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Not used a set of cantis since about 1994, but recently built up a cross bike with them on. Spend hours trying to set them up (rims cleaned also), but just couldn't get even a hint of power. Eventually took them to the lbs, the chap thought I'd done an ok job but said he'd tune them a bit and perhaps to try new pads.
Get it back, still utterly useless although in fairness the chap at the shop told me he'd barely got any additional power out of them but they may bed in. How on earth do folks race on them, they barely slow the bike down at all, and I'm comparing to my road calipers, not my formula disks? When things got wet it was downright dangerous.
Brakes, are on one froglegs. Are the brakes at fault, or is that just the way cantilevers are? Was told to swap to Mini Vs, are they significantly better? From looking at the pics of crossers on here it appears the choice is either disks or cantis?
ta
Mini vs are massively better, changed recently on mine and even with stock pads they are a revelation.
Double post.
Only ever ridden with cantis once, to the LBS. Mini Vs are fine.
I find that a copious coating of grinding paste like mud improves braking, but will massively reduce rim life.
dont set the pads too close to the rims as you'll have no leverage power. I can lock my wheels but the lever is almost touching the bar.
you'll get better modulation too like this.
mini v's far more powerful though.
if your not racing get some trp cx mini v's...they are almost as good as disc's!
Cables and levers. Get rid of the flex in your levers and compression in your cables and you'll get cantis to work much better.
Or you could simply fit Mini-Vs 🙂
Wander on over to the CTC forum. It gets technical there but it is useful.
Of course you should bear in mind that in CX racing braking is actually not a high priority. Not much stopping is done.
Mini vs are certainly far better brakes. As for mud clogging, mine didn't seem much worse but I'm not a proper cx rider, I maybe just never found the right mud (the frame is still more restrictive than the forks- mud built up around the pads much the same)
PS, Tektro mini-vs for sale, cheap 😉 Just sold the bike they were attached to. Good match for 10-speed Shimano and older, is my understanding, but not good with 5700 and more recent as the ratios changed.
Out of all the biking developments over the years, the one thing I wouldn't give up is disc brakes. I must admit I don't miss the rim wear either!
Absolutely nothing wrong with cantilevers for what they're meant for and if well set up. Those P-X Frogglegs copies are alright, I ran them for a season with no issues.
The cantilever brakes on my cross bike are powerful enough for me to get the back wheel off the ground if I want to. I think thou protest too much.
It's cross you only need a light scrub of speed then chuck it in, and ride the slide.
hmmmm, might give the mini vs a try, on the front at least.
Planex x are doing them for 20 quid front and back, so Northwind if you can do better than that for your set then let me know!
Drop me an email, maybe we can sort something without me further spamming your thread 😉
I recently bought a 96 Klein Pulse mtb to add to my retrobike collection. 🙄
The Shimano cantis are horrible! 😡
But I'm not skilled at adjusting them, nor am I patient, so I bought new pads and took the bike to the LBS for a tweek. Owner is an excellent mechanic, but said that there was little that he was able to improve until he changed the rear outer to derailleur housing, which did improve them somewhat.
Still, squeezing them harder doesn't make you slow down any faster; discs have me spoiled! Why they are still made is beyond me!
Err, JoeG, you might want to check that your LBS guy really is all that excellent. Standard derailleur housing has wires running along it in a very gentle spiral. Excellent for resisting compression without changing length (so good for precise rear gears, and probably feels ok initially in your brakes) but not designed to resist really heavy loads. The only thing restraining the wires from buckling outwards under compression is the plastic outer of the housing. If that lets go, your outer will split and you'll have no braking whatsoever. Either your LBS man has used something funky, like the Yokozuna cables, or he's possibly an eejit and you want to get some brake cable outers on sharpish.
See Sheldon on cables ( http://sheldonbrown.com/cables.html)
I still have canti's on my '93 Fire mountain. Did me fine round Galloway earlier this year and I'm 15 stone. Come to think of it, they did me fine round everywhere when there was no other option 🙂
I spent a while setting up my Frogs Bollox on my cross frame, now there pretty good not as good as discs but plenty good enough for off road, the most important thing was toeing the pads in properly. This got rid of loads of brake shudder for me to.
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This is a good guide on how to set up canti's for best performance. http://www.bikequarterly.com/cantisetup.html
A friend had those On-One frogs legs copies and never managed to set them up satisfactorily, but got much better performance out of Tektro CR720. It might be just that they're easier to set up, as evidently some people have managed well with the frogs bollox.
Wouldn't want to swear by this but I suspect it's mostly about perception. I tried a few nice bikes with expensive cantis, posh pads etc, all of which the owners said "Yeah, it takes some effort to get cantis right but once you do it's great", and all of which were still pretty rubbish frankly. The people I've met who're happiest with cantis don't seem to be the ones with the best brakes, they seem to be the ones with the best expectation management.
Out of interest has any one got experience of shimano cx70 cantis in comparison to avid shorties (which are ok with good pads but could do with a bit more power when children on the back)
Tektro CR720 (wide canti) on the front and Tektro Oryx (narrow canti) on the back of my 2011 commuter bike (Specialized Tricross).
I can lock up both front and back wheels even in the wet. Not using any particular brand of pad, although I have just bought some Koolstop dual compounds to try once the current pads wear down.
I bought some mini-Vs but found that I couldn't fit them properly due to mudguard clearence so can't comment on if they're any better or not.
I actually found installing the pads a little bit closer to the rims than recommended actually increased, not decreased, braking power.
Park Tool have a really useful guide to tweaking them on their website;
[url= http://www.parktool.com/blog/repair-help/cantilever-brake-service ]Click Here[/url]
Hand strength? Mine were set up fine but I just couldn't pull hard enough.
The flatter and closer to the tyre you run the straddle wire, the more power you'll get, at the expense of a softer lever and less clearance between blocks and rim when the brakes are off. This makes a pretty big difference, especially if you get them right down near the tyre.