Friend has some beautiful Fox 34 forks, Kashima coating. Lovely!
But in this current mud, wet and grit, are they resilient to these conditions or do they unduly suffer?
I just remember back in the day, my Pace RC36s and rebuilding them frequently in winter, often just to remove mud and crap!
Just genuinely interested.
Yes, basically! Stuff of decent quality is generally very well sealed unless they're already buggered. Change the oil in the lowers at regular intervals and they will last for yonks. Luckily, it's not 1998 any more.
Friend has some beautiful Fox 34 forks, Kashima coating. Lovely!
But in this current mud, wet and grit, are they resilient to these conditions or do they unduly suffer?
I just remember back in the day, my Pace RC36s and rebuilding them frequently in winter, often just to remove mud and crap!
Just genuinely interested.
I've got Kashima Fox Factory 38's on 2 bikes and RS Lyriks/Lyrik Ultimates on 2 other bikes. They get ridden in all conditions to no noticeable detriment
Just to jump on this, does anyone use fork oil on their stanctions at the seals to draw out grit and muck? I have religiously done it for 6 years or so, but did some reading recently and it seems that this is quite decisive - many people calling it snake oil and completely unnecessary. Any thoughts?
I think the fashion for front mud guards helps as it keeps the worst of that stanchions.
Will be interesting to see how USD forks compare.
Just to jump on this, does anyone use fork oil on their stanctions at the seals to draw out grit and muck? I have religiously done it for 6 years or so, but did some reading recently and it seems that this is quite decisive - many people calling it snake oil and completely unnecessary. Any thoughts?
No, but I silicone spray before each ride
I don't think they are that great on some modern forks like RS 35s, I've seen a few people destroy the stantions through limited servicing. Biggest thing that helps is a crown mounted mudguard like a RRP proguard. They stop the mud building up on the seal and stantions. I do a quick lowers clean and re-oil every 6 months, but never change the seals as they seem to last forever if you keep the oil clean.
My more basic Fox 34 rythm have been ridden year round. No front mud guard. They been serviced once around the same time that the rear cassette got swapped. I was told all was good inside
Interesting and thanks, the sealing is very impressive to withstand our lovely British winter. Happy trails
I use RRP fenders which keeps most of the slime away from the seals these days.
I also use suspension spray on the stanchions. I think I've got Fenwick's or Juicy Lubes. Wet seals work much better than dry ones so it pays to keep them moist.
You can see the amount of dusty grit that comes out after you spray them and pump the fork a few times. Better out than in I reckon. Is it snake oil if you can actually see it working?
Just pay attention to keeping them clean. Crown mudguards do a very good job of keeping the worse off the moving parts. Silicone spray is great for keeping the seals in great condition. I did an oil change on my rear shock, and even after no oil changes, what came out was totally clear, no contamination.
Just to jump on this, does anyone use fork oil on their stanctions at the seals to draw out grit and muck? I have religiously done it for 6 years or so, but did some reading recently and it seems that this is quite decisive - many people calling it snake oil and completely unnecessary. Any thoughts?
Why would it drag the muck out anymore than it would drag it in? I like to keep mine dry on the outside wet on the inside. Not had any issues but I don't ride in the wet too much.
Why would it drag the muck out anymore than it would drag it in? I like to keep mine dry on the outside wet on the inside. Not had any issues but I don't ride in the wet too much.
I don't know but you can see it happening when you do it.
I'm just guessing but maybe it loosens the crud which has hardened under the lip but outside the foam ring. If that crud has a 50:50 chance of getting inside I'd rather loosen it up and wipe it away with a rag.
I'm not riding around with wet stanchions. I squirt, pump, wipe and bin in that order.
Recently killed a set of Rebas after 11 years during which they were serviced x2. Thing that did for them was the anodising wearing off the stanchions, which given that they'd been ridden in all weathers...
I have the very same fork but 2016 edition. They have travelled in the 11 years over 50000 miles in mid-Wales, so as wet and muddy as you can get. Feel like new especially after a lowers service that gets done every 6-8 weeks. I've not had them properly serviced for 5 years, but until there is a problem I won't.
I broke a set of Fox 34s. But it was a scratch on a muddy ride rather than wear so perhaps not fair. Otherwise most forks just keep going as long as they are cleaned after rides.
I used to use oil around the seals. You can also use a zip tie to get the crud out. I do wonder if this might sometimes created more problems than is solves though, if the seals are doing there job.
I do occasionally service forks and I've never opened them up and thought "I should have done this sooner".
Caveat would be your local riding conditions - near me it tends to be quite organic mud with not much sand. If you were riding somewhere with different conditions you might get more of a problem. I occasionally ride at Kielder. It is more sandy and (thinking back to that infamous wet K100 nearly 15 years ago) can destroy bikes relatively quickly.
Deffo worth using mudguards. (And I clean forks and shock after every ride and dribble with silicon )
Still upset as many, many years ago, whilst riding down a muddy/gravelly horsed to bxxgery track, I got a scratch (grit stuck in huge mud pile on forks) on my, otherwise immaculate, fox f100 floats
Basically once mud builds up on the stanchions it will hold grit/gravel in the wrong place.
Am I right in thinking that the airspring is sealed inside the stanchion and that wear on the outside of the stanchion is no big deal?
Just to jump on this, does anyone use fork oil on their stanctions at the seals to draw out grit and muck? I have religiously done it for 6 years or so, but did some reading recently and it seems that this is quite decisive - many people calling it snake oil and completely unnecessary. Any thoughts?
I just wipe them over with a baby wipe and apply some silicone spray at the wiper seal, when the lowers are off I'll apply some oil to the foam rings.
In answer to the OP, yeah they all generally seem to keep the crap out, I recently bought some ~10 year old pikes (posted from a from welsh address) that had maybe been a little neglected in recent years, pulled them apart and nothing nasty had migrated inside that I could see; clean up, oil change, good to go...
The thing to note (IMO) is that "modern" MTB forks aren't actually that much more complex than they were 15+ years ago, all that has really changed is Scale, the stanchions are fatter, the A-C might be longer but fundamentally most of them are constructed the same was as they were in the late 2000s, Dampers (typically as a self contained assembly in one leg) are where the majority of development effort seems to go for the major brands now.
Honestly seals have been more than good enough for at least 15 years, any fork that isn't these days has deliberately cut a corner. Manufacturers can literally just call SKF and say "sell me a fantastic quality seal and make it fit this fork" and they'll do it and it'll be as good as anyone could really want.
That said nothing is indestructible but that'll always be the case. Nobody can complain if they fail to service a fork and it wears- I mean, I'm not talking about manufacturer recommendations here, you can push a fork to way past that with no ill effects but sooner or later it's likely to be a problem, and not just for the seals. I think (but have absolutely no proof) that not cleaning is probably quite bad too- dry mud can be really pretty tough and could definitely do more damage or push itself into seals more than wet mud.
Am I right in thinking that the airspring is sealed inside the stanchion and that wear on the outside of the stanchion is no big deal?
Correct, decent forks run the air piston against the inside of the stantion, cheap forks with steel stantions tend to have an extra completely separate piston assembly because the inside of the steel tubes aren't smooth.
Wear on the outside of the stanchion will allow debris to get past the seals and wear the bushings. It is also possible for forks to draw lubricating oil into the damper. If the oil in the lower is contaminated, you may end up damaging the damper.
Plus it'll probably directly contact and wear the bushings. And the bits of fork and bushing are contamination themselves, almost as bad as water.