[Closed] Ellsworth Epiphany or Moment?

how heavy are you? and where are you based? you can have a go on my silly light epi is you are local(ish) to see what you think if you want.

to be honest the epi is great and I've not noticed any flex in the frame. It's one of the best bikes I've ever had.

I'd side towards the moment. I have the epiphany and its the best bike I've ridden it goes up better than most race bikes and can hold its own on the descents then you ride it it doesn't feel flexy. But if its second hand you've got no warranty. I'm 70kg I've had 2 new rockers and a new front triangle with warranty(lakes rockyness). If you do still want to go the epiphany route the rockers got to be the alloy version the mag ones were chocolate. But if your saying your heavy the moment would be the way to go as there bombproof.

Tazzy, I'm in liverpool. Ive always wanted an epiphany but I think I am moving towards the moment. My old 575 was a great bike but the rear was a little flexy and I have a feeling the ephiphany may be too with my 100kg.

Don't want to run 36s though, how'd the moment be with 140mm revs?

Tazzy, any pics of your epiphany?

Whats the bottom bracket height on each one? From memory its 14inches+ My old I.D was high and it always felt like I was sat ontop of a bloody horse.

Loddrik there are pics of my epi on the best bike for The uk thread its now got 140 mm fox on it and still comes in at 25lb. I'm fAirly close to you so if you did want a nosey at it I could always meet ya for a blast round the clwyds llandegla.

Whats the bottom bracket height on each one? From memory its 14inches+ My old I.D was high and it always felt like I was sat ontop of a bloody horse.

The Epiphany’s a totally different beast to the ID, you instantly feel at home on it and it has very neutral handling and incredible climbing traction. For me it’s the ultimate big day in the lakes bike. The reviews and numerous best trail bike awards back this up...... just wish it was a bit more robust.....but you can't have everything it simply wouldn't climb as well if they beefed it up.

My Moment has Pace RC41 Fighters which are a fairly low axle to crown height compared to most 150mm forks.

So 140mm Revs would be OK, but I'd advise going a bit longer and taking advantage of those lovely angles.

Mine is built up to around 30lb so they're not a silly heavy bike.

That's with Chris Kings/717s/Ignitors, Saint Triple/XT and Hope M4s.

I've had both, sold the Epi a couple of years ago but still got my Moment. The Epiphany is definitely flexy. If you sit on it and move the bars from side to side you get an alarming amount of flex. Head angle is well steep too. Those two things aside it is very light and the ict four bar is superb, so rides well.

I reckon you need a Moment. I weighed my frame only and it weighs 7.14lbs with an rp23 (best shock forget the dhx air) and is rock solid. I still love it now and despite having a blingy carbon zesty it still gets plenty of use. The BB height isn't a problem (its the same as a Nomad) I think the issue is shock set up, especially with a DHX air. The ict four bar is very plush and its easy to put too much air in thinking you've got it right and then it sits too high in its travel, hence the high bb problems.

the Cotic Hemlock is basically the same as a 'Moment' - perhaps a touch lighter...

(and you've got the option of playing with the 120/150mm rockers)

(edit; it's the same weight - my Hemlock weighs a shade over 7lbs)

If you sit on it and move the bars from side to side you get an alarming amount of flex

If you sit on it and move the bars from side to side you get an alarming amount of flex.

No offense but that’s over exaggerated bl*ll*cks! Mines been up and down toughest stuff the lakes has to offer and the bike has absolutely no tracking issues or noticeably worrying flex. In fact your old bike(ridethelakes) came on quite a few of those rides too and ate it up with a top rider onboard. 😉

I should add that I'm around 85kg. If the OP is around 100kg, I'd say the Moment would be by far the better choice.

Tazz, thanks for the offer and normally I'd have been well up for that but if I'm going to for the epiphany I've got to let him know by weds.

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Still one of the nicest looking bikes IMO. Unfortunately, for me it didn't live upto the dream. ridethelakes was banging onto me 2 years ago about swapping the dhx5 for a rp23, but I decided that whatever shock is mounted, it would still have a 14"+ bb, so didn't take up his advice. I should point out that my 2006 frame was designed for 150mm forks and I had 160mm fox 36s, so wasn't doing myself any favours. I recall a mag write up at the time saying the head angle was quite steep and that they wouldn't go below 150mm for forks (2005/6 frame).
One plus point is that I became completely sold on the horst link system, it rides lovely and grips noticably well on rooty climbs, consequently I now have a Cube Stereo with a 13" bb.
There was a write up last year in a STW mag of the newer Moment, their conclusion was that it was the Harley Davison of MTB bikes, great for cruising big mountain routes, but for play biking, they didn't like that 'perched' feel either.

From memory they were designed with US/Moab trails in mind where clearance is important.

. I'm 70kg I've had 2 new rockers and a new front triangle with warranty(lakes rockyness)

😯 they are supposed to be designed for riding on mountains, and by people far heavier than you.

they are supposed to be designed for riding on mountains, and by people far heavier than you.

Yeh but that more of a reflection of the type of riding we regularly do in the lakes. For the record I've also snapped 2 Oranges and a Specialized. The only bike I haven't had go is my old Fat Chance, thats a truely indestructible bike.

I did tell the OP he'd be better off with the Moment at if he's 100kg.

Keep hearing about the epiphany flex - never noticed it on mine though ( 175lb rider) So I think its more urban myth than actual truth.

Run mine with 150mm forks. As said previously. It climbs like a mtn goat and will handle the Dh just as effortlessly.
I did snap the rear mag rocker, but the redesigned alu rocker has proved 100% on the good sized drops and jumps its been taken down.

Superb bike.

anc - Member

If you sit on it and move the bars from side to side you get an alarming amount of flex.

No offense but that’s over exaggerated bl*ll*cks! Mines been up and down toughest stuff the lakes has to offer and the bike has absolutely no tracking issues or noticeably worrying flex. In fact your old bike(ridethelakes) came on quite a few of those rides too and ate it up with a top rider onboard.

No offence taken, this is stw after all 😀

Its true though, try it. You just need to hold the seat with your thighs and move the bars from side to side.

Cove Hustler might be worth a look at, for the age you are thinking of. MBR did a 4 bike test in 2007, with a Hustler, Epiphany, 5spot and Orange 5. The Hustler & 5 got 10/10, 5spot & Epiphany 8/10.

Ellsworth Epiphany or Moment

The answer is Lapierre.

Having rode the cove hustler, I can reliably inform you its a right old fridge to ride .. which means the epiphany must be an even worse stinker to score less ... thats it, my epiphany is going out with the rubbish tonight.

Tbh I wanted another Maverick as it's still the best bike I've ever ridden but ive had a wtb for a while now with no success. Pretty much sold on an Ellsworth now though, the cove looks like a bit of a tank...

As for a lapierre, I'm a little wary about bikes designed by the cheese eating surrender monkeys... 😉

You must have some thunderous thighs ridethelakes

I had one for a few years. It was ok, BB was a bit too high though. Test rode a DW Spot and loved it compared to the Moment - way stiffer and pisses all over it in general. They look pretty though. Plus having several dealings with Tony Ellsworth himself put me off and didn't want to ride a bike with his name on. One misaligned frame, one cracked frame, two broken chainstays and a problem with shot peen that had been left in the frame - these things happen, it's just the way and manner they are/were dealt with put me off for life.

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If you sit on it and move the bars from side to side you get an alarming amount of flex.

Having owned one, i have to say this is true. It is a lightweight XC bike and you don't really notice it when riding but I never really got on with mine, just didn't have much confidence on it. Not sure why. They look nice and they're expensive, but i'm not sure they actually ride that well. Also, warranty support from Freeborn was pretty poor given the cost of the frames.

I didn't notice any flex issues with my Moment, although it wasn't something I was particularly looking for. As ChunkyMTB, I did have issues with the shot penned finish residue inside the seat tube (06 frame). The result being that it left really bad scratch marks on the seatpost. It was something that I had read about on internet posts, so wasn't particularly suprised by it, I don't think newer frames have this issue, purely a cosmetic issue anyway.
As I stated above, it generally rode really nicely, the suspension system was great in general trail riding situations, very planted and plush. I liked the horst link system so much, I've since sort out something with the same suspension system (Cube Stereo).
But, I did alot of play biking, a bunch of mates standing at the top of something steep type stuff, egging each other on to dare ride down it. It definitely wasn't the bike for that, it didn't inspire any confidence with it's perched feel. I still went down stuff occasionally, but didn't really enjoy it anymore on the Moment, so sold the frame on.
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Some people buy an Ellsworth here as they (probably) think its a premium and higher-end product due to its pricing.

In part its rare because of its pricing but also because its not the best for its money. There are far far better frames out there from closer manufacturers aren't they?

I still blame my fall in 2003 on my I.D. As I never really did feel at ease or comfortable riding anything on it. The place where I hurt myself- I rode down it first time, first time back without checking on a Santa Cruz Blur4x. At ease with the frame and its handling. Never was on a Ellsworth and never could have done that same bit again on it.

This coming from an ex-raging Gear Queer.

Some people also buy Ellsworths because they are great bikes and the reviews bear that out. One mans meat is anothers poison and the definition of there being better bikes for the money is an entirely subjective one...

What would a better bike be for the money, say, a 5 spot? More people will come down on the side of a 5 spot as more people have ridden/owned one as they are more accessible. However most reviews don't bear out that's its better and a lot of this nonsense is anecdotal anyway.

I still blame my fall in 2003 on my I.D. As I never really did feel at ease or comfortable riding anything on it. The place where I hurt myself- I rode down it first time, first time back without checking on a Santa Cruz Blur4x. At ease with the frame and its handling. Never was on a Ellsworth and never could have done that same bit again on it.

Poor craftsman in tools blaming shocker!! Haha

😆

Nowadays I blame the tyres, psi in forks, bar length, saddle height, number of biscuits in backpack....

😆

I'm quite alarmed at how many posts talk about them breaking 😯

I think they're ugly too - a mahoosive rocker link on a bike that by the sounds of it can't take the hits??! I don't get it

Who cares if a bike is ugly, are you planning to marry it?

Who cares if a bike is ugly

Most definitely me, and I hazard a guess that most of the other STWers too

[EDIT]...but not you clearly 😆

I've yet to see a pretty full suspension frame.

hora, there's a difference between "pretty" and "not ugly". You're "not ugly" bless you (opens up can and watches worms crawl out), but you won't find me calling you pretty anytime soon 😯

Awwwww number in profile (dont tell binners though)

OK, but promise you'll wear your lycra on the first date 😉

I think the ID was a completely different bike. Basically a 6" rocker on a lightweight 4" bike, thats why it had the crazy high BB and strange handling.

Epiphany and Moment are designed for their travel from the start. If i was buying again, i'd have got the Moment, though they've gone up to 2k now and theres no way i'd pay that.

Stilltortoise - if you think a fs bike can be pretty, I'd hate to see your [s]Boyfriend[/s] wife...

'twas not me who used the words [i]pretty [/i]and [i]bike [/i]in the same sentence. My point was that the Epiphany is fugly and that is enough reason for me not to want one. I used to like it until I saw one in the flesh. Blergh! Frankly I've never understood how anyone can call a bike pretty, and I've seen plenty of people try on here

.

Incidentally I am selling my Moment at the moment (forgive the pun).

Here is the Classifieds post: [url= http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/fs-ellsworth-moment-plus-a-few-other-bits ]STW Post[/url]

Im afraid that I cant really comment on the Epiphany but definitly can provide insight into the Moment. I think what I have fits the bill for you.

email me.

There are alot uglier bikes about than the epiphany ... but then again, beauty is in the eye of the beholder .. not jealous types..

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Nice bike but why the OEM air pikes?

Its an old pic .. its got fox 150mm forks on now.

Why the OEM forks back then ... because they were the cheapest 140mm pikes I could find back then.

Newer pic with the fox150mm forks..

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hmmm.
Few mixed opinions here, i own both a Heckler and an 04 Moment from when they first came out,

Hora the old ID's were'nt good yes indeed wierd set up,

my moment bb is 13.75inches,nowt wrong with that.those who say they cant ride down steep stuff and play around,i dont get it :?,thought the moment was good at this imo...

i prefer the moment over the heckler,in most cases.

would'nt have another though,i like change,plus tony ellsworth is a dick ha.

Just took the plunge on an epiphany, I guess I was seduced by having a lightweight 5in bike, besides I ride pretty smooth so I reckon it was probably better suited to me.

Just gotta swap the Float R for an RP23 or similar...

ust gotta swap the Float R for an RP23 or similar.

noooooooo, the float is fine,! the rp23 isn't needed on the epi. Lot's of people spec a frame with one cos they're seen as having bells and whistles and for a lot of horrible pedaling bob monsters they're great, the epi's are that good they don't need it.

Have a look on the ellsworth owners club for some more info on it.

mine came with an RP23 and I've ridden the same model/year with a float, set up to the same sag etc... and the more "basic" shock felt more supple.

Thanks for the info Tazz, I'll see how it goes then. I guess if I bump into another epi rider in n Wales I can probably assume it's you..

The only one I've come across was at Leith Hill.

if it's an ugly muggins with loads of piercings and a goatee beard mincing like a queen it'll be me. 😀

I'm quite alarmed at how many posts talk about them breaking

I think they're ugly too - a mahoosive rocker link on a bike that by the sounds of it can't take the hits??! I don't get it

+1 they're really not supposed to break!