[Closed] Doping in sports that aren’t cycling

Well theres no doubt that Operation Puerto involved Tennis and Football.....including some mega names....but I think the issue is probably driven by money.....look how Armstrong was able to weild influence with the power of his cash; he could manipulate people, organisations (even the press) because he could afford to...now think about that x10 or x100 and you are looking at tennis, Golf, Football.....

If you read about other sports, like rugby, you'd see the doping stories.

tennis, Golf, Football.....

Those, rugby and athletics spring to mind. Less tests = less people being caught. Hard to imagine that there's so few footballers caught given how many people play worldwide and how much money is involved. Too many vested interests....

Major problem in combat sports. I reckon a large amount of UFC fighters are on testosterone boosting. Some claim legitimate use due to supposed low test levels, others using under the radar.

Also a lot of drug cheats in boxing. Several high profile fighters got caught this year. Steroids, test, diuretics etc.

Given the aim of the sports is to inflict as much damage as possible on your opponent, drug cheating in combat sports is disgusting.

i'm going to say 3 thrings, which are in no way connected.

tennis.

rafa.

fuentes.

i'm sure it's all completely innocent.

ahwiles, I too will say three unrelated things:

Football
Spanish World Cup winning squad
Fuentes

Lots of sports don't test, so drug use isn't cheating. That's the most sensible approach.

i'm going to say 3 thrings, which are in no way connected.

tennis.

rafa.

fuentes.

i'm sure it's all completely innocent.

Go on then, evidence? As is, your comment is basically libel.

Of course other sports have doping problems that are hidden. I don't think all sports have fundamental or endemic doping problems though.

Cycling has a structure that means the culture could easily take hold

- massive benefits of doping both physically and financially (not all sports pay well), particularly considering many of the people involved come from relatively poor backgrounds.
- undetectable doping methods
- riders brought into teams which become their families (since they're away from home)
- tacit acceptance of doping in many countries where the sport is most popular

I reckon that there are several other sports where you could tick all those boxes.

ahwiles, I too will say three unrelated things:

Football
Spanish World Cup winning squad
Fuentes

Fuentes was apparently linked to Real Madrid: the 2006 squad included Beckham... perhaps the English football team is involved, too? 😯

Mogrim, that would not suprise me in the slightest.

Mogrim, that would not suprise me in the slightest.

dopey != doped 🙂

Where there's money and prestige there is doping of some kind. UK-based football players have been mentioned in the same reports as Spanish dope doctors. US baseball + football, tennis, sprinters, the lot I expect.

I reckon that there are several other sports where you could tick all those boxes.

[b]Any[/b] sport where performance can be improved through drugs will have someone taking them. If you look hard enough, you will probably find a performance enhancing drug suitable for every sport.

There's a big difference between some people taking them and doping being endemic. There are sports where it's not endemic. There are almost certainly no sports that are 100% clean.

There's a big difference between some people taking them and doping being endemic. There are sports where it's not endemic. There are almost certainly no sports that are 100% clean.

What do you mean by "endemic"? And given the apparent lack of testing for a lot of sports, what is your claim based on?

There does seem to be a bit of asymmetry to the reporting of doping cases in the media - there didn't seem to be much of a fuss made about a big chunk of the Jamaican athletics team being caught doping.

Baseball and American football were (are?) rife with drugs for a long time. Basically a blind eye was turned to it for years.

You've got to look at the amount of testing that is done in other sports. Members of man United were complaining about being overtested a few years ago, I believe they were tested about 4 times in a season.

If you think about it cycling and athletics are probably ahead of the game compared to a lot of mainstream sports when it comes to testing. Unfortunately that means that they are the sports most associated with drug cheats.

The argument always put forward to defend the 'lack' of drugs in such sports as tennis and football is that it's a game where skill is more important and being fitter isn't as big an advantage as in cycling/athletics.

But if you're stronger, faster with better endurance you've got a massive advantage over clean players at the end of 90 minutes of football.

Tom KP

Roger Federer from

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/tennis/24858647

"Last year, when I was on the run - Dubai, Rotterdam, Indian Wells, when I won the three - and the year before that, I didn't get tested in one of those three events that I won".

😯

"For me, that's not OK. You just show up and test a guy that's winning everything. That's sometimes what I struggle with."

Cycling has high levels of testing and self-flagellates due to its history, other sports (with far more money) sweep it under the carpet.

There does seem to be a bit of asymmetry to the reporting of doping cases in the media - there didn't seem to be much of a fuss made about a big chunk of the Jamaican athletics team being caught doping.

not only that, the reports were almost apologetic and they very strongly carried the athlete's line (accidental, someone elses fault).

Summary of 100m's level of taint here (comparable to TdeF winners?)

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/other-sports/326607/The-drugs-history-of-the-10-fastest-100m-runners-of-all-time

and for mogrim

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2013/mar/22/blood-doping-trial-fuentes-real-madrid

What do you mean by "endemic"?

Part of the culture, the norm, accepted.

And given the apparent lack of testing for a lot of sports, what is your claim based on?

My own experience as it goes but then I can't think of any other way of proving it for certain. I competed at a high enough level in a sport to take the view that it wasn't happening to any significant degree within it despite GB being world class at it. I saw people progress to that level in a believable and realistic way.

and for mogrim

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2013/mar/22/blood-doping-trial-fuentes-real-madrid

It was reported here, too - what I find amazing is that any sporting organisation would risk going anywhere near Fuentes. But then no one seems to care about drug use in football, I suppose.

My own experience as it goes but then I can't think of any other way of proving it for certain. I competed at a high enough level in a sport to take the view that it wasn't happening to any significant degree within it despite GB being world class at it. I saw people progress to that level in a believable and realistic way.

Out of interest - what sport?

Rowing

Come to think of it though I could be a doper and telling porky pies

I probably would have actually made the team though in that case 😉

Long article but some interesting info http://www.4dfoot.com/2013/02/09/doping-in-football-fifty-years-of-evidence/

Rowing

Come to think of it though I could be a doper and telling porky pies

I probably would have actually made the team though in that case

Ah! So the team members were doping then? 🙂

🙂 it'd be nice to claim that was why they were better than me. Problem was that I competed against many of them from teens and as I said, progression was perfectly believable.

And I never even heard a whisper or rumour about doping. That definitely wouldn't have been the case for a comparable cyclist.

And that's where a lot of the criteria I listed are relevant. rowing tends to be a pretty middle class sport with little financial reward - as such it's not usually seen as a way to escape from a life of poverty/boring jobs/etc.

I'd say tennis is the one with the most potential for massive scandal - genuine global sport, gentlemanly image with clear rules for conduct, one of the most evolved in terms of gender equality, laughable testing regime etc etc.
'Racquet technology' seems to have come a long way in recent years, and the public will not be impressed when the real reasons for performance enhancement come to light.

The other sports with drug problems are either not in the public eye so much - e.g. rugby league - at the end of the day no one's arsed about 26 northern steroid monkeys bashing into one another; or there's a sort of tacit agreement with the paying public to facilitate drug use. Usain bolt, for example, is not cheating the system all on his own. The system (media, fans, governing bodies) wants to see the 100m olympic final run in 9.6 seconds, not 10.1 seconds. It's a complicated situation.
In things like the NFL it's not even complicated IMO - systemic drug use that everyone (players, teams, unions, fans) accepts as producing a sport product that they all want to see.

Isn't it powerlifting that has two supervising organisations in the UK; one rigorously drug tests, the other doesn't. There's about a 1/3 increase in records achieved under the latter.

Tennis is going to look very bad indeed when doping eventually comes to light. The reason so many doping stories relate to cycling is because the authorities are actively looking.

There was a story last week about now redundant Spurs manager AVB aiming to get two players 'match fit' by spinning their blood, essentially removing a bag of blood a while before a game and then letting them have it back just before the game.

It was said that Mourhinio (?) is also an advocate of it and it's common practise throughout Spain & Portugal especially.

But as mentioned the financial clout of football means they have the balls to talk about it openly in the media.

Not to mention the 'Vitamin' injections that England players have all talked about having in the past to replenish stores when playing in hot countries like Italy in the 90's

to the OP: if you have several hours to waste there is a thread in the cyclingnews clinic forum about this, you might find it of interest:

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?s=e0920894ace1029491ce09366f44341e&t=11396

[url= http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football-drugs-in-serie-a---italy-sinking-deeper-into-scandal-1178042.html ]http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football-drugs-in-serie-a---italy-sinking-deeper-into-scandal-1178042.html[/url]

now consider Chelsea of the same era?

[url] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Mutu [/url]

Now tell me drugs are not an issue in Football.

The other sports with drug problems are either not in the public eye so much - e.g. rugby league - at the end of the day no one's arsed about 26 northern steroid monkeys bashing into one another;

I know someone who plays in this environment and he tells me they get random testing even during their training.

Athletes tread a thin line, there are acceptable levels and unacceptable levels for many many substances. Therefore competitors will push the boundaries to be on the cusp of what's acceptable to be on a level playing field.

There was a story last week about now redundant Spurs manager AVB aiming to get two players 'match fit' by spinning their blood, essentially removing a bag of blood a while before a game and then letting them have it back just before the game.

You made that sound like blood doping which it isn't.

In fact you just got it completely wrong tbf.

You made that sound like blood doping which it isn't.

How isn't it?

I know someone who plays in this environment and he tells me they get random testing even during their training.

I should bloody hope so! Failing in competition tests is a mark of stupidity; there has to be out of competition testing too.

Athletics seems to have plenty of problems.

Another sport that I will mention for no particular reason:

Formula 1 / motor racing

How isn't it?

That particular process is about white blood cells, the blood taken is span in a centrifuge to extract white blood cells, they are then administered to the patient in a specific area of the body where there is damage that needs to be repaired. Blood doping is about increasing an athletes ability to transport oxygen about the body. Totally different.

That particular process is about white blood cells, the blood taken is span in a centrifuge to extract white blood cells, they are then administered to the patient in a specific area of the body where there is damage that needs to be repaired.

Ah! I see! It's either pseudoscientific bollocks (with no obvious physiological basis and significant risks), or it's a cover for blood doping, then?

Lets just call it blood manipulation then shall we?

Football is the next 'big one'.

An obvious advantage to be gained and probably the worst administrators for sweeping stuff under the carpet that might affect the 'image' (i.e. money-making potential) of the game will have contributed.

The lid is already starting to be lifted with the betting and match fixing - next stop doping crisis...........

dannyh - Member

Football is the next 'big one'.

An obvious advantage to be gained and probably the worst administrators for sweeping stuff under the carpet that might affect the 'image' (i.e. money-making potential) of the game will have contributed.

The lid is already starting to be lifted with the betting and match fixing - next stop doping crisis..