I've lost several of my family at a young age to this pernicious disease and have just found out that a friend has being diagnosed with terminal cancer, also young at 40. I used to wear the band as I saw it as a powerful symbol for the fight against this awful life destroyer, but feel such ambivalence now in light of the association with Armstrong. What are people's thoughts on the band now?
IMHO it was always about publicising LA the man rather than his cause which he serves in a very odd way " survival promotion" rather than research
There are better ways to support your friend and the fight against Cancer
IMHO it is as tainted as the swastika [ which actually auspiciousness in the east] and I never understood the appeal of his , and I use it in the loosest possible sense of the word, charity.
IMHO LA is as big a **** as cancer is
Give money and support to cancer research, not cancer PR. Livestrong does nothing in the fight against cancer but raise awareness, largely by paying Lance astronomical amounts to appear at his own charity events. Livestrong is nothing short of a scam. If only all that money went to research, we would all be better off. I'm not bitter much.
It's a great name for a band.
IMHO LA is as big a **** as cancer is
Oh get a grip!! You really need to get a bit of perspective.
As above, support Cancer Research.
I've never really seen what Livestrong [i]actually[/i] do. At least Cancer Research are actively seeking a cure to cancer rather than making a living off it effects.
There's an interesting story told about one of Lance's charity efforts - charged 50K a head for some charity road ride - "Ride with the seven time winner", et. Load of rich types shelled out, and at the end, all got 25K (or so) receipts for their donations, as they can claim back tax on charitable donations in the US. "What happened the rest?", the all asked? "That goes to Lance".
As for Livestrong, after their initial few years, they almost totally moved away from raising cash for cancer research, and instead funded "cancer awareness". Make your own mind up as to whether you think that's worthwhile.
Pretty certain that the cancer is the only thing that Lance didn't make up.
Support Cancer Research in the UK.
On the other hand, I would never of heard of cancer if [s]the messiah[/s] Lance hadn't told me about it.
You really need to get a bit of perspective.
Its the internet, hyperbole is to be expected. That said fair point
IMHO it is as tainted as the swastika
What an incredibly ignorant and insensitive thing to say. LA was indeed a ****, but to equate what he did to the actions of the Nazis is just incredible. Seriously; have a think about what you've written there.
I have a few friends who used to wear the Livestrong bands; none of them do any more. They do however still consider helping fight cancer as very important, so I doubt the LS brand has damaged the cause much.
I said the symbol is is as tainted as the swastika I did not compare him to the Nazis in any way shape or form.The band used to symbolise hope now it does not just as the swastike used to mean something different.
Sorry if that was unclear.
Apologising, rather than attempting to justify your insensitivity, would be the best thing to do here.
I got what you meant
its like his cameo in dodgeball, films a bit different now 🙂
As I denied doing what you claim it is most unlikely i will be apologising for it. Do your friends, who stopped wearing the tainted symbol, also need to apologise?
Its a tainted symbol as is the swastika.
That was the point would you like to disagree or would you like to labour this false point that I called him or equated him with the Nazi's?
On balance its not my most well crafted or sensitive post on here and it is OTT and hyperbolic in parts [ as i accepted above]. I can see why i am getting some grief and deservedly so. However your claim is just not true.
I used to wear a live strong band and my son had nothing but admiration for the guy - but now I detest the things
Won't touch any brand he's associated with or have live strong links
Apart from that he's a cheat
I'm sure you meant no malice, nor intended to be insensitive, and I get what you're saying about the LS brand being 'tainted'. But the swastika, a symbol that has become synonymous with fear, hatred, xenophobia and brutal violence is really, really not an appropriate symbol to compare it to.
I claimed you are insensitive and ignorant. I stick by that claim, as it's clear you are. It seems your internet ego is more important to you than the need to understand and respect others' points of view, and to perhaps take their comments on board, and develop as an individual. I therefore see no point in continuing this discussion, as I see nothing can be gained in doing so.
Good day.
Disappointingly though, it doesn't seem that anyone is disgusted enough to rid themselves of tainted merchandise.. My first instinct when it all unfolded was to hit eBay as contrary to the party line, LA's attitude encapsulates my ethos perfectly.. I was dying to proudly sport my US Postal jersey st every opportunity, but I can't get hold of one anywhere
Apologising, rather than attempting to justify your insensitivity, would be the best thing to do here.
Admitting you didn't understand what he wrote, rather than making up what you thought he meant, would be the best thing to here.
Clearly, I did understand what he wrote:
I'm sure you meant no malice, nor intended to be insensitive, and I get what you're saying about the LS brand being 'tainted'.
I merely pointed out that using a swastika was a very, very bad example to use, to explain just how the LS brand is 'tainted'. That you failed to understand that simple point, is not my fault.
If he did not want his comment to be interpreted as suggesting LA is comparable to the Nazis, then why claim that the LS brand is 'as tainted as the swastika'?
Disappointingly though, it doesn't seem that anyone is disgusted enough to rid themselves of tainted merchandise..
Maybe it's because they don't actually see it as all that 'tainted', perhaps...
Have a look at the wikipedia entry on swastika.
It is an ancient symbol with plenty going for it until the nazi party adopted it in 1920.
really not an appropriate symbol to compare it to.
I said they were both tainted [ a point you have not refutes BTW] again i did not say they were the same or even hint at or allude to this. Its pretty daft to claim otherwise tbh.
I claimed you are insensitive and ignorant.I stick by that claim, as it's clear you are.
Is this you staking your claim to be the non ignorant and sensitive one what with being wrong and calling folk names ? AWESOME I loves the internetz.
It seems your internet ego is more important to you than the need to understand and respect others' points of view,
say the person calling me names //OH the Ironing.
Your point [ I am being gernous as its juts ad homs] is only slightly weakened by me accepting other criticisms of my post earlier than your comment and accepting some in my reply:roll: Your claim is false hence why I cannot accept it.
to explain just how the LS brand is 'tainted'
That is not what i did i
IMHO it is as tainted as the swastika
Ie it no longer means what it once did
I give up hopefully one of the others will help you out here
i can only offer you a spade with which to keep digging. appeal top us all to listen to others whilst you can be the lone voice of reason.
I merely pointed out that using a swastika was a very, very bad example to use, to explain just how the LS brand is 'tainted'. That you failed to understand that simple point, is not my fault.
Why is it a "Very very bad example" ?
If I wanted to illustrate a tainted symbol, I would use a famous tainted symbol as an example.
It seems that's exactly what he did. And made his point perfectly well.
There is a big difference between the "symbol" (which is what he was talking about) and the actions going on behind the symbol.
That you failed to understand that simple point, is not my fault.
I am well aware of the origins of the swastika. I am also aware that most people in the western world associate it with the Nazi Holocaust that claimed the lives of countless innocent people.
Which is why it's really not an appropriate symbol to claim the LS brand is as 'tainted' as. To claim thus is to equate the two organisations in some way. Hence why I don't feel it was a good choice of symbol to use. I am saddened that others don't understand this, as I am with ignorance of historical event and the impact they had on countless lives, and the legacy such horror has left us with. As I've already stated, I'm sure Junkyard meant no malice with his insensitivity. I do think he and others should take my comments on board, and have the moral courage to admit their error.
I really do hope that clears things up.
One day there will be an invention where people what ride about internet forums upon lofty equine steeds will be zapped by a space ray that renders them unable to type for a month..
Kind of like the holocaust, but positive
So in essence we are all wrong and you are right and its us who need to reconsider
I still loves the interwebz
One day there will be an invention where people what ride about internet forums upon lofty equine steeds ...
Especially when they've only just ridden into town. One could almost imagine they came lookin' fur trouble
I do think he and others should take my comments on board, and have the moral courage to admit their error.
I do think you need to wind your neck in 🙄
I hope that clears things up.
Redpanda...wind yer neck in...if you knew the original meaning of the Swastika you would be able to link the similarities together - it meant something to many people, it was then adopted by others and then the meaning changed...nothing difficult to understand in that and the similarities are there - previous Livestrong meant something about fighting/raising awareness of cancer, Lance then comes out as a complete cheat and liar and now Livestrong means nothing about fighting/raising awareness of cancer - it is purely about the cheat and liar.
Anyone who then somehow managed to think that Armstrong was as bad as the Nazis quite clearly takes things far too literally.
Not difficult to understand so stop trying to get an argument going...
Can we all agree Lance was a cheating Texan dope taking up to no good cowboy?
So in essence we are all wrong and you are right and its us who need to reconsider
You conceeded "On balance its not my most well crafted or sensitive post on here and it is OTT and hyperbolic in parts [ as i accepted above]. I can see why i am getting some grief and deservedly so."
I'll be generous and accept that as a sort of apology. Fair enough. I see no point in continuing with any animosity.
Like the sheriff in Blazing Saddles? He had a point though..
if you knew the original meaning of the Swastika you would be able to link the similarities together
You'll find I've already stated that I am aware of it's origins.
As for symbols and brands; they represent a product, organisation, concept or ideology.
LS represented fighting cancer.
The Swastika in a modern western context represented the ideals of the National Socialist party of Germany; a party who's aims were to rid the world of those they considered 'subhuman' and undesirable.
I fail to see how either could be equated to the other.
it is as tainted as the swastika
Therefore, it is equal in 'taint'. This is the bit I have a problem with, you see. Because it's not. It really, really, is not.
I'll be generous and accept that as a sort of apology
Why not you seem to enjoy taking the wrong meaning from what I type and take a position no one else agrees with
Redbanda, you didn't spend long establishing your fake identity before you started trolling.
I would have give it least a couple of months personally.
Junkyard; if you wish to continue this discussion, my email is in my profile.
Nealglover; that I have my own opinions which differ to your own is 'trolling'? Get a grip. The only troll here is you, as you seem bent on stirring up an argument.
Aye fair point which one of the ignoble fallen has returned
Only if you promise to say who you really are 😉
Nealglover; that I have my own opinions which differ to your own is 'trolling'? Get a grip. The only troll here is you, as you seem bent on stirring up an argument.
Welcome back, whoever you actually are.
Redpanda strikes me as a bit of a window Nazi.
Nealglover and Crikey; I've reported you both to the moderators for trouble making, as you've added nothing to the discussion other than to try to get a rise. Either come up with something constructive, or just don't bother posting at all.
Nealglover and Crikey; I've reported you both to the moderators for trouble making, as you've added nothing to the discussion other than to try to get a rise. Either come up with something constructive, or just don't bother posting at all.
Well.
I've read your points, disagreed with them, And I've explained why.
That's what a discussion is.
If you can't get to grips with that, it's no real wonder that you failed to understand the simple point junkyard was making.
Hence why I don't feel...
Redpanda you lost me at "hence why".
As for the OP, this might not be a popular viewpoint but weren't the wristbands only ever really a fashion accessory that were trendy among try-hards for a couple of years a decade ago? I doubt most wearers gave much thought to cancer to be honest.
Either come up with something constructive, or just don't bother posting at all.
Um, it's STW, not the Oxford Debating society.
If we all have to come up with constructive comments it won't work, Adolf.
were they the first charity wristband?
first i saw for a few years anyway, then it just got stupid and most of them weren't for charity or anything just coloured bands