Back To SPDs But Struggling.

Just go back to flats again if it worked for so many years.

your foot not resting on a platform?

that was my first put off with SPDS, then i got on board with some dmr vtwins and have just started getting used to some nukeproof clipless i picked up

both pedals my shoe is engaged on the platform as well as the spd

And crank brothers mechanism is proprietary to them

lots of people love time from what i understand

I've been exclusively flats since about 2016 after a painful fall off a wall when I failed to unclip.  Prior to that I'd been SPD since back in the 90s with the original PD-M737 hand grenade.  Recently I've been thinking about clipping in again for security over choppy stuff but I want to keep the flat pedal feel.

Unfortunately CrankBrothers appear to have nailed the 'clipped into a flat pedal' feel whilst all the SPD licenced types just feel like an SPD and may as well not have a platform.  I say unfortunately as I am very reluctant to buy anything CrankBrothers that has moving parts.

So what to do?  Reviews of the Hope Union pedals look good, I'm going to try either the trail or gravity versions and pray the glowing reviews weren't written by SPD die hards.  If that doesn't work out it's stick with flats because I don't think I can face CB levels of maintenance and replacement however good they are.

TL:DR I don't have an answer but maybe will in a couple of weeks

I've got three pairs of CB Mallets of different flavours - never done an ounce of maintenance. Granted one pair is new, but the other two have had a good dose of abuse. I'm always switching between flats and clips - never tried any SPD's though

time? the clip in mechanism of CB but without the additional seals and cocknockery that leads to the maintenance issues. i had CB come off the end of the spindle and i've broken an axle in half riding up a hill. i saw the video you watched and i'm not sure i can get the same interface Steve describes with times but having switched 4 bikes from CB to time years ago i've never looked back. i wear them out - the rails wear and on some of them the springs nag away at the body of the pedal, but i have never had cause to take them apart. ever. they've never broken mid ride either. i like MX6 from the current range. i have a set of speciale 8 in a drawer i didn't get on with if they float your boat...

Can’t say I’ve had that feeling - I switch between flats and clips fairly often. The clips I’m using are Nukeproof horizons - the bigger squarer ones. Using them with a flat style sole spd shoe - Shimano am7 I think it is. I removed a couple of pins and played with the height of a few and they feel perfect now. Easy to clip in and out of but the shoe must be contacting some pins as it feels more stable than a non platform kind of spd to me.

Only issue is cleats going forward and whether anyone will make them with the whole Chiggle issue. Shimano are compatible but I didn’t find them as slick to click in. Although I have subsequently read it’s suggested with Shimano cleats you run a small spacer plate underneath them with Nukeproof pedals.

My lad has been running CB Mallet DH for 18 months in races, practices, riding... First bearing/bushing swap was fairly recently, never had a single issue with them. They are pretty much the go-to for many DH racers.

He's recently been given 2 pairs of DMR V Twin pedals
https://www.dmrbikes.com/Catalogue/Pedals/Clipless/VTWIN

He's trialing them now but up to now seems pretty happy with the engagement and feel. No issues at all yet. We're running the DMR Cleats currently but have a set of Shimano SH56 which are multi-release that we can and will try as well. They come with lots of platform spacers if you want to increase the stack height for feel, but he's currently running his straight out of the box.

What flats and what shoes are you using?

Can't beat 510s IMO.

On techy downs it might be foot position on the pedal, try the arch centralised over the pedal axle.

After watching that i’m thinking maybe he’s on to something there. Maybe I’m not adapting to turning the bike in properly as I’m still steering through my feet and that’s just resulting in my feet turning on the pedals rather than turning the bike into the corner.

I swap between flat & SPD pedals, using flats for enduro riding & bikepacking, running SPD's on for XC, gravel & road.

What you've just described, I've noticed a few times latterly on the gravel & road bike where I'm practically unclipping as I turn mid-speed downhill/coasting corners.  Best I watch the video...

I was user of CB Candy pedals years ago and liked the 'float' & lack of weight, but had 3 sets fall apart in very short order, whereas I've never had a Shimano SPD fail (have 3 pairs and my oldest set must be nearly 10 years old).

Also does anyone have any suggestions for pedals that aren’t CrankBrothers but have a similar setup without the fall apartyness of CB’s?

Something from Time:-

Speciale (Shiny CNC aluminium body), MX (Plastic body) or DH (Cast Aluminium body).

All are in the enduro/DH sort of market. Just decide on how much you want to spend. Some have adjustable tension, some have Ti axles, some have shiny carbon.

You can also tweak the cleats to add float if you need more than is already offered (10 minutes with a file, i've done it). And the speciale has adjustable pins i think.

Mine tend to last at least a decade with zero attention.

Thanks for the replys.

never done an ounce of maintenance.

As I said I had numerous different CB pedals previously.
I can't believe they can survive any amount of riding with no maintenance.
I used to grease mine around once a month and they still needed bearing kits at regular intervals.
That I could cope with. The snapped axles leaving me to push home less so...

time?

There's a couple of pairs of Time platforms kicking about in the garage that Mrsstu used to use.
Might order some cleats and give them a try but from memory they still don't have the platform to sole contact of the mallet.
On the + side from what I remember they were very reliable.

I've no interest in buying any Nukeproof pedals for obvious reasons.

Hope Union pedals look good, I’m going to try either the trail or gravity versions and pray the glowing reviews weren’t written by SPD die hards.

I'd be very interested to hear how this turns out for you.

I moved back to Hope gravity Clipless pedals after riding penthouse flats for a few years.

I have removed all the shims so my foot is actually sat on the pedal for support, no pins, but having your foot sat on the frame in a soft shoe felt pretty similar to flat pedal riding.

but having your foot sat on the frame in a soft shoe felt pretty similar to flat pedal riding.

Sounds like it might help.

I've just read a couple of revues on the Hope Gravity and they seem pretty positive.
One of the revues was from a mates housemate. Might drop round and see if he still has them.

I've tried a few clipless systems and finally settled on Mallets a good while back. Last year I gave up on them as I was getting frustrated with how much maintenance I was doing.

I decided to try the Hope gravity pedals after reading Robert Johnson's review on Loamwolf (possibly your mates room mate). They are exactly as he described, a bit of a faff to get the pin and shim set up well, but after that they feel very secure but also very positive and easy to release.

I would definitely recommend them.

All my bikes are fitted with Crank Brothers Candy pedals.

Ive only had the coming off the spindle problem with the Egg Beaters.

I decided to try the Hope gravity pedals after reading Robert Johnson’s review on Loamwolf (possibly your mates room mate). They are exactly as he described, a bit of a faff to get the pin and shim set up well, but after that they feel very secure but also very positive and easy to release.

Most helpful and yes you've got the right guy.

As I said I had numerous different CB pedals previously.
I can’t believe they can survive any amount of riding with no maintenance.
I used to grease mine around once a month and they still needed bearing kits at regular intervals.

I've been using CB Candys for many years. They've definitely improved since I first started (around 2009?) and it helps to avoid the lower cost versions. All mine are Candy 3s. I don't find they need much maintenance. Might be worth another try?

Might be worth another try?

Nah, they had enough of my money over the years and won't be getting any more.

Fit cleats with more float. You might be finding that you can't twist into the corner like you could with flats.

Also with spd's, they raise you up about  ~10mm, so this can make a difference.

Time have great float in their cleats, and their pedals are as tough as old boots.

I'm looking for less float not more.
I want the direct feel I get from flats where my feet don't move on the pedals.

I find that there is more in spd's than flat pedals, once my flats are in the position trying to move them is difficult, which is the idea.

The hopes come with platforms and pins etc, I use the platforms to lift up the body of the pedal but no pins as I found they hindered the in out rotation.

The Hope gravitys are a massive platform pedal similar size to the penthouse' I ride on the dj and DH bike, clips for trails. I find switching back and forth vert straight forward due to the size

I’m looking for less float not more.<br />I want the direct feel I get from flats where my feet don’t move on the pedals.

Sorry, I've not heard of anyone wanting less float before, other than sprinter types.
Apparently Shimano have 6 degrees of float, as do Crank Brothers and Time are 5 degrees (although this depends which way round you fit them), so Time have less float than Shimano and Crank Brothers. 

I'd just check you have the standard SH521 spd cleats fitted and tighter the release setting on the spd pedals to the max and see how that feels, before buying different pedals.

SH51 cleats are black, whereas the SH56 cleats are silver-coloured, plus there’s an M embossed on the rear-facing tab of the SH56.
The difference between SH51 cleats and SH56 cleats is the number of directions in which you can release the cleat from the pedal.
SH51 cleats have a single direction of release; that’s to say you can only disengage from the pedal by pushing your heel out in a flat plane relative to the pedal, or by pushing it in.
The SH56 cleats, on the other hand, enable multi-directional release; as well as pushing your heel out or in, you can also roll your shoe on the pedal or pull up to release it.

Not wishing to sound ungrateful but you don't seem to understand the reason i want less float.
The angle of release has nowt to do with it and tightening the adjuster won't give them any less float.
Clipping in and out isn't and never has been a problem.
I've also never felt the need to use the easy release cleats.

As I said I'm not new* to SPDs just noticing what to me is a drawback that I've only encountered after switching back to them after four years on flats.

*I switched from toeclips to them around 91.

Time are the best for me functionally and are indestructible IME. I am talking about the MX platform series. The MX2s were £28 at Merlin inc cleats recently.

CB are disposable IME but look better.

its not float thats your issue its the interface between teh shoe and pedal. if your cleats are too proud you are standing on the cleat - which is unstable and you will wobble about on teh pedal. Back when you were using spds all the time your muscles were probably used to this and stonger to suit. as you`ve been using flats (which dont have this issue) you are now fat and lazy with no muscle tone!! 😉

i had some candys and used some cheapo xc disco slippers and i found the shoe used to be really unstable on the pedal as there was no grip between teh shoe and pedal. it felt like i was relying solely on teh cleat which i didnt like and therefore i was tense.

I then tried cheap flat spd shoes and a cb mallet with pins and it was like night and day. so much more like a flat. the platform and pins really help the feel when stood up. It takes a while to bed new shoes in and they can be a bugger to unclip initially but once the pins wear a groove you are all good.

i have some smaller mallets which i like less than the full DH versions. even with teh same shoes they just dont offer quite the same connected feel.

its not float thats your issue its the interface between teh shoe and pedal.

It's almost as if thats what i was saying in the OP.😉
Yep I'm also much fatter and lazier than I was back then.
So much so i've gone from riding twice a week to four or five times and as a result gone up from 95 KG to 82 😛

To comment on Hope Unions; I've ridden SPD for decades and had a brief dalliance with flats on my MTB. Ive decided flats aren't for me - could be partly because I ride my gravel bike a lot (not flats).

I'm now using Hopes; Trail on the MTB and Race on the gravel bike.

I find the release action is just a little different to SPD - can't put my finger on exactly how. Possibly they are a more linear kick out rather than partially lift a bit like SPDs. This does mean the occasional slight panic as my muscle memory is very ingrained.

If your issue is subconcious nervousness, moving from the familiar SPD might not help.

Just a quick update on this.
Had a mess about with my shoes and managed to jam the cleats a little further back on the shoe.
I recon I only got about another 3 or 4mm. Not enough that you'd think it'd make a massive difference.
Two rides in with the new position and all the front wheel nervousness on unsupported semi steep corners has gone.

So it seems as if my riding style may have changed a little since I was a regular on clips and switching back showed up the difference.

May still try the Hope DH pedal because you know new and shiny.