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I filter but expect the worst and ride accordingly. On the trike filtering is much harder due to width. I’m always careful to be on my side if the road if there is ever oncoming traffic.
That manoeuvre looked grim. But I’m always watching the car wheels for any deviation. When you are at their level the impact will be much more fun. First impact is with a chainring, and they do penetrate a door, apparently.
Looks deliberate to me. Appears as if he/she floors it to hit the cyclist, and then to not notice a person fly across your entire windscreen, drive over them, and then continue to drag them along under the car?
It’s why we call them accidents, they’re not deliberate.
That's exactly why police etc. don't call them accidents any more.
They're not random events, they are things that happen because of people's behaviour. The driver might not have set out to run someone over but his failure to look and then not stopping and actually running over the cyclist made it happen.
but his failure to look
Failure to see and failure to look are 2 different things.
Where does ‘overtaking’ become ‘filtering’ or is it the same thing?
In my head, overtaking is what you do down the outside, filtering is on the inside or between rows.
I also do. And rule 211 advises drivers turning right across slow-moving or stationary traffic that cyclists or motorbikes may be on thr inside if the traffic they are crossing.
That's a horrible video though. Can't see that the cyclist did anything wrong, but ompossible to tell if the driver hadn't checked blind spot at all.
Can’t see that the cyclist did anything wrong
IMO the cyclist was going too quickly for the conditions/traffic.
Where does ‘overtaking’ become ‘filtering’ or is it the same thing?
Filtering is simply, AIUI, when you're in the same lane as the vehicle you're overtaking.
The driver might not have set out to run someone over but his failure to look and then not stopping and actually running over the cyclist made it happen.
When my son's been waving a wooden sword about and hit his sister, he'll claim "I didn't try to hurt her!" as if that exonerates him. My stock response is, "that's not the point; the point is you didn't try not to hurt her". The same applies on the road 99% of the time: barely anyone's out to actively hurt anyone, but that doesn't mean they're not guilty of disregarding a (legal or moral) duty of care of others.
That's up the road from my work and the standard of driving in the area is absolutely horrendous. Nothing suprises me any more around bham where driving is concerned
In my head, overtaking is what you do down the outside, filtering is on the inside or between rows.
Me too. But I was thinking more for the purpose of legal definitions/ highway code?
The Highway Code does not recognise filtering (as cyclists appear to use the word) at all. You are either in a lane of traffic, overtaking on the right (OK if you follow the Code) or overtaking on the left (only allowed in specific circumstances eg when traffic is "moving slowly in lanes").
That's hideous, how do you not notice hitting someone. They've maybe just carried on in utter panic - like their brain switched off and they just completed the move automatically.
Its not often I ride on the road these days, but if i do filter its down the middle, but slowly and only when the traffic is stationary. I only filter on the left if I'm turning left at traffic lights and there is a long queue
The Highway Code does not recognise filtering (as cyclists appear to use the word) at all.
Rule 211 mentions "filtering through traffic" in the context of both motorcycling and cycling.
If cars are moving I filter down the outside.
Maybe the answer is its fine and legal but watch out for the idiots out to kill you, be careful and learn from mistakes.
Reflective practice - It really helps. Anytime I get into a "near miss" I try to analyse it and incorporate the lessons into future riding. Road position, speed, time, weather, traffic, road surface, was I concentrating, drunk 😉 , tired ? I apply it to mountainbike crashes as well.
Safe riding is something learned.
I filter but expect the worst and ride accordingly.
^^ this +100.
I filter but I assume that I have to look after myself as it's unlikely anyone else will. To be honest that's how I drive too. Of the thankfully few incidents I've had in my driving career since 1981, only one was truly unforeseeable.
scary stuff - does anyone know if the chap is ok?
I would not be overtaking at that speed in those conditions, in fact I would have probably popped onto the pavement if there was no one on it. These days its so dodgy I mostly sit and wait my turn with the cars, doing so seems to have reduced my close passes I used to receive. My logic is as I waited the car driver behind is less likely to be annoyed that I overtook and then held them up. Seems to be some truth in it.
I'd rather be late than dead.
in fact I would have probably popped onto the pavement ..
This cyclist had help with that move
Anytime I get into a “near miss” I try to analyse it and incorporate the lessons into future riding
@tjagain yep, I do this too. You get those REALLY close misses, and you thank your lucky stars! And certainly make a mental note of where not to be in the road/position/where to watch etc.
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/cyclist-hospital-serious-injuries-after-16941084
Rule 211 mentions “filtering through traffic” in the context of both motorcycling and cycling.
But not in the context of "it is OK to do it when...." There is nothing in the rules that indicates whether it is OK or not, other than the fact that if you are filtering you are overtaking, and there are rules about that.
There are other rules which acknowledge that it may happen, eg Rules 72 and 73, but again they do not say anything about when, or if, it is OK to filter.
Bit tricky that one. Although overtaking on the RHS its effectively a one way street so you're undertaking. From that camera angle you can't see if the driver is indicating.
I will overtake in slow moving traffic. Generally don't undertake if there's a junction or turning where someone could left hook me. Similarly if cars are parked a the side of the road I won't undertake. In fact I tend take the whole of the lane as I've had loads of people open car doors whilst cycling past.
Prefer to overtake but again if there's a turning on the RHS will take it easy as lots of people think indicators are optional.
That was hard to watch. Although in fairness the car driver maybe wasn't expecting the bike to be there, should have stopped earlier though
I cycle from north London to central London, if I didn't filter I wouldn't make much progress
its effectively a one way street so you’re undertaking
Really? That's not clear from the video. That does make me want to excuse the cyclist from any blame at all then. What is the next junction like and how far away is it?
So if a right turning vehicle and a overtaking vehicle collide, who is at fault, according to the Highway code?
Was the intention was a panic emergency stop, but they have hit the gas rather than the brake? It happens a lot.
So if a right turning vehicle and a overtaking vehicle collide, who is at fault, according to the Highway code?
Almost certainly one of them, quite possibly both. The HC is not about fault, it is a set of rules for how to behave. If you ride or drive in a way that is not compliant with the rules then you are driving badly and may thereby be guilty of a criminal offence. If your bad driving is a significant part of the cause of a collision, then it might be "your fault" and this may give rise to further criminal liabilty and civil liability.
But, notwithstanding that you were riding like an idiot, it might not be your fault if, even if you had been riding carefully, the collision would still have occurred, for example elephant falling from top floor window etc. The further criminal offences and civil liability depend on causation, your bad driving must be the cause of the collision.
+1 about the Highway Code. What people arguing on the internet often seem to fail to realize is that it is there to prevent accidents. Some of the things in it refer to a legal obligation, but some of it is just about how to behave safely on the road. As an instance: It effectively tells pedestrians to 'obey the Green Cross Code'. It also warns car drivers about people stepping into the road without looking and the fact that you should give way to a pedestrian in the road. However this is now taken to mean by some that it is the fault of the pedestrain for paying no attention to their own safety or alternatively that you are absolved from looking before crossing because the driver is responsible for avoiding you. That is missing the point. If you both obey the Highway Code then nobody gets hurt. Unfortunately some of it appeals to common sense and these days that isn't ever going to work.
I used to filter all of the time on every road. Funnily enough, since going clipless I don’t filter half as much as I used to. Am just not confident enough in tight spaces when I’m attached to the bike. If there’s a good amount of space, or a dedicated lane I will.
Very rarely filter past busses/vans/trucks on the left if there’s a turn off to the left, for reasons shown in that video. Most busses here have big signs on the back telling cyclists not to do that. Unless there’s a cycle lane and there’s no bus stop/left turn, I’ll always overtake on the right if able. Have read too many stories of cyclists getting left hooked. On some roads and at some roundabouts there are some cycle lanes that I won’t even go in. Through experience I’ve learnt which roads to take a strong primary in rather than use the dedicated lane.
When my son’s been waving a wooden sword about and hit his sister, he’ll claim “I didn’t try to hurt her!” as if that exonerates him. My stock response is, “that’s not the point; the point is you didn’t try not to hurt her”. The same applies on the road 99% of the time: barely anyone’s out to actively hurt anyone, but that doesn’t mean they’re not guilty of disregarding a (legal or moral) duty of care of others.
I'll try to remember that one, when 'discussing' things with people of questionable awareness, in future - ta.
The HC is not about fault, it is a set of rules for how to behave. I
True. I was trying to be brief but poorly chosen words
Who is following the rules less, in that situation?
If you both obey the Highway Code then nobody gets hurt.
What is the highway code on the subject of turning and passing, in that type of situation?
I thought the police laid charges based on violations of the highway code?
scary stuff – does anyone know if the chap is ok?
Very rarely filter past busses/vans/trucks on the left if there’s a turn off to the left, for reasons shown in that video
What, a car turning right? If the cyclist had been on the left he wouldn't have got hit!
I do what the lad in the video does . However , I have a sneaky feeling he was wearing headphones . To be that close to a car and not hear the revs pick up fast as the driver accelerates into'I am guessing' his driveway means eitheer deaf or hearing impared
I think its safer to overtake on the R H S . Better sight lines , more chance of being spotted in the drivers side mirror , and you can see what the drivers hands are doing.
This also allows you to see who is texting away whilst crawling along.
If the traffic speed increases I will just filter across to nearside again. It also has the advantage that the cars have to know there is a bike up ahead , as you have just overtaken them.
I thought the police laid charges based on violations of the highway code?
No, they charge people based on the law, which the Highway Code isn’t.
I dont commute on my bike and feel my answer would be different if I did. Generally if traffic is stationary and a BIG queue then ill filter past, I generally prefer to filter on the left than the right for the exact demonstration of the incident. I think generally a driver is more likely to suddenly swing right than left because they'll hit the kerb and I have the chance of suddenly hopping on to the kerb if needed rather than into the opposing traffic. If the traffic is moving then no I'm generally a patient person because I think there is a matter of seconds to save.
However, my fella will overtake/filter at the drop of a hat and it drives me bloody crazy. If he can ride faster than the cars then he goes past and I've seen him take no heed of junctions etc while doing so and had to warn him tonnes now. I half wish something would scary the poo out of him just so he would stop doing it before something fatal happens. He saves a matter of seconds and ends up with drivers being very annoyed and is lucky he doesn't get mashed!
I have a sneaky feeling he was wearing headphones
I always wear headphones. It ain't never happened to me. Cuz I gots eyez.
That to me looked like a completely inadvertent move - it wasn't a proper "turn into a driveway". There was no proper positioning on the part of the driver. Looked like one of those "hit the gas not the brake" moments which would explain why he/she just kept going.
And yes, I do filter past slow traffic. The worst thing about it is the sheer number of drivers looking at their phones, you can see it very clearly as you ride past on the right. "Subtly" holding it in their lap. If you watch the wheels though you can generally spot moves well in advance.
This happened to me yesterday morning and despite what I said earlier in this thread, I didn't see the indicator.
People just don't look. Even when there's a mass of red paint between them and their junction. They don't remember what they passed less than 30 seconds earlier... the incident in the original video could happen to any of us...