I've earned some overtime money and fancy a new compact HT frame for playtime. I was deffo going to get a Summer Season but then Brant brought out these interesting Ragley frames...
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So they're basically the same geometry, frame features and price. The Blue is a kilo heavier but with a "springy" ride.
Based on looks alone, I'm liking the chunky lime Mmmbop over the more gusseted tangerine BluePig. Other pros and cons?
Sringy ride from a heavy steel frame?
I doubt it.
you ridden them then? or can you tell that from the CAD pictures?
Does the Mmmbop really come with two steerer tubes? If so, I'd get that, and sell the spare for a bit of cash
A kilo? Seems like a big difference, is that due to the lower than average weight of the Alu frame?
[i]you ridden them then? or can you tell that from the CAD pictures? [/i]
Well have you ridden them then? or can you tell that cynic-al is wrong from the CAD pictures?
richc - me? Of course not. It weighs 5.5lb though, I can't see how it would ride "springy"
5.5lb vs 3.7lb (that is about a kilo isn't it??) seems like a significant difference to me too.
Is there a date when they will be available to buy? Are they going to be sold direct or through dealers?
through CRC I'd imagine.
I'm sure Brant was trying to convince me on another thread that the alu one has more compliant seatstays due to the longer length/no disk mounts. But on another thread he was telling me there was no such thing as compliant seatstays on any bike. And MBUK says that the hemlock has stays made from spaggetti. Apparently it's all in the designers skill when they spec the butted tubing, but then he went and gave us the summer season?
So from that I've decided never to buy another bike unless I've had a test ride on it. Anyway, how much better than the next best thing can any bike be, theres still 2 wheels?
5.5lbs? No wonder it's called a Pig.
I'm not sure I could own a frame named after a Hansen song.
Most steel frames are around that aren't they? (or are going to be) I know my PA is, and the Alpine is heavier than that.
Is Brant's next frame going to be called "Chipps' Birthday Present" or "Rodwell End B"? I thought this was a thread about which Calderdale ride to do this weekend (Blue pig, personally)
The top tube is really what you should be looking at if you want to know how springy (from a comfort point of view) a frame will likely feel... (ignore damping properties of some materials like carbon).
Triangulated stays/seat tube/rear axle don't leave a lot of room for flex no matter what the marketeers would like you to believe unless they're silly skinny in which case it'll probably be noodly under power unless they're also seriously ovalised...
Most steel frames are around that aren't they? (or are going to be) I know my PA is, and the Alpine is heavier than that.
Most of the 'hardcore(ish) hardtails' are, yes. And very few of them are stereotypical-steel springy since they've got beefed top and down tubes for long (5"+) forks
I'm not sure I could own a frame named after a Hansen song.
The fact that you know that connection is more worrying?
CEN-cert frame's mean they are going to be heavier though now?
[i]5.5lbs? No wonder it's called a Pig[/i]
oh come on.... OK it's not exactly an XC race machine but that is also not really very heavy for a strong*, chuckable steel frame
*assuming it is strong, of course
My steel HT feels springy at 4.2lb, whereas the inbred it replaced was noticably more dull feeling at 5lb.
I still don't get this super slack head angle thing.
I fear change...
zangolin - Member
Are they going to be sold direct or through dealers?
Some dealers will have them
thisisnotaspoon - Member
through CRC I'd imagine.
Correct..sort of..
Will also be available through a selected number of shops. We'll be offering custom builds and will be running 2 demo's
http://www.ride-bikes.com/products.php?plid=m2b148s27p0
hora not necesarily everything will be heavier
Slightly OT but why does the pre mkVI Chameleon always get marked down on bikemag tests? specifically mbr/mbuk. I still think its a singletrack/trailfriendly tool
does anyone remember when you just bought a bike and beat the shit out of it till it broke
does anyone remember when you just bought a bike and beat the shit out of it till it broke
🙄 8)
Hora I doubt that question would ever been directed at you
Have you broken a frame recently Richc? 😉
I have 8)
it was a generalization
when i started riding people just used to buy gear and beat the crap out of it...twas a fun sport
didn't you break it building it up? not riding it?
I thought you were asking about trails to ride there, now I see the confusion.
[i]DaveyBoyWonder - Member
I still don't get this super slack head angle thing.
[/i]
It's better for pushing uphill. A bit like those super short stems.
Well I have been paying homage to my existing HT - an 18" ALU Mongoose Tyax (aka "Tank") built up with some TORAs and big bars & stem by riding it.
About the only things not replaced through crash damage and wear is the frame. The thing is heavily scratched and dented, it's probably indestructible. It's currently upside down in my garage awaiting yet another mech and hanger replacement.
Just fancy another HT frame - something compact and modern for flinging about, with nice funky summer colour.
didn't you break it building it up?
Nope. Sure Pixies have keys to my house.
not riding it?
I think its my but-twirling large ass that caused the failure
steel-pig for me.
yes, steel frames are heavier, no, i've not really noticed any more give from steel stays over an ally frame, but short of riding it under a steam roller it should still be going in 10 years time.
i just like the idea of buying kit that lasts, and aluminium is just a bit ephemeral.
(i'd rather watch WRC than F1 - if that helps explain my position on these things)
bikes are ace, and brant is a bad man.
fwiw my know lava dome much more springy ride than my muni mula
anyone know the prices for these?
Prices are showing on CRC. £275 I think.
[b]Drac said [/b] I thought you were asking about trails to ride there, now I see the confusion.
I've done that joke further up. However I see that my jest about a new frame called rodwell is actually the truth, it's the cross frame.
the alu one has more compliant seatstays due to the longer length/no disk mounts.
If seatstays have compliance, then both these frames have more compliant (rather than less compliant) ones 🙂
ie: we made them skinny and uninterrupted, rather than short stiff and fat.
If I can find my dial test indicator and a railway sleeper, and enough time I might have a flex and see what happens.
The top tube is really what you should be looking at if you want to know how springy (from a comfort point of view) a frame will likely feel...
Aye - splay. Top tube flex, wheels spread apart. etc.
Blue Pig Top tube is 31.7mm in the middle, 32.4mm at the head tube though as it's got an externally butted nice thick wall for strength reasons.
Bolty and John from Blazing Saddles are taking it out tonight around Lee Quarry. Hopefully they'll be on board as dealers from tommorow 🙂
Maybe a better Ragley website with loads of info on might be better than all this conjecture.
Really, unless I was a regular on here - trying to find out stuff about these frames would be tricky. I mean, if you google Ragley and go on the website, it'd put me off straight away - a brand that can't be arsed to do a proper website.
Just a thought.
cynic-al
My steel HT feels springy at 4.2lb, whereas the inbred it replaced was noticably more dull feeling at 5lb
Out of interest, what frame are you now riding?
[i]Really, unless I was a regular on here - trying to find out stuff about these frames would be tricky.[/i]
Can't find any real info apart from stw threads and a bit of blurb on the hotlines site - guess there'll be more in a few weeks once they're actually for sale ???
I hope so
In contrast, Kinesis were doing pretty good publicity for their Decade range ages before they were available.
And the frames look nicer.
Gentlemen, noted, and thanks for your concern.
Rest assured various marketingy things in the pipeline.