If reports are true he's failed a second test at the TdF. 8 times the amount of plasticizers that are legally allowed. Looks like its game over, [i]if its true [/i]
There's a limit for the amount of plasticizers allowed? That I did not know (sounds like it's not an official limit yet though).
http://road.cc/content/news/25133-second-failed-test-alberto-contador-could-spell-bad-tdf-champ
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/05/sports/cycling/05cycling.html?_r=1&src=me
looks forward to the explanation that he likes chewing on plastic bags to help him relax or somesuch 😆
Sorry for being a bit thick but how can having an IV of your own blood increase performance?
oops Contador is in the poop now I guess.
Sorry for being a bit thick but how can having an IV of your own blood increase performance?
Because you need blood to carry oxygen to muscles. More blood = more ability to carry oxygen = more strength/endurance? Might be wrong here
My money is on the line ' the cow ate a polythene bag before it was butchered'
I_Ache red blood cells, so you carry more oxygen to the muscles. I don't know the ins and outs of it, there are people on here that do know, but thats the jist of it iirc
<does the Contador pistol thing with his hand>
regardless of the truth or not of it I'm waiting to see whether he gets the mandatory 2 year suspension (with a reduction of 12 months if he can prove it was his food contamination theory). Them's the rules tho' I suspect he'll be riding in next years TDF...
Do try and keep up old chap!
Surely your body can only cope with a certain volume of blood and isnt designed for more than it would normally hold. Can you get blood fatigue and some of his used blood is removed before the transfusion so he isnt over filled?
Trying to understand the science/logic behind it.
Crazylegs - That thread's about the first failed test, not the 'second'
Do try and keep up old chap 😉
i_ache: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_doping
Blood volume is one thing. The amount of red blood cells in that volume is a different thing. Add more red blood cells to it and it thickens but the volume can remain the same.
Seeing as Contador's doctors are no doubt among the finest, lesser lights with lesser doctors are probably all sweating plasticiser now.
as for Andy Schleck, keeping up with a possibly drugged Contador.....
Oh I see they concentrate the blood down to the RBC's I understand now.
Thought it was odd putting a whole unit back into them.
Indeed though the good news I think is twofold - first that those cheating are having to use much less effective doping methods than in the past (eg microdosing) - http://www.sportsscientists.com/2010_07_01_archive.html
second, I think that whereas in the past, the cheats had to be stupid/sloppy to get caught, now they have to be consistently lucky not to get caught. Big change.
Nice quick and simple FAQ on blood doping is at [url= http://www.wada-ama.org/en/Science-Medicine/Science-topics/Blood-Doping-QA/ ]WADA Blood Doping Q&A[/url]
hmm, i like the fact that Bertie has said that his reputation has been damaged by this - i thought it was already damaged by the fact he's been on a team that had to withdraw from the tdf because so many of his teammates were caught doping and that he was named in operacion puerto!
I find this, from the NY Times article, very depressing:
[i]Bernhard Kohl, the Austrian rider who was stripped of his third-place finish at the 2008 Tour for doping, said Monday that he was not surprised a top cyclist had tested positive for more than one banned thing.
It’s impossible to win the Tour de France without doping,” said Kohl, who was in Leesburg, Va., to speak at the United States Anti-Doping Agency’s science conference. “You can tell by looking at the speed of the race. Every year it has been about 40 kilometers per hour. It’s the same the year I raced, the year Floyd Landis won, this year. It shows riders are still doping.”
Kohl, who said he retired from the sport to avoid having to think about doping every day, has no specific knowledge of Contador’s case but said most of the top riders rely on transfusions of their own blood and of designer, undetectable drugs like different types of the blood-booster EPO.
“I was tested 200 times during my career, and 100 times I had drugs in my body,” he said. “I was caught, but 99 other times, I wasn’t. Riders think they can get away with doping because most of the time they do. Even if there is a new test for blood doping, I’m not even sure it will scare riders into stopping. The problem is just that bad.” [/i]
I think though that you do need to consider that saying that makes it easier for Kohl to justify his own doping to some extent.
i now watch the tour for the scenery. it feels fake 🙁
Plasticizer? Surely drinking feb mix can't be good for you 😉
Sorry, crap builders joke, I'll get my coat.
do you reckon he could get away with a drop of fairy rusty?
Rusty, it keeps him flexible and allows him to work longer 😉
But doesn't training at altitude give you similar results as some forms of doping?
I think it's all a bit silly. Cycle racing is little more than mobile advertising for most folk. Hardly anyone I know is bothered by who wins a cycle race. The TDF is the only cycle race I watch, and I love cycling. It's pretty boring as a spectator sport, and only worth watching on telly really. I spose it gives some of yer small French towns and villages a boost, but let's face it, if it weren't for the advertising opportunities, there's no way it would get the coverage it does. The Tour of Britain is a perfect example of this; hardly anyone in the UK is interested in cycling as a sport, hence it won't get the coverage the TDF gets. And why it won't attract the very best riders.
So, with so much money involved, the stakes are much higher. Of course people will do all they can to get an advantage. Every single one of them. I don't believe there's a single 'clean' rider in top class pro cycling. They're all at it to some degree. You'd be daft not to (and never win owt).
Thing is, it seems that certain forms of 'doping' don't give you any more of performance boost than altitude training, or an energy drink or other legal forms of performance enhancement. Obviously it's good to ban the sort of things that can cause serious damage, but what's wrong with a little bit of relatively harmless performance enhancement? I mean, the difference between two different meals could be comparable.
See, if I was a pro Tour rider, I'd look around me, see all the others doing it, and just think 'bollocks to it, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'.
As for fair play and the spirit of sportsmanship; the TDF has had riders doping up since it began. It's almost expected that at least a few riders will get caught each year. The rest will just be thankful that it weren't them what got caught. I bet Lance has a chuckle to himself as he counts his TDF wins...
And ethics? Half if not most of the sponsors are companies involved in all sorts of nastiness; exploitation of workers, unfair business practices, environmentally unfriendly manufacturing processes etc.
Come on.
As long as there is big money in sport, there will be people seeking an unfair advantage. And even without big money, people will seek an unfair advantage. Sportsmanship? Name any other area of life where we 'play fair'! If you wanna get on, it involves getting an edge on the competition.
Pfft.
I think if he has plasticisers in his samples then blood doping is the most likely explanation. I would have given him the benefit of the doubt re the initial test due to it being such low levels.
Perhaps the ex rider is correct and the sport needs to sort itself out?
The advantages/effects of training at altitude doesn't last that long.
You get enough benefit from altitude training for it to be worth the effort..
Although technically you should be sleeping at altitude & training at sea-level.
But yeah they are all it arent they.. Still I like watching the Tour, it looks great on TV with all those helo shots & bikes are just great anyway
But whats the option? Do you legalise doping? Whats the current state of play within athletics? How are they keeping their sport clean(er)? Can pro-cycling learn anything from them?
Athletics is no different there were plenty of top distance runners on the operacion puerto list including two very well know ethiopian's.. allegedly.
It was the beef, it was the Jack Daniels and beers, it was the pressure from team management, the drugs were for my dog, my mother-in-law, it's a witch-hunt, it's a mistake. It's all very tiring.
I love road cycling. I really do. I'm hating the player, not the game. Cheaters are weak minded idiots who ruin it.
My feeling is athletics is cleaner but not clean. More rigorous testing over a longer period of time and harsher penalties .
Look at the difference with the way the balco scandal and operation puerto were dealt with
However its only my suspicion and I wouldn't bet my house on it. Enough bad scandals in athletics
My answer to clean up cycling - much more rigorous testing and much higher penalties if caught
Ah I did not know that athletes were on that list as well. Must go look it up..
I am certainly suspicious of football as well.. All that money..Hmm..
My feeling is athletics is cleaner but not clean. More rigorous testing over a longer period of time and harsher penalties
I very much doubt it - same benefits from cheating, plenty of money and less sophisticated testing...
And even more so in the case of football.
Repack - I meant people caught in the balco scandal were more harshly treated than puerto - and balco was mainly athletes but puerto was cyclists and a few othere
I could be remembering that wrong tho
The balco people treated harshly were though who were proven to have lied under oath, not those proven to have cheated (who just got the usual bans).
Puerto has been a joke and clearly shows Spain's general lack of interest in stoping cheats.
RepacK - Member
I am certainly suspicious of football as well.. All that money..Hmm..
Yep there were also allegedly footy players and well know tennis players on the list. I think about 35 ish cyclist's were named officially of 200 athletes from many sports on the actual list. There were many names touted at the time but not officially confirmed. Proper cover up!!
Just been visited by doping control myself. Claimed they found evidence of eating chicken. Told em the McNuggets must of been contaminated
reading the cycling weekly article, it seems he was given more time as well (compared to the Chinese rider who was caught with the same substance) to come up with an excuse.
I think he could of done better than blame it on the meat he ate.
Is it not taking an obscenely long time to conclude this case? Where then does this leave the UCI as a body and the TDF as a contest.
Oh no!
I think the UCI were hoping everyone would just forget about it and no more would be said.
Unfortunately you've just ruined their clever plan by bringing it all up again.......... 🙂