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I know a lot of people use and like the schwalbe tyres.
I have no experiance of either.
Will you be setting them up tubeless or tubed?
EDIT. I do agree with GL though, seems a bit odd.
Did S****horpe today in the Trophy Day Series. Wobbled around, hopefully not getting in people's way, and didn't fall off. Came almost last; would have placed a little bit higher if I hadn't had to stop with cramps in my calves on the last lap. Loved it.
same here, frustrating day, power was there (to start with) i just didn't seem to get any rhythm or flow, cadence was well down, usually race mtb on that course in the summer, bit like bambi on ice in the corners today which meant i didn't carry any speed, need to have a bit of faith in the tyres/grip
It was different for me. I was slow because basically, I'm clueless and don't know what I'm doing. 😀
I'm also not as fit as I thought, and accidentally had several pints last night!
Wessex CX at foxhill today - that hurt. Was way to conservative at the start and ended up 30s behind the guys I was targeting to be racing and spent the rest of the race trying to pull them back. Did beat someone on the line that I'd been racing for a few laps as a minor victory!
Who's racing this weekend? Can't decide on whether to give the west midlands series a go this weekend(Heart of England Conference Centre) or have a weekend off? What's the back of the pack racing like with this series?
have a weekend off?
Not a chance! Sunny Beacon Hill near Ormskirk this weekend. (Although away next week so I miss the Manchester Race 🙁 )
Pembrey Sunday for us Welsh League riders. Am being optimistic and going with an intermediate/dry tyre mix as the area drains well and is usually firm. Muds will of course be taken for when my optimism fails.
What’s the back of the pack racing like with this series?
In my opinion there is a really good spread, some very fast (but polite) riders lap me at least once or twice a race, but I am still racing quite a few people with similarish fitness and ability. The course at fillongley is fast but with a mix of surfaces including a nice big sandpit.
@shedbrewed - it was still bone dry yesterday according to some GR folk who rode there. I'm sticking with full file treads. With only one wheelset I'm going for the all or nothing approach! Though pit bike has muds on so worst comes to the worse I can switch.
How are field sizes in other leagues this year? I've noticed the senior cat in the Welsh league seems down a fair bit; with around 20 entrants for the last few races rather than 30 - 40 for the last couple of years. Particularly suprised about Pembrey which is normally very popular.
WTF is a "file tread"?!
In the NW league we get a choice between full muds or flippers 😂
Ha ha, This year its been full muds or full files for us. We ahve a real range of terrains in our league which is nice. Only problem with the sand is the drivetrain abrasion!
Yup it's the delightful (in summer) Beacon Park this weekend, almost guaranteed to remove a rear mech or two if this weather continues - just hope it's not mine this time.
I'll be there along with the rest of the tribe with Son No.1 looking to continue his strong start in the U8 with 3 from 3 so far and Son No.2 hopefully not having to take his bike for too much of a walk and maybe nab another top 10 in the same cat 🙂
Another normal day in the North West
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Good racing battling the normal faces. Legs fell off on the last half lap. Assume TD was somewhere at the front.
And just realised I was marshalling all day last Sunday with BenjiM 🙂
Good racing today Mick - can't beat a bit of running the bike over flat ground because it's too much of a quagmire to ride. First lap shocked the legs as it's a few weeks for me since the last race, but settled ok.
Have to say I was proud of my 8yo kid who manned the pits solo - gave me two bike changes. Was sort of expecting her to give me the bike back as I'd left it, but got a clean bike for the last lap.
Thought Leverhulme was harder on the bike, paradoxically - like today was a lot heavier conditions but that wetness clears the drivetrain somewhat. Whereas Leverhulme you wouldn't have said was particularly hard conditions at all, but it was in that zone of a load of grassy mud that clogs like a bstard, but not enough rain to clear it off.
Yeah I noticed the bike change hardly lost you any time - efficient kid you've got there (mine was sat in the van). Think the big puddles after mud soup corner really helped wash the lumps off each lap. Also didn't see the normal amount of Beacon snapped hangers.
West Midlands CX was bloody muddy. What didn't help is my brakes gave up while riding to the grid. Not just low brake power, completely have up spin the wheel freely gave up. Had a couple of tree interactions and one very loud "brakes failed, get out of the way" as I flew through the tape into the crowd watching as I forgot I was without brakes.
Did have fun but was horrendously slow though some sections although I did find out the high speed left at the bottom of the hill was possible without brakes. Effing scary and had to use all the road but doable. The tight right shortly after needed a lot of feet rubbing the ground to do though!
And just realised I was marshalling all day last Sunday with BenjiM
Yep! I had an idea it was you but didn't like to say "Are you mick who posts on STW, in case it wasn't and got a blank look!
Good fun yesterday my littlun was to busy chatting on the start line to make a decent go of it in the Under 8's hopefully she might learn not to answer back to the commisairre She does struggle with the CX version of the frog so I might just put some flat bars. Anyway she was happy with getting a medal and a Mars Bar. Steve your lads do really well, so my question is how often are they riding. We struggle to get riding time in with work, other clubs etc., although Gymnastics on a Saturday morning might be getting knocked on the head!
Tough conditions and I had a great battle with Adrian Dalgleish although I overtook him on the last climb only to blow away my lead by making the mistake of running with the bike after the Belgian corner, which he took advantage of.
Intermediate front and file tread rear worked well at Pembrey yesterday. What clearly didn’t work were the ears of the back-marker; who after I called ‘passing on your right’, turned his head right to look at me and rode right as he did so. This resulted in me t-boning him and a rather unpleasant tangle of bikes and over the bars.
I lost 4-5 places too as we got untangled and I straightened my bike out which added insult to the injury.
Yours grumpily.
Unlucky @shedbrewed, you did seem a little peeved afterwards!
Agree about the tyres, I spent a lot of time Sat night / sunday morning watching the weahter radar, second guessing conditions and repeatedly swithcing tyres, thankfully the file rear, interediate fornt seemed ideal. Could have got away with file f&r I think, but always good to have the extra security.
i enjoyed the course, zipping along the flat singletrack in a train first lap was pretty fun. There was a lot of argy-bargy caused by the singeltrack; some of which was funny as to see, bike grabbing arguments when people tried to force through.
Had a pretty good race, felt good on the bike, steady-ish lap times and HR, and for what was a power course had a good result. Frustratingly I bungled the sandy little ramp after the tunnel at the end of the first lap, had to dismount, loosing the wheel in front and then couldnt get back on before the hell headwind sections so was dangling 50 yeards off the back of the group in the full brunt of the wind and stayed like that, esperately trying to close it but with the distnace slowly increasing for a few laps.
Intermediate front and file tread rear worked well at Pembrey yesterday. What clearly didn’t work were the ears of the back-marker; who after I called ‘passing on your right’, turned his head right to look at me and rode right as he did so. This resulted in me t-boning him and a rather unpleasant tangle of bikes and over the bars.
I had something similar happen to me a few weeks back, although the fast guy called on your left, so I moved to the right as he hit me at a fair old whack, both of us hit the deck pretty hard. He the had a good old rant about how he called on my left, I agreed he then looked very sheepish and apologized as he realised he'd gone to pass on the right. I now have a quick double check and try to hold my line rather than dart to the side when being overtaken
@ferrals it was a brutal headwind. I felt ropey after it in the second lap. Checked my hr after and I was sitting at 199bpm. That’d be why.
Yeah I was peeved. It didn’t help that the backmarker had decided to have a drink at the time.
Anyway, that’s racing.
I think I might be on the same intermediate/file combo for the next couple of races.
Yeah things like that are annoying. I was lucky to not be held up unduly, the only time i got caught behind someone slow I was delighted for a breather 🙂
I get confused between left and right at the best of times so at full effort its a complete lottery if I go the right way!
I think I might be on the same intermediate/file combo for the next couple of races.
Are you racing somewhere differnet to me??
Think the big puddles after mud soup corner really helped wash the lumps off each lap.
I think we were the lucky ones, earlier races were really claggy, then it rained a bit for us 😎
Was pleased with my effort and finally moving up the places to 35th.
Son No.1 had a mare, crashed twice, sliding back down the hill by the pits once, lost heart, but still managed 4th. No.2 appears to be quite good at running with his bike and came away 10th placed boy
@ferrals I know Carmarthen can be boggy but there’s also sections where it’s tarmac. Quite flat too from memory.
Round after is at Tredegar park again and I know it’s not going to be as dry as round 1 but still could be firm enough.
Good fun yesterday my littlun was to busy chatting on the start line to make a decent go of it in the Under 8’s hopefully she might learn not to answer back to the commisairre She does struggle with the CX version of the frog so I might just put some flat bars. Anyway she was happy with getting a medal and a Mars Bar. Steve your lads do really well, so my question is how often are they riding. We struggle to get riding time in with work, other clubs etc., although Gymnastics on a Saturday morning might be getting knocked on the head!
I'm in the same boat with our daughter - she's moved up to U10 and found the two races she's done very hard, as we don't really get out enough. Going from the podium U8s to being at the back is a bit demotivating, although she was in good spirits yesterday in what were tough conditions (medal and mars bar definitely helped).
@shedbrewed - you're a braver man than I! I rmember Carmarthen mostly for being a mech-ripping mud fest! I'll be using mud tyres for sure.
I'm wondering if it's even going to be on, given the amount of rain/flooding they've had there and considering last year was cancelled as the showground was underwater. I have heard a few people saying the same.. though nothing more than idle speculation. If it is cancelled it will be a choice between Western and SW league for me, as I do want to race next weekend.
Steve your lads do really well, so my question is how often are they riding.
@BenjiM
Thanks, it's all the big one wants to do he wants to go pro! and the middle one just enjoys it. As for riding, I'll be totally honest, not very much at all. Over winter they tend to just race CX and maybe the odd weekend ride when the weather is ok, but the big one can easily rattle off 25k round Delamere or a couple of laps of the blue at Llandegla. Over the summer they ride a lot, but just messing about on bikes kind of riding. They both race kiddies crit's in the summer and that's about as serious as it gets.
I reckon they're pretty lucky with their school as they have PE about 3 times a week, swimming once a week and over winter inter-schools (the local villages) XC races every couple of weeks, so it keeps them pretty active.
I'm really not one for training sessions for little kids, we just mix any skills stuff in to riding round the woods - translates as see what the biggest / steepest thing I can convince them to chuck themselves off.
Welsh league at Carmarthen on Saturday has been cancelled.
I've entered the SW league race seeing as a change is as good as a rest.
Anyone else race the SW league and know what the Taunton course is like?
Well, the Nw round at Beacon Park was the classic mud fest it always seems to be (weirdly rideable & grippy, despite the slop). Barely needed to touch the brakes, but still got through a set of pads!
Looks like the Heaton Park round next weekend will be the "usual" course - no complaints from me as it's a cracker of a route as long as the swoopy stuff in the trees stays rideable 🙂
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Why are CX races so expensive to enter?
Looking at doing a couple of WMCCL events but because I haven't pre-registered for the league and entry is closed anyway I'd have to pay £3 on top of the £15 to enter.
All for a 50min race. Sounds excessive.
It doesn't sound excessive to me, at all, but obv we all have our own personal perspective on the value of £18.
Think what is involved, though - my local league is the NW can have 50-100 racers per age group, so 100s of competitors in total, six different races from U8 up. I think in some events we've had 100+ just with the kids (U8 - youth). Needs a proper risk-assessed CX course with two commissaires in charge, timing system which is run by volunteers, 10-15 marshalls to put the course our and take it away (league members who will all marshall one race).
Needs to be a venue with a boat load of parking space, and won't aggravate local residents - establishing a new venue for cross can be really difficult for these reasons. A lot of work behind the scenes from club guys to make sure venues are sustainable with councils, landowners etc. Plus you prob need to partner with BC for liability insurance, first aid which add further costs.
But the whole point of all of this is that it delivers - you're getting great racing, really competitive and challenging right through the field.
I would say it's ok price wise but it definitely does make me think, especially as you can often spend the same again on fuel to get to each event! I do sometimes find it odd how they then charge extra for parking when you're parking in the same muddy field that the race is being held in!
So have located the issue with my brakes... combination of slightly low pads (about 1/2 worn) and my cable outers have both compressed (or more the spiral has unwound)! I must have held the brakes on especially hard at some point lining up for the race to do this (pre-race nerves) as they worked fine going up and down the road warming up just before. Genuinely never seen this before with proper brake outer so a bit mystified, although it is the stock outer that Genesis fitted in 2014 so had few years use! Got some full hydros in the post (hopefully) so will negate this issue in the future, but it does mean I wont feel bad about selling the calipers and levers with an unknown fault!
Why are CX races so expensive to enter?
Are they? Guess it depends what you're comparing them to...
Anyway, insurance mostly, plus the cost of using the park/private estate - that's been the death of a few 'classic' venues.
Certainly no-one "in the scene" is making a fortune out of it, so I suppose the answer is (without being facetious, I hasten to add) "Because that's how much it costs to run" 🙂
I agree that from the outside it seems expensive. Having been involved with the organisation of our own event for the last couple of years, it's interesting to see where the money goes.
From your £15 online via BC, £1 goes straight to BC for the payment handling, £3 to BC as a levy, and 80p to our league as a levy. So we're down to £10.20 per rider before we even start. We have around 300 riders paying full price, so call it £3,000 in round numbers after levies.
From that we've got to pay venue fees (varies a lot, but typically £500 - £1,500), first aid (~ £500), toilets (~ £300), chip timing (~ £1000), cash prizes (~ £800).
Other odds and sods quickly add up (stakes, tape, signs, free refreshments to thaw out our marshals).
Our venue takes a lot of preparation. This year, we've been very fortunate in getting quite a lot free hire kit, and a number of us taking days off work to do prep work. Last year we paid hundreds for tools and labour.
You'll notice that this doesn't add up which is why we now charge £18 pre-entered!
Even at these prices, there's a huge amount of "goodwill" (i.e. free labour and discounts) needed to make our event viable.
Personally I'd be happy to see the cash prizes go: I don't think anyone does this for the money. Admittedly I don't see any cash prizes in CX, but I've had a few TT (team!) prizes and I'm always, meh, that's my entry fee back.
Chip timing adds a fair bit to the cost, but it's well worth it in my opinion.
The kids races are also much cheaper (so you are subsidising them which isn't a bad thing), and if you get to be good then prize money can make them near cost neutral - I employ a fast wife and kids to help in that respect 🙂
Our last race had £2500 prize pot spread a long way across the categories. Twinkly Dave might even have made a profit!
I do begrudge the £1 to BC for registration, though, as it's not a great system and it's per rider, regardless of age, even if you do them all in one batch.
Our last race had £2500 prize pot spread a long way across the categories. Twinkly Dave might even have made a profit!
All profits are ploughed back into the nearest coffee cart and recirculated as Tunnocks products for people who've been nice to me in the pits 😉
Our club event only manages to break even because club members donate home-made cakes to be sold at the cake stand on the day. Imagine how much it would cost if the races weren't run entirely by volunteers (with the exception of the chip timers I guess).
I am happy to pay the cost of chip timing, not only are results avaiable quicker and with more detail available for the stats nerds; it saves someone whos spent all day in a muddy field with a clipboard, then spending the following day deciphering said muddy clipboard to work out hundreds of placings, while peopel on social media clamour for resutls.
Personally I’d be happy to see the cash prizes go
Agreed. Total waste of money (not that I've ever won money in a cX race). But its BC specified amounts. When there was a novice race in our league even the novices got cash prizes.
All for a 50min race. Sounds excessive
My mate said something similar, thought it was a lot of faff 'just for 10km of riding'.
It's either worth it to you or not, nobody's getting rich off it. Cost of race entries is worth it just for giving me so much reason to look forward to winter!
I listened to an american podcast where they were saying their races (which are much larger than a uk leaugue race) have to be sold as 'events' rather than races to be profitabile.
TO a certain extent though, even with a league race you are paying for an event, you may only be racin for 50 minutes, but you get there early, pre-ride the course, chat to friends, watch some of the other categories etc. It is a full day out even if the race you've paid for is just part of it.
Twinkly Dave might even have made a profit!
Not at the rate he goes through wheel & bottom bracket bearings he won't 😉
It might just be me, but if I'm honest I don't even factor in fuel costs, and race entry fees are more than reasonable IMHO. £12 for me in Vets and a quid a piece for the monsters, I suppose you can add in a tenner for league registration and a fiver each for the kids, its £174 for the whole league season for the 3 of us. It's just a family day out with a lot of mud, cleaning, and hard work (if you're racing).
Probably untold damage to the washing machine though, our 3 lots of kit, including warm up and race gear each took 3 washes to be the right colour again after Beacon Park!!
Speaking of costs, I'm seriously considering a pit bike. As few will attest on here, the NWCCA rounds can be very grassy & muddy and after Leverhulme I started thinking about it.
Now I'm no podium botherer, let alone top 10 or even 20 (as it currently stands) so is it self flattering over indulgence or a good idea? I'm not talking a matching one to my main bike, just something cheap and 2nd hand with matching contact points, gear ratios and shifters so they at least feel the same to sit on.