Total cods-wallop
I think it would suit rides who have spent a large amount of time riding DH bikes. Much in the same way, a slack 29er enduro bike also needs be man handled like a DH bike.
Well....I disagree 😛
I'm fully expecting to see people wiping out a lot on these things. Great for Dhers - I'd love to have a go on one having come from that background. Not so sure they will be so great for trail riders.
There was a little video on MBR about the gearbox one.
They suggested the suspension is great & it holds a line well, but it's a big, fat tank.
Struggling to see the point myself, but hey, people like to be different.
The point for me is better fit as I am large arms and medium legs and its a confidence boost, it probably wouldn't make me any faster, it'd just mean I wasn't bricking it all the time down some of the local hills.
Well, they take a very different style of riding - as long as you don't mind that. But I'd argue that if you're bricking it - downhill bikes etc come with their own set of idiosyncracies that can make you shit bricks.
A good analogy is a Desmodecci Moto GP bike vs a Yamaha R1.
99 percent of motorbikers will ride faster on the latter, the other 1 percent will be able to ring the neck of the bike and get a faster lap time. As it takes more physicality and commitment to ride fast on the former.
Another good analogy is an escalator vs a step ladder.
you're far less likely to fall off an escalator than a step ladder.
Only if that anology involves going over the bars.
I wipe out a lot more on downhill bikes and go down sideways. I also tend to go faster, so when I do crash I crash in a bigger, more painful fashion. You're also more likely to case them on jumps and drops when you're tired as they physically take more to correctly jump and drop on - not just because of the weight but because of the geometry. I find the front wheel will drop away from you much more quickly - they are much less tolerant of poor airbourne technique than a 6 inch bike. Except of course if you manage to stay on, then the extra cushion helps.
If I'm going to have a 62 degree head angled bike with dual ply minions, I'd rather just put a wide range cassette, a dropper post, carbon wheels, and an airshock with a lockout function on a carbon downhill bike. It will be the same weight, it will do the same thing, it will also have full DH travel and proper dual crowns. Save for theseatube it would be pretty close to the nicolai, someone should produce a DH bike with a steep seatube.
Jumps, drops and airborne are not words that come frequently in my riding.
I've ridden this bike, I like it, I cant yet afford it.
Well you've kind of proven my point really - if you don't do those things are you going to commit to corners enough to actually warrant such an extreme head angle? Slack head angles wont always make you feel less nervous on straights steep stuff either, unless you load the front wheel up - they can lack feel and be decidely pingy through rock and root sections.
Have you tried a Mondraker, the fit will be good but the head angles are less crazy for your average trail rider?
Nope, not tried a Mondraker, do you have one to sell, is this where its going?
I'm interested in a bike that I've tried and liked. Not quite sure what the problem is there.
Ahh young Tom92384239084457 is back. Tom, you're awesome xx
Just don't make a mistake mate, especially if it's going to take a while for you to save up. If you do like it, can you afford to get more rides on one or know anyone who has got one so you can ride on varied terrain for a few more days? A day isn't enough to know in my experience.
Mondrakers with the forward geometry go all the time on ebay, but you can pick up frames new for about 1300, so a lot less than the Nicolai. They are longer than anything bar the Nicolai by a long shot and you can always stick an angleset in to knock 2 degrees off the head angle at a later date.
I'm not trying to belittle anyone, I'm just trying to offer counterpoints before people jump on a potential bandwagon and make a 2200 quid plus mistake.
Mum, get off the Internet, you're embarrassing me
So much great advice on this thread from people who haven't ridden the bike.
Tom_W1987 - MemberOnly if that anology involves going over the bars.
I wipe out a lot more on downhill bikes and go down sideways. I also tend to go faster, so when I do crash I crash in a bigger, more painful fashion. You're also more likely to case them on jumps and drops when you're tired as they physically take more to correctly jump and drop on - not just because of the weight but because of the geometry. I find the front wheel will drop away from you much more quickly - they are much less tolerant of poor airbourne technique than a 6 inch bike. Except of course if you manage to stay on, then the extra cushion helps.
If I'm going to have a 62 degree head angled bike with dual ply minions, I'd rather just put a wide range cassette, a dropper post, carbon wheels, and an airshock with a lockout function on a carbon downhill bike. It will be the same weight, it will do the same thing, it will also have full DH travel and proper dual crowns. Save for theseatube it would be pretty close to the nicolai, someone should produce a DH bike with a steep seatube.
Not sure there's enough ink in my red pen to correct all the wrong in that.
I'm looking forward to trying one, they seem to have been built with me in mind. I love the bike I'm currently on, but would like it a little longer as my style has changed since I bought it in 2012. Slack bikes just need a bit of technique change. My Alpine currently has a 64* head angle, 1200mm wheelbase and fairly long chain stays and it's great going up and down.
I've heard the Geometron is good on wet roots
Can you convert the GPI to chain when the belt fails?
Just ride the bike with the same technique as you would on a motocross bike. The attack position (elbows up).
Also weighting the front wheel really isn't difficult due to your riding position.
So glad I'm on a dinky little smart phone I can't even be bothered to call out all the weapons grade BS being spouted.
For the record I'm a downhiller with a frustrating lack of access to mountains so I want to try a Geometron and cause maximum erosion on the poor little trails.
Geometron e-bike please, I would like to be greeted with maximum hostility everywhere I go.
Not sure there's enough ink in my red pen to correct all the wrong in that.
Not only can I feel that whilst riding bikes with similar geometry - it's basic physics that if you put a front wheel with some mass further out in front of you then it's going to drop away from you more easily if you use poor technique. It's also blatantly obvious that the further you put a wheel out in front of you, the more effort you have to put into loading the front tyre.
Keep up with the bandwagons guys and the idea that something that suits world cup racers will automatically suit you as well.
Even if you do ride it once, on one day at Bike Park Wales, the whole psychology of "oooooh shiney new thing that rides a bit differently...must have" will mean that you will love it regardless. After one month of riding it in terrain outside of downhill track like trails - the story might be different.
Maybe I'm just a massive cynic though.
I don't think it's being pitched at people who can't ride tbh
Meh, it just strikes me that it will get boring/tiring fast on long rides. I've seen a few reviews on the German sites that have said similar things about the Mondrakers, that you have to rag the utter crap out of them all the time to get them to work. That would also be my experience of them - I just can't be arsed...I want to eat pork pies, banter and dick about on the side of the trail. Not hit everything in full gnarr racer mode.
My Reign takes enough effort as it is.
I'm finding myself ambivalent and somewhat confused in regards to the logic of the whole thing. The long reach is for climbing right or is just a side effect of the steep seat angle? Great - but apparently this wears you out quicker on the downs. If I can't keep the end down it's usually just faster to walk anyway. Orange and a few other manufacturers with long reaches build their DH bikes with shorter reaches than their enduro bikes? Am I going to see people ride these things in half lids? If I do, I think I might get the urge to kill someone.
Overthinking this - will pay to have a go on one to see if it's better than the mondrakers as I'm a jaded dick.
I'd quite happily have a bike where you 'need to rag the utter crap' out of it. That's sort of the point of why I go riding.
It's been said that these bikes aren't for everyone. But they do seem to go pretty fast.
Tom KP
As some one who has ridden this bike twice now. once at the forest of dean on trails I've ridden on quite a few different bikes Ive owned. Then once on some trails I rode with paul from mojo, trails I've never ridden.
I've got no reason to hate or love this bike. But what surprised me was that when riding a trail that had ups and downs, along flats. I never once felt that it was a struggle. no more than any other bike I've ridden anyway. Don't get me wrong it took a slightly different approach to get the most out of it, ie needing to get your weight over the front of it. But that's no different than riding any other type of bike, all be if that's a santa cruz trc, an alpine 160, a road bike or motocross bike. They are all different, so will have a slightly different approach.
If you find that its takes different muscles in the body to ride it, then so be it. get out on it and those muscles will develop.
Oh and also anyone who says it wont go round corners, to big to jump and play about on. you sir are a muppet.
Haha tomw you make me laugh you obviously have no clue! Next time your st coed y brenin let me know ill bring my one for you to ride!
I'd love a go to see what it's like but it's well outside my purchasing power, and Skill level.
From reading about it and looking through the info from Mojo it strikes me as a bike to get if you know exactly what you want and need, and are a very competent rider? It's set up to really come into its own at the ragged edge? I'm not sure I'd get the most out of it over an off the shelf bike.
Thing is you could easily spend just as much on an off the shelf bike and that wouldn't come with 2 sets of wheels, personalised suspension setup, choice of contact and control points, tailored gearing and rear travel... etc, etc but this bike does.
While the geo is quite progressive I think a huge chunk of its performance comes from all the added extras so if you don't want to ride "on the ragged edge" then you wouldn't get them to set it up like that.
Thing is you could easily spend just as much on an off the shelf bike and that wouldn't come with 2 sets of wheels, personalised suspension setup, choice of contact and control points, tailored gearing and rear travel... etc, etc but this bike does.
Whilst I'm completely ambivalent to it as a bike, that doesn't really stack up to me.
You could quite easily spend a hell of a lot less on a 'better' spec bike that's just as capable & a shed load lighter (in the real world, rather than some make believe numbers) & still get the suspension worked over to the same sort of degree & save yourself a couple of grand.
But, the choice is a good thing I guess. Can't escape the fact it's a minging, ugly thing though.
I'm not sure you'd get better spec, lighter, more capable, custom tuned suspension and 2k cheaper but even if you can you can't deny you get a lot when stacked against everyone else at the same price.
I was just trying to suggest that saying you / I / someone wouldn't buy this bike that comes with loads of custom features because it probably isn't right for them doesn't make sense as part of the package is making it right for you.
Closest you might get to geometron geo for a lot cheaper might be to get an Airdrop Edit and put a -2 degree angleset on it (that is if it'll take one).
Anyhow, I don't think at any point was anyone under the illusion that this was a cheap option, similar to mass produced bikes.
I'm not questioning the price, top end bikes are now getting all around that price with boutique frames etc.
My point was is! That clearly this is a big old bike 170mm travel it's not a trail centre or woods type bike it's for riding fast and tough trails flat out. So I think watering it dien wouldn't do it justice as it's not what it's designed for? So I I rocked up at Mojo said here 6k I ride trail centre blues and occasionally Whites Level, they'd struggle to get it any better than say a Stumpy or anthem, with properly set up shocks?
I think you'd need to be a certain skill level to push the bike for it to come into its own enough for the changes to shine through, and wonder if you aren't pushing it it may be a bit meh?
Cool concept and customisation though.
Tbh its the setup rides at cwmcarn with Mojo that sound more I retesting to me, not necessarily with the geometron, but I think loads of bikes and riders would benefit from this
Tom_W1987 you havent ridden one, stop spouting bullshit! hacking anglesets on other bikes just doesn't come close to making it the same. I have some friends who've tried it. You just can't replicate the position it places the rider on on the bike that way, especially with shorter chainstays. Ignore what you think the HA does for you. It's not for stability, it doesnt need that. It changes the way it steers and corners compared to a steeper bike.
There could be a possibility of a demo in Scotland, would likely have to be be nearer the borders to make it practical, much further North than Pitlochry, and its getting towards a long weekend I suspect..preferably nearer 'Tress/Inners.
Travel is 155mm/165mm in stock. Can be easily set to be lower at the rear or run 160mm at the front. It is not 'clearly' a big old bike anymore than a Nomad is. You have to ride it to get that. It's a very capable trail bike that can be ridden on daft stuff with confidence.
You don't need to be a certain skill level.
Wookster - MemberMy point was is! That clearly this is a big old bike 170mm travel it's not a trail centre or woods type bike
It's 155mm at the back. And my standard 160 Ion is plenty playful and is no bother round the woods
@HobNob, not sure I'd agree that 33lbs all up with pedals is a big fat tank. A guide friend of mine did an experiment the other year because various guests were all turning up with talk of their "28lb' AM/Trail bikes as per manufacturers weights or just what they thought. So he rigged a bike scale up and weighed each one before loading into the the trailer in front of the group...most of them were 33lb to 35lbs.
No one's holiday was ruined 🙂
My 2010 Helius AM was 32lb, it kept finding its way into the DIrt 100..
Tom_W1987 considers his next response...
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There could be a possibility of a demo in Scotland.....preferably nearer 'Tress/Inners
Make this happen!
There could be a possibility of a demo in Scotland, would likely have to be be nearer the borders to make it practical, much further North than Pitlochry, and its getting towards a long weekend I suspect..preferably nearer 'Tress/Inners.
Thanks - think that would be a popular option even for some of us northerly folk.
Ok. I'll look at that. Can any of you Northern folk/Very Northern folk drop me a line on my profile email. so I can get an idea of Numbers. Maybe the best option could be a full demo weekend with Mojo, the only question could be timing.
I don't mind doing it, just need to see how many/what size bikes we'd be looking at.
I had a quick look at the MBR article. The GPI, built properly is nothing like 18kg, and the gearbox isn't 2.7kg either.
The 18spd gearbox is but not the 12 or the 9 which are 2.35kg and 2.2kg respectively. The bike can be specified with any of them. The 9sp has a slightly larger range than typical XX1 but runs in what feels like 2 gear step changes compare to XX1.
And in answer to an earlier question, if the belt broke can you convert the bike to chain drive, yes. But I'd suggest its easier to just replace the belt.
Just like to say I rode the long Nicolai Ion GPI at the FoD demo day and I liked it.......... I liked it a lot.
Thanks
Jes
P.S. When I get one I shall probably ride it occasionally along canal tow paths 😀
Innerleithen'd be the perfect place to testdrive one of these I reckon, especially if you can do it on an uplift day. I'd love a go but I can't afford one so it'd be taking the piss 😆
Just watched the GPI video review. I'll weigh the demo once its built. Pretty sure it wont be near 18kg!
Where's that review, Chainline?
As for 18kg Nicolai are quoting 16.3kg for the full build.
Its here, it kind of goes against what a lot of other Pinion users have said
[url= http://www.mbr.co.uk/videos/bikes-and-equipment/is-the-nicolai-ion-gpi-the-most-radical-mountain-bike-ever-created-video ]http://www.mbr.co.uk/videos/bikes-and-equipment/is-the-nicolai-ion-gpi-the-most-radical-mountain-bike-ever-created-video[/url]
It basically lists all the problems and skims over the plus points... and I think they said it weighed 2.5kg when pinion say it weighs 2.35 (not much difference but lets be accurate) and has a bigger range than a 2 x 10
