to look at it.
-Customer won't take the wheel for them to look at it.
-Takes it apart himself, even though he doesn't know what he's doing (unscrewing cartridge bearings from a hub for goodness sake!)
-Asks online, is told by the man who is in charge of that stuff at Evans it will be looked into but the manufacturer must be consulted first, on a Saturday.
-Customer ignores this, posts 1 star review and subsequent moany thread.

Jacob46, get over yourself. Jameso is doing all he can to sort this for you. He will give you an answer when the manufacturer gets back to him. I have worked in shops and no one knows what bearings are in most hubs off the top of their head. Evans list around 1250 adult bikes on their website, how do you expect them to know all the bearing sizes for each of them?

Also it doesn't warrant a 1 star review. A pair of bearings, costing about £10, which are consumables, failing after 6 months in the wettest winter on record, on a bike you apparently use every day is a relatively minor inconvenience and part of owning a bike. If the rest of the bike is fine it is probably a 4 star bike, with a note to say the front hub could do with better sealing.

Jesus wept. I suspect if you don't go back to Evans they won't miss you.

For contrast I started using Evans two years ago as a shop of last resort, expecting mediocrity, and was so impressed I think their shops are the bricks and mortar bike shops I have been to most since. They have been great at getting hard to find bits, informing me during the process and exceptional with a warranty claim on a bike I didn't even buy from them when the distributor was being tricksy.

^ that.

There's an Arkose 4 in my shed, it's not a 1 star bike, it's bloomin marvellous.

So were there any flames involved?
It always makes a good story when things catch on fire

munrobiker +1

OP, why didn't you just take the bike to a decent shop and say "my front hub is knackered, please fix it." ?
Half a day and maybe £15 later, you'd have had the bike back.

As it is, you've created a whole load of hassle over essentially a non-issue. A disposable load-bearing item has worn out and needs replacing.

OP, why didn't you just take the bike to a decent shop and say "my front hub is knackered, please fix it." ?

Or just do what he was asked to do, and take it in to the place he bought it from so they could have a look and sort it out.

Rather than stamping his feet and saying "no.... I'm taking it to halfords!"

But he needs the bike every day. So can't leave it with the shop. Except it's unusable anyway. 😕

I'm confused.

KT hubs, seem to be Quando's, which is what is fitted to the bike, if its this one:

http://www.evanscycles.com/products/pinnacle/arkose-4-2016-adventure-road-bike-ec122276?country=GB&currency=GBP&esvt=872-GOUKE1174586&esvq=&esvadt=999999-0-601934-1&esvcrea=86309948576&esvplace=&esvd=c&esvo=EV244110-S-RED&esvaid=50080&gclid=CNftyN7H9coCFQ8W0wodoMAOBg

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=6&ved=0ahUKEwiY7dCXyfXKAhUCPxQKHQYtByEQFgg5MAU&url=http%3A%2F%2Fktgroup.net%2Flib%2Fdl_file.php%3Fdir%3Dcatalogues%26filename%3DSeaagwFGL9agAE9JqUoSLANWTpn4ig%26o_file%3DKT%25202016%2520Catalogue.pdf&usg=AFQjCNH_Y39J262BA3cDPLluJq-_0iI0Vw

i'm confused have you removed the dead bearing yet?

Some pics have been posted on the op other thread

Are they of tinfoil 'apparatus'?

as helpful as a fork serving up gravy.

Dread to think what star review the OP would leave for my wife's gravy 😉

For the sake of balance, I've just bought a new Norco full susser from a London Evans store and on the whole I'm very pleased with the service I received.

The guys who I dealt with answered all my questions and gave real world feedback - I wasn't expecting to find experienced mountain bike owning staff in an urban store. They were able to give me good advice on setup and component choice.

I was emailed by Evans for feedback, which I've provided.

They'll certainly be getting my business in future.

There is no way on this earth every shop can possibly have the information on each bearing used on all the bikes they sell.

Sometimes manufacturers can make a running change and not communicate it to the shops. Its just not something IMHO you can expect the shop to have in-depth knowledge of.

Think we all agree that the OP lost when he wrote early-doors "was asked to bring it in to Evans, I refused and took it to Halfords". If that formed part of the 1 star review I'd have left it up for comedy.

And I also read reviews looking for comments on specific issues and trends, but maybe we are in the minority. I tend to ignore 1 star as written by hystericals, and 5 star as they tend to be " literally just unpacked it and it looks ace!!! Not used it yet though" and look for those with a bit of nuance.

Ref Amazon, I recommend Pat Butcher alarm clock, Paul Ross Canvas Print, Bic pens for women, and T shirt with 3 wolves print. You'll lose a day but it'll be worth it 😉

Can someone re-organise the thread title to say 'Evans Cycles customer bike review misleading' ?

Same words, but a more accurate description of events...

I think the this thread vindicates Evans' policy of reviewing one star comments for action rather than publishing them blindly.

Premature failure of a hub bearing and a refusal to take the wheel in for rectification does not make the bike a one star bike. A catastrophic frame failure might, but not something benign and easily replaced. Vent your angst that it failed somewhere if you really must but don't distort the average rating of the bike for a component that would likely be fitted to bikes from many other brands, unless you're somehow going to identify and mark them all down too.

If you need the bike for work drift out the bearings use a penknife to lever out the seal clean the ballbearings with wd40 pack a shed load of grease in and reassemble. At some point in this make a note of the part number or measure the dimensions of the bearing. Ride your bike till Evans can sort some new bearings or you order some.

Bearings are liable to wear and tear and may last months or years dependent on factors beyond your and a bike shops control.

Did i miss the bit where someone suggested removing the bearing and measuing it then replacing the worn offending item with a shiny new one ?

Its so unlikely its a propriatory bearing on a pinnicle.

Did i miss the bit where someone suggested removing the bearing and measuing it then replacing the worn offending item with a shiny new one ?

trail_rat- he doesn't know how to get the bearing out. So he'd need to take it to a shop anyway at some point...

Maybe he could take it to the shop where he bought it ?

Has anyone suggested that yet ?

Yes, I believe the chain he bought it from did suggest that...