[Closed] Can you guess this **** trail centre

Cannock. Easy.

😆

Slippery woodwork.

Shiny pebbles gotta be Cannock; never been a fan.

Nothing wrong with Cannock.. Shiny pebbles only on bits of it and only shiny when wet. (Granted that's most of the time..)

Some of the best bits nowhere near the marked routes though 😉

Ignoring all the other stuff as i don't really care about who rides what or who does what with their stuff, Cannock is ace. Its a good challenging trail and this adds to the character of it. Its not too easy just nice, only downside is that it eats your bike.

If hora can't cope with the pebbles he has no chance with the black sections 😆

Few trails built by a handful of locals in their spare time with limited funds & resources.

Trails are fine,perhaps it's just your riding that's **** .......... ?

The pebbles are only 'fun' after it's been dry for ages then there's been a slight rain to make them damp. When it's wet/muddy/dry there's no issue at all

I love Cannock, you forget how good it is and it's always a treat whatever the weather. It does does eat your bike I agree, I always have a new noise the ride after Cannock.

only time ive had a problem on the wet pebbles was on some oe nobby nicks ,bloody dreadful tyres.just run my tyres a bit softer at cannock and wet shiney pebbles are never a problem,the loose pebbles on upper and lower cliff in the summer are a different matter.

Funny that I just done Cannock today and thought 'blimey where did all these pebbles come from?' Still a good blast though but was very busy....

I've never seen so many people poking their tyres to see how hard they were as i did today on the dog, pebbles were slick and traction just wasn't there, did make it interesting.

We went yesterday , loads of folk out enjoying the shiny pebbled trails in lovely autumn sunshine .

Been a while, I have a few days off, I feel a visit is in order

I actually don't mind Cannock. It's a quick fix kind of a place for me as I don't know the off piste stuff, so it 'does' as a half-day razz around. This is just me, though. Each to their own. I'd rate it ahead of Gisburn, which, IMO does not make the most of the available elevation to be the 'bigger' trail centre that it could be.

Still, I'm more into the so-called 'natural' type of riding. Not in a macho 'Ray Mears is my best mate' kind of way, just in an 'appreciating the countryside' kind of way. I do like a nice rocky descent though, so the Dark Peak is my fave by far.....

Keep on riding folks, wherever you choose to lay your tyres.

Last time I went to Cannock I couldn't remember a lot of pebbles? Have they just been put down? Due another visit I think!

Cannock is as tame as .... that,s why there are loads of phat bikes there to counter those dickdastardly peebles 🙂

My riding is shit (honestly) but I know a good trail. The last descent before you cross back over the road on the monkey trail is a bloody crying shame as that descent had the makings of the best. In two or three sections of those fast switchbacks it was earth/loose but then back to bloody glued in-Brighton beach-stuff .

High Voltage (the worse) was terrible for the fixed-pebbles.

A question to the lovers of Cannock- how the hell do you corner then? You cant be riding at a decent pace on those descents as you'd wash out.

I thought u weren't well enough to ride Hora, that was your excuse at the peak poodle?
There aren't many pebbles on the proper Cannock trails, plenty of 29ers though I grant you. Maybe 26" isn't capable of pebble riding, couldn't be the rider though could it? 🙂

Never had a problem at Cannock in the wet tbh (other than the bike eating grit obviously) and i ride a Zesty, with nobby nics on........... Goes round the corners just fine

It'd meant an extra 3hrs+ in the car as I was away last night/on the gin.

Be honest, without that surfacing it'd be ALOT better wouldnt it.

The black sections didnt have pebblea but I missed out the last black section but it looked good as I passed it 😀

The Chase is fine, all you have to do is avoid the FTD and monkey and ride all the small local built stuff, can be a bit muddy but there are miles of single track out there!

harsh... cannock is ace. I like the sliding about, only slides a little before I find grip.

good tyres with 25psi tubeless. cannock is ace

Alexdudley I was thinking that as it does have some good elevation-bits too

Cannock is pretty good considering the lack of elevation and that it's built on a prehistoric river bed, hence the local building material of sand on pebbles making it a difficult trail to maintain. It's slippery occasionally but it's a place that allows a lot of people to get an introduction to mountain biking.

Personally I didn't like Llandegla - I found it a soulless and dull trail which I was glad I hadn't made a special trip to visit. There they have both the elevation and the building materials to hand to make something truly great, but seem to have wasted the opportunity, but other people like it so each to their own.

For sure, we do 3 hrs on a Sunday and don't cross the same path, before FTD that is all we had to ride, could do a Chase pootle, but couldn't take the stress!!! Lol

The powers that be on the chase banned importing materials at the very start when Chase Trails was set up, think they were just being awkward , I'm sure if they knew then how popular it would become they may have allowed hardcore on the trails instead of the natural polished stones, shame as it could have been so much better.

nowt wrong with it.makes it different

Everyone rides either a LPierre Zesty or a 29'er...

So these 29er things are they all the same?
Who makes them?
I presume it's not Lapiere?

Be honest, without that surfacing it'd be ALOT better wouldnt it.

Yes, for about half an hour...
Gets a LOT of traffic does Cannock.

Singlespeedstu- dont know. I cant see past the size of the wheels as for the main the frames look diddy. The only one I saw that made me admire/double-take was a green Chromag 🙂

Passagerizlas right, you don't have ultimate F1 style grip at Cannock, and faring around with tyre pressures and different tyres won't give you the complete answer. You have to have faith that tyres will bite if they wash out a bit, and the often do. It still puts the frightened on you no matter how many times it happens. The worst thing you could do is panic and grab a handful of brake. I run 35psi front and rear and the bike is skippy but does grip eventually. Not sure where my pace is, I'm sure I'm not the fasted by a long way, but I'm definitely not the slowest. In terms of cornering, it's the lean the bike into the bend whilst leaning your body away technique bending your knees and getting low on the bike, I also do a twisting from the hips action. It's not too dissimilar from skiing for those of you who ski. But that's not 100% foolproof. it's also handy to look for features in the trail you can use like a rut you can get your tyre into to stop you from skidding out or a parallel root or a little raised tuft on the edge of the trail. It's fun I love Cannock.

Cut my riding teeth at Cannock a long way before the Follow the Dog or Monkey Trails were built. They have done very well with the terrain, elevation and materials on offer.

A question to the lovers of Cannock- how the hell do you corner then? You cant be riding at a decent pace on those descents as you'd wash out.

I think the definition of 'decent pace' is relative to the location. However, plenty of better riders than I scream around the bends! I mince but that's my lamer style...

Just look at the two full scale commercial quarries located on the Chase to see why there are pebbles everywhere. The forest is sat on one of Europe's largest sand and gravel deposits.

In the early days money was tight and there was a resistance by the powers towards using imported material and this has helped keep much of the trail network looking less obtrusive than it would have been had we used imported material such as crushed Limestone.

If imported material had been used in the Monkey then it would have cost too much for the budget available at the time.

All said though it's not a massive issue for me, although it does seem to be for others.

New trail construction and overhauls to the existing trails is now done with a 50/50 mix of local sand/gravel and imported crushed gritstone. This gives what is hoped to be a good balance between durability, grip, cost and aesthetics

hora - Member

Singlespeedstu- dont know. I cant see past the size of my magnificent ingnorance

Err Lapierre's are bloody good bikes.
29'ers? Hmmm. No.

Yep them 29ers are all the same.
They're almost as shit as blue bikes.

i think you are just bi**ching for the sake of it (how un-STW of you!). The pebbles are making it more all-weather than the mudfest it used to be. I was up there on friday (only 3rd time this year) and quite enjoy the variety of it all. Yes things could be improved - less braking bumps, a few modifications here and there but there is no such thing as the perfect train centre. The team of volunteers who look after the trails are doing a first rate job.

Cannock... And its ace great use of topography and a bit more technical than degla

Cannock Chase is my 'local' real riding spot...I tend not to ride FTD or Monkey Trail since they became so well used/abused but have the occasional slide about on the polished pebbles- its great practice for riding in icy conditions, you learn to rely on balance and the bike moving rather than the grip of your tyres and the full suspension..(if you use it). There are so many other trails that you can easily ride a full day without doing the same trails twice. Not all trails are created equal, having been to the Austrian Alps this summer Llandegla as a trail centre has nothing on the likes of X-Line at Saalbach or Wargrain Bike Park but we have to make use of what we have easily available to us.
As for 29er and Lapierres..dont see many CX bikers over there

Perhaps you should have entered the Dressage class.
It takes place every Saturday & Sunday morning, in the Birches Valley Cafe garden.
All the classes are represented. The [i]French[/i] & [i]Halifax[/i] classes are popular.

There's even a motorised class, for those with roof mounted carriers. It's very popular. Takes place in the car park.

I quite like the challenge of trying to ride fast on the pebbles - some of the sections where they are would be a bit too easy without them.

Perhaps you should have entered the Dressage class.

Seriously though, would you go to the toilet/shop/cafe and leave your bike ontop of your car? I wouldn't leave my bike out of sight ontop of my car. I bet theres been a few nicked off the top of cars at Cannock?

Whichever way you cut it large fixed pebbles in a trail isn't going to be the best experience is it? Its the best due to the situation locally/politically. Always makes me laugh when people defend a local trail centre/bike/inanimate object as though its their wife you are offending.

You really should keep away from natural riding, imagine encountering a smooth round pebble in the wild! The horror!

. Always makes me laugh when people [s]defend[/s] make excuses because they find a local trail hard to ride

Maybe they are just offering their opinion? Like we have to suffer yours?

You really should keep away from natural riding

You would have to pry the natural trail out of my cold dead hands

For me it's all about variety. The smooth pebbles weren't intended to be an overriding feature but they seem to have attained that status. Very much like the way the trails on the Chase weren't conceived to push the location into full trail centre status but they seem to have done so (for better or for worse).

Not wanting to sound partisan but I do enjoy our trails, don't ride them all that often but like the way they ride and the feel.

People quote flow a lot and if you watch Rowan Sorrell's video about Penhyyd I assume what people are craving is his new school analogy which has it's place I for one would be disappointed if this was the future of trail centres. There is enouigh separation between trail centres trails and 'natural' trails as it is.

Personally I don't really like Llandegla for example. As a result I go very infrequently but appreciate that others do like it and that a lot of effort has gone into it and it wqould therefore be inappropriate to slag the trail off, it seems that not everyone has the same attitude.

So wait - hora is crap and this is somehow the trail's fault? 🙂

I haven't ridden the chase in maybe 6 weeks now, are these pebbles a recent addition to help keep the trail from falling apart? I've never felt there was a lack of grip on upper or lower cliff before.

Not sure. On Llandegla I really like the Cafe and the staff. The only part of the trail I liked was the cork screw (just after the big warning sign on the black) where it dips then twists quickly spits you out upwards. The rest of it is too wide/meh but a better surface. I notice the pebbles were concentrated on what I presume is the high wear areas- over humps/into corners etc etc?

I didn't like Llandegla much either, though a lot of this could be down to it being so hyped up on forums and I was just a bit disappointed. Cannock isn't bad for what it is.

Be honest, without that surfacing it'd be ALOT better wouldnt it.

It would be a lot muddier...

Good to read that the official trails are keeping the tourists away from the good stuff

Those pebbles are a bitch eh 🙂

Those bloody pebbles are my nemesis 😀

Hora,

Is there any particular co-efficient of friction you are looking for?

Are you sure your frames head angle was correct for the conditions?

Chin up, you poor thing.

The only one I saw that made me admire/double-take was a green Chromag

that was me! im on a stw thread, feel famous now

I notice the pebbles were concentrated on what I presume is the high wear areas- over humps/into corners?

Every day's a school day eh

that was me! im on a stw thread, feel famous now

Sooooo.... why didn't you roll over that huge fallen tree then? You are on a 29'er- one of its benefits over 26'ers 😉

Yep that was me with that quip 😀

Every day's a school day eh

[img] [/img]

Don't be silly rocketman. They've all been individually designed and made at the PebbleCo pebble factory before being bought by Chase Trails and installed by hand in their correct location. If you pick them up they've all got a serial number stamped on the bottom.

Sooooo.... why didn't you roll over that huge fallen tree then?

I couldnt have done that now could I, I would have banged up my RaceFace NW chainring.

All this talk of off piste stuff at Cannock...I feel ashamed that I've never ventured further than a lap of the pebbles and braking bumps.

I happen to be up there this Friday...if anyone has a gpx of some of the best (pebbles optional) off piste stuff they could email me I'd be most grateful. 🙂

If you pick them up they've all got a serial number stamped on the bottom

No gps files please, best way is to tag along with a local group and respect the less than official trails 😉

One of the big factors in the conception of the trails was to offer riders a year round guaranteed rideable trail. Back in the early 00's there was an undercurrent of ill-feeling to what was largely local riders in decent number using the trails but there was an increasing number of visitors who were turning up on the Chase failing to find many of the decent trail who then left criticising the lack of riding 😮

There are other factors as there were a collective of interested parties involved in the concept of the trails, these were just my drivers.

One result of having the waymarked trails was to help reduce pressure on other more sensitive parts of the forest but then over the years rider numbers have increased significantly so the impact on the off-piste stuff hasn't really lessened in my view.

It's ironic now though given my comments above that the waymarked trails are now being criticised.

The pebbles are imported from other parts of the Chase, without the addition of surfacing the trails would be a mud bath in the winter and would be ruined long before they ever got down to the underlying material and even then would sit too low on the surface to ever drain properly.

At least the worst you have to put up with a puddling, and an element of grinding paste, FtD and the Monkey don't get particularly muddy (except when frozen trails start to thaw in winter)

I haven't ridden the chase in maybe 6 weeks now, are these pebbles a recent addition to help keep the trail from falling apart? I've never felt there was a lack of grip on upper or lower cliff before.

^this

I've read this thread and can't help thinking there must be another Cannock somewhere that Hora's talking about. I've been several times and don't ever remember thinking there was a lack of grip...

...or maybe he's just got the wrong forks for Cannock 😉

No gps files please, best way is to tag along with a local group and respect the less than official trails

Understood.

I only have early Friday morning available so don't expect any local groups to be out at the same time. Besides, the last time I tagged along with some locals after a request on STW [url= ]it didn't go according to plan[/url] 😳

There were a couple of sections on the old FTD that I really used to like, but they are now in disuse.

There was a braking bump and small-berm infested descent that popped you up to the right onto a fire-road that took you to a sharp left and a short and steep climb up to the top of the open section.

If you kept off the brakes and rode it at a speed that kept you up in the berms, you could 'pop' up onto the road, almost jumping. If you killed your momentum at any point, you'd have to pedal. There was always an audience of riders at the bottom as well, so doubly satisfying when you railed the last couple of corners and flew up onto the road.

There was also one of the last descents that switched back and forth through the trees and had a very naughty small but tall tree stump in the middle of it about halfway down.

Sadly these sections are no longer part of the main route and I don't know the area well enough to find the last one. The first one is actively closed / blocked.

Anyway, as I said, Cannock is a great place for a half-day blast and long may it continue. It is also not over-easy to ride - a clipped bar end at moderate speed can result in a fair amount of pain (something that I can vouch for a few years back).

I've read this thread and can't help thinking there must be another Cannock somewhere that Hora's talking about. I've been several times and don't ever remember thinking there was a lack of grip..

Yet within 1 minute of me posting the topic on a Sunday afternoon someone guessed where I meant. Weird that.

The first one is actively closed / blocked.

Talking of which....There was a unsignposted left turn down a slippery/slidey then loose drop down to meet the trail again.

The red trail L-shaped down two very fast straight mini fire rounds down the side of it. I liked that loose off-piste excursion 8)

Yes, that was me!

The polished kipples have always stood out to me - more the fact that they form a narrow elevated level in some corners that can make you have a a real 'moment'. On the whole, though I still like it for a blast - and as I don't go there that regularly (even though it is my closest trail centre) I don't want to stand accused of criticising it!

Yet within 1 minute of me posting the topic on a Sunday afternoon someone guessed where I meant. Weird that.

They must have the wrong forks too 😀

I'm genuinely no riding God, but I genuinely couldn't relate to the comments above to my half dozen or so experiences of riding at Cannock, 3 or 4 of which have been in recent months. Maybe I'm just a superb judge of riding conditions so never get caught out*

*this may not be a valid explanation 😆

[quoteDuring the Triassic Period most of what is now the Midlands was beneath a vast turbulent river which was powerful enough to carry alluvial deposits northwards from what is now Brittany, hence all the rounded pebbles and sandstone. The layer of pebbles is over 500ft deep and any vegetation is literally just growing inbetween the stones.
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What tyres for French pebbles 😉

For me, in general the best 'trails' are ones that flatter the rider. Say the hard/technical ones- just hard enough that you know it's bloody hard but also reward you soo much. Flatter, make you feel better than what you are. Where you find yourself 'railing' a berm. Something that you didn't think you could do- you probably look shit compared to a pro but suddenly you feel dug-in/loving it. There are a few areas in Cannock that really could have that feeling. One M9? (which made me angry/shouty) was the last long switchback descent on the monkey trail- just before you cross back over the road (and up the metal bridge).

Talking of which....There was a unsignposted left turn down a slippery/slidey then loose drop down to meet the trail again.

Gets a fair bit of traffic that cheeky shortcut.

There will be a new descent soon which will cut out those fireroad sections completely, from the top of 5-ways down to the upper cliff climb.

I'm a big Cannock fan. The Black Monkey section has some of the most technical trail I've ridden, the entrances to some of the rock gardens are horrible.

the entrances to some of the rock gardens are horrible.

The turn in's? Yes.

The very last techy bit of the day (between two trees)- I bloody jammed my bars into that one 😆

Cannock is a top place to ride...dog n monkey arw great for the budget amd effort that the locals out in. Off piste is fantastic but you need a strange local to show you the real gems. Monkey is great fun on a cx bike. Only problem with the main bits is that folks keep wanting to nick my jones or fat bike for a play...tis good for attention whore but as im shy I tend to play either early or late

If anyone wants an off piste tour at some point morw than happy to show folks some stuff.

Tazzy you werent there on Sunday with a strange beard?

I'm a big Cannock fan

Me too. It's fast, fun and flattering, but I'm a long way off finding it too easy so always find it interesting and involving; there's always room for improvement in my riding. If the berms are loose or the braking bumps bad, it's me that needs to up my game.

I genuinely can't see where your coming from Hora. Yes there are some loose stones and some parts of the trail that arn't in tip top condition but thats part of the charm. If all trail centres had perfectly smooth immaculate surfaces there really wouldn't be much to differentiate them. I like that The chase has a more natural feel than the likes of Llandegla and CyB because of the above. You get braking bumps and puddles and stones on the inside of corners when you ride natural trails, you don't get them so much on heavily armoured manicured trails. Remember variety is the spice of life.

I love the chase and try to ride there at least once a week. I think what ST and the other volunteers have done with the available topography is brilliant. I only wish I had the time to help out and do my part, I genuinely feel guilty that I use this brilliant resource and don't give anything back.