Forum menu
So, bought a pair of the above on the back of the recent PSA. On the whole very pleased with them, they fit better and are more comfortable than my old endura trousers although I miss the lower leg zip for getting pads on. Anyway, first ride yesterday. Imagine my delight on discovering I had a soggy arse crack after going through the first puddle! Strange I thought seeing as they are supposed to be DWR treated. So, today I had a look at them with a view to washing but they weren't too mucky at all, good enough for another ride anyway apart from the arse area that was covered in muddy splashes. Rather than gring the muck in on the saddle next ride I thought I would just give that area a quick rinse off. Sure enough water beaded straight off the legs but soaked straight through the arse panels. Do they miss this area on purpose for some reason or are they faulty?
I had a pair of Singletrack trousers a good few years ago, pretty sure they weren't even slightly waterproof, a lad I ride with has the MT500 trousers (they are waterproof) and has been more than impressed since he bought them, they do cost a fair bit more tho
I have them too and they aren't waterproof in the slightest. Even bought the re-proofer from Endura and still not great.
Other than that the trousers are great though
There's a good article on the Alpkit website IIRC about fabrics etc. Early DWRs were very good and lasted long but contained forever chemicals which never broke down. Modern DWRs are more environmentally friendly, but not as good at repelling water and don't last....
I've not found a modern DWR which lasts more than a few wash cycles.
Well, these have not been washed before so the DWR should still be intact. As I said water beaded off the legs no problem. Just went straight through the arse.
I was always under the impression that a Durable Water Repellent’s job was to stop the outer layer ‘wetting-out’ so that the waterproof and breathable layer, Gore-Tex for example, can do its job properly. It doesn’t make something that isn’t waterproof waterproof. Have a read here
@Watty I agree, that is the job of a DWR. But on the legs of the trousers under a full flowing tap the water simply ran/beaded off leaving the fabric dry as you would expect with a DWR but the rear panels wetted out straight away and became soaked.
I would imagine that the dwr had worn off given that it's the saddle area, IME the "durable" bit of "durable water repellancy" is not accurate.
Nope, first ride of two hours and parts of that panel are further up the back and not being sat on.
Aye, contact endura, they sound shite.
I gave up on endura stuff, it's too hit and miss.
Found the same with another brand too. I think some shorts/trousers are just designed really badly by someone who doesn't understand why people might not want mudguards.
Nope, first ride of two hours and parts of that panel are further up the back and not being sat on.
Sounds strange then. Is it a different fabric to the rest of the trousers?
Having the same sort of problem, bought some MTR waterproof shell trousers from CRC.
Rode two hours in slop and puddles and the seat definitely isn’t waterproof, it even let some of the grit in.
Am I asking too much of these or are all ‘waterproof’ the same, ie sitting on a muddy wet saddle ?
Strange I thought seeing as they are supposed to be DWR treated
DWR isn't waterproofing. It's like say, felt, or fleece - water beads off felt if you sprinkle it on, but if you press the water into the fabric it goes in. If you sit on wet ground for example on DWR treated fabric you get a wet arse just as quickly.
It's also not that durable - it rubs off fairly easily so pretty much anything - rucksack straps, other clothes etc will rub it off quickly, as can washing. Washing in sports or outdoor specific detergent might help - Tech Wash or the Assos outdoor gear stuff might help a bit.
Given that, the saddle and back area of shorts/trousers is the absolute worst possible case for any fabric, especially DWR or waterproof stuff. That's where it gets covered in mud and then ground in from your rucksack and seat. It's being covered in abrasive paste effectively, so rubbing it against anything - even other clothes, or during washing is abrading it.
So use a mudguard if you want your clothing to last in winter. And don't expect miracles. Well designed shorts should have a super tough panel on the arse that doesn't need to be breathable - but for me, on many garmets the panel doesn't come up my huge arse far enough so I end up sitting on the waterproof fabric not the tough stuff. I sewed an extra panel on my Endura shorts for this reason.
@riklegge yes it is. On looking closer the rear panel extends down the whole back of the legs. The endura website says they are made from nylon fabric. The front definately feels like nylon and has a shiny finish. This is where the water runs off. I don't know what the rear is made from but it feels more like cotton with a mate finish and definately not water proof/resistant at all. I will email Endura and see what they say about it. I might just spray some DWR on it and see what happens.
Endura's waterproofing generally isn't great ime (they didn't even seem to understand my complaint when my "waterproof" gloves leaked, the response was genuinely "It's perfectly normal for waterproof stuff to not be wateproof")
But in fairness DWR is great for getting water to run off, it's not good for bits you're sitting on, that needs a real waterproof rather than a resistant/beading layer. You're not just asking it to resist water, you're asking it to resist you sitting on the water, after all.
There are three levels of waterproofness:
Water resistant: Does nothing. Pain in the arse to wash
Waterproof: Water resistant. Takes forever to dry.
Goretex/equivalent: Waterproof.
IME the “durable” bit of “durable water repellancy” is not accurate.
Yep, it should be called not very durable water repellency...