[Closed] And so it begins...? "mechanical doping" first?

Presumable him and her aren't exactly the same size and shape, so they would have totally different bike setups (if it's not her bike)

Should be a fairly easy thing to compare.

But if her mechanics grabbed it to "prep" then they might have set it up the same as hers?

you'd think he would have noticed his bike was missing before tonight 😕

But if her mechanics grabbed it to "prep" then they might have set it up the same as hers?

And he'd not changed any parts for his preferred items since he's owned it. Saddle preference is fairly unique in serious cyclists, especially between male and female riders.

It's a bit of a stretch to think that the only thing he did to the bike while he owned it is fit a few thousand quids worth of electric motor, and left everything else exactly the same.

Well that's cleared that up then.

Although why a retired cyclist/chip shop owner should design and build himself a hidden motor in a cyclocross bike and then leave it in the pits, God only knows. What a strange world professional cycling is at times. 😕

[quote=nealglover ]

But if her mechanics grabbed it to "prep" then they might have set it up the same as hers?

Plausible deniability innit? Maybe not by most definitions of 'plausible'. It's up to the UCI to define how they're going to act.

As a cyclist and a fan of the pro sport, I hope they set an example*.

*Unless we hear of a more plausible reason for her to have a bike with a motor in her pits.

EDIT: I'm about 4 posts too late. Never mind.

Can you say "fall guy"?

[img] [/img]

Now Lee Majors is implicated?!?!

This whole thing is getting more complicated every day... By Friday I fully expect to discover that there wasn't even actually a Race at all, and the UCI falsified the whole event as part of some elaborate scheme to blackmail their way into free chips for life...

[url= https://www.salden.nl/nl/wilier-triestina-e-cycl-ocrosser-met-trapondersteuning.html ]Well, this is awkward.....[/url]

(Yes, I know it's an aftermarket fit, but still! 🙂 )

That has to be a spoof surely....

Might not be a spoof. [url= https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:Yx4EBY6e0lMJ:https://www.salden.nl/en/bikes-and-frames/cyclocross/e-cyclocrosser/wilier-triestina-e-cycl-ocrosser-met-trapondersteuning.html+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk ]Google cache[/url] says 'It is a snapshot of the page as it appeared on 18 Nov 2015 20:27:59 GMT.'

[url= https://www.salden.nl/en/bikes-and-frames/cyclocross/e-cyclocrosser/wilier-triestina-e-cycl-ocrosser-met-trapondersteuning.html ]For the UK version of the same page[/url]

Good grief! So you can just walk into a bike shop and get one of these.
150w!! Someone tell me this is a spoof please.

*ordered.

I've got that Gravel Reviver 200k thing coming up.. I'd like some help, afterall..it's not a race is it 😆

Seems reasonable too. Specced out with ultegra di2, carbon wheels, the 150w turbo boost thingy - all for just under £5k. 😉 😀

Poxy bike industry. I don't want to be told I have to have a motor.

(Would be handy though. Also on a 26" it'll spin the wheels up faster for doing donuts. Might impede top end though. 🙁 )

Bikebouy said:

She's 19, theres a lot more to this story than just a kid using/potentially using a bike with a motor in it.

I feel sorry for her.

I completely agree. I don't believe she was even behind the idea, but whilst she maintains her position she's protecting those that were (entirely understandable if, as some of us suspect, her father is involved). The UCI rules and their strict liability for the rider mean that if she continues with this defence she faces a ban regardless of her defence, but she becomes the scapegoat for everyone else involved. And she's likely to carry more infamy post-ban than if she'd 'just' chemically doped, as she has the dubious honour to be the first to be busted with a motor.

Whonder if the disciplinary process will consider other results (as with some drug dope cases) - she's the current Euro U23 champion.

I don't believe she was even behind the idea

Maybe not, but she didn't seem to be complaining when she powered up the hill in the race shown in the gritcx video. She knew what she was doing and she was old enough to know that it wrong.....

If she's under that much pressure to win, exerted by her father, she might actually be happy it's been found and she's out of the game.....

The Kopenburg race did remind me somewhat of Riccardo Ricco riding up the Tourmalet in the 2008 (?) Tour when he burnt off the best in the peleton with apparent ease.

I do agree that it may not have been her idea, but she does seem to have been happy to use it - if it can be proved she was using a dodgy bike back then

I blame the parents...
when your son is busy taking drugs and your daughter has a motor hidden in a word championship race you have to question their moral fibre

I do agree that it may not have been her idea, but she does seem to have been happy to use it - if it can be proved she was using a dodgy bike back then

I think Nikki Harris is pretty clear that it was used at the Koppenbergcross

She knew what she was doing and she was old enough to know that it wrong.....

I think a rider might be a touch aware of a motor in her bike when it kicks in...

And you have to ask the question..

If Nikki Harris knew it was being used at the Kopp CX event, did she raise that point with the commissionaires? her team? (who could raise on her behalf) If not, why not?

And if Nikki knew, surely a few other riders knew too, or suspected it.

Just sayin'

Improving Cycling Performance: Transcranial Direct Current Stimulation Increases Time to Exhaustion in Cycling

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0144916

Let's not forget the parrot 😯 the Van den Driessche family is also currently being charged for parakeet theft February last year. Dad Peter, doping-suspended son Niels, and a friend were caught on camera stealing two expensive parakeets from a shop 😆

You couldn't make this stuff up!!

http://www.hln.be/regio/nieuws-uit-jabbeke/-die-familie-deinst-voor-niets-terug-a2603590/

actually she may not have known anything other than she appeared to be on incredible form. There is no reason why this couldn't have been activated remotely and that is even more likely as then there is nothing visible

Sorry but that's getting WAY too complex. Those internal seat-tube motors turn the cranks at a set speed. You have to tell the motor how fast to turn the cranks by pushing and holding a little button for a few seconds while pedalling at the required cadence. The motor then takes over.

If you try and pedal at 90rpm while the motor is trying to do 60, you'll blow the motor. Likewise in reverse, if you're trying to hold 60rpm and the motor is trying to do 90 then it'll damage the motor. It works in conjunction with gear changes and the rider, it's really not something you'd want to have under remote control.

Imagine driving down the road at a steady speed and suddenly someone auto-activates the turbo in your car. It'd be a disaster, you want something like that under your exclusive control. Beside, adding in remote access is adding considerably to the complexity of an already complex system.

It's not designed to run and run for hours, it's a "boost" system you can use on long drags (that Koppenberg climb being a classic example of where it would be perfect).
To be honest on such a technical course as Zolder, I can't see it being of any use at all, there was nothing long enough to require a steady cadence once you factor in the 5 seconds of programming time to tell the motor how fast to turn.

Fair enough, you have more detailed info than me.

Assuming that's the motor/system that's been used?

I'd say crazy-legs is just showing far too much knowledge on this.....

If Nikki Harris knew it was being used at the Kopp CX event, did she raise that point with the commissionaires? her team? (who could raise on her behalf) If not, why not?

actually she may not have known anything other than she appeared to be on incredible form. There is no reason why this couldn't have been activated remotely and that is even more likely as then there is nothing visible

Yes, of all the possible explanations, that just sounds incredibly plausible. I'm torn, though, the one where the guy from the chip shop accidentally left his motorised bike behind, the mechanics accidentally prepped it and she rode it without noticing it was someone else's bike is also pretty difficult to argue against.

On the other hand, the UCI say she was riding a bike with a motor in the race, and...that's it, so far.

They're both the same size and use identical saddles? OK I'm in… (Denial)

Assuming that's the motor/system that's been used?

I'd say crazy-legs is just showing far too much knowledge on this.....

Yup. I'm beginning to think that '[i]crazylegs[/i]' may be a bit of a euphemism for something.

The guy in the local bike shop here has let me test a few of his bikes - I jumped on his Ti Kinesis and road 200Km without any adjustment, so it is possible ..... but rather unlikely

I've not read the whole thread, but I'm going to exercise STW-prerogative and comment anyway.

Seen this?

You're both blokes I presume, you're not an ex-pro (they might not care that much about the mechanics of bikes but they're notoriously fussy about position and saddles), you haven't gone to the trouble of having several thousand pounds of hidden motor fitted to a bike which is now yours.

This is always assuming that the bike is set up the same as her other ones - if not then the whole thing changes and the friend story suddenly becomes rather more plausible. At the moment we don't know - all we do know is that the UCI found a motor in a bike identified as hers in her pit, I doubt they'd checked the riding position at that stage. It might surprise some on this thread who don't seem to have followed closely what I've actually claimed, but I'm not condemning her yet until we know a bit more about the exact circumstances - we do know they found a motor in a bike which was either one she rode or one in her pit, but at the moment that's about it.

Ir_bandito 😯

Not sure what was going on there, neither was the bloke on the infield with the Bald Heeed and glasses.

Maybe these motors are not yet reliable enough......

she does seem to have been happy to use it

We don't know that she was happy. I do know that at 19 if my Dad had told me to cheat I would have been aghast.

Well they've found the Owner of the bike that was identified in her Pits (rather, lent against her Van) He's claimed "all I can say is yes, it's my bike"
The Belgian press were camped out at his doorstep for 2 days whilst waiting to catch him, but he'd been away and only just returned.

So, that that then.

Hysteria over, so's her career, her hard fought years of training, gawd knows what family pressures she's had to endure...

I still want the UCI to Man Up and prove it, show us all what exactly they found instead of hiding behind a vail of thin black cloth they're so keen on. C'mon Cooky, prove to us all that you're not like the other bloke who was in charge of the UCI.
Prove it, stand proud if your evidence is true...link it directly to this athlete please, if you can.

And as for the Girl in question, this will by no means let her off the hook, for the UCI will still make her out to be complicit and either Ban her or impose a strategically (possibly unfair) large fine on her. Which will end her career, financially and competitively.

And then theres the Media trial, already in full force and itching for a pointy finger of blame, for a few hours of social media points.. Then forgotten until it appears on QI or some other Quiz Show, or Xmas Quiz on a Cycling Platform near you.

And the gossip will continue about a new found underhand way of powering your bike, with out your legs.

I still want the UCI to Man Up and prove it, show us all what exactly they found instead of hiding behind a vail of thin black cloth they're so keen on.

I don't know if it's a good thing or not. I see that they are following the process, preparing their case, and will no doubt present the evidence at the appropriate time, which would be at the hearing. I think the outcome of which will then be publicly available.

It is a shame that in the meantime, in the absence of any news, the media hysteria continues.

I still want the UCI to Man Up and prove it, show us all what exactly they found instead of hiding behind a vail of thin black cloth they're so keen on. C'mon Cooky, prove to us all that you're not like the other bloke who was in charge of the UCI.
Prove it, stand proud if your evidence is true...link it directly to this athlete please, if you can.

There's an investigation underway - it could prejudice the outcome of it to go posting photos of the motor, accusations etc.

It's already been linked to the athlete and the rules are pretty straightforward, it's absolute liability. Same as doping, it's up to the rider to ensure they are not putting anything into their bodies that shouldn't be there.

Yes, that does open the door to things like spiked drinks in much the same way that this could lead to a "planted" bike but I imagine that's forming part of the investigation.

I know some of you are saying here career is over. But I'm not seeing that myself, she's only 19, accountable for her actions yes, but also its an age where your easily influenced by family and older people that are around you. A court would recognise that and use it as mitigation let alone a UCI Disciplinary panel. Add all this "not my bike" smokescreen and I'd be very suprised if she got more than a 12 month ban and a fine that she would be reasonably be able to pay.
After that if she's good enough she'll get a ride. Cycling is full of returned cheats of all sorts, not sure why she'll be any different.

[quote=bikebouy ]I still want the UCI to Man Up and prove it, show us all what exactly they found instead of hiding behind a vail of thin black cloth they're so keen on.

I'm still wondering why think there's a possibility that there isn't a motor and they're making it all up? At this point they appear to be completely following correct procedure - part of which isn't to provide all evidence to the media as soon as possible. It's nothing at all like what has happened in the past in the way you're insinuating.

I just think that Bikebouy doesn't like Cookie, his corduroys and now this thin black veil to which he's hiding behind.

No doubt tomorrow there'l be something else he's done or not done that won't agree with him,
I think it's pretty straightforward still, A motor has been found, some form of an excuse has been put forward, both parties meet for a hearing from which an outcome will be presided upon then we can all argue about it,

Should be pretty reminiscent of Captain Blackadders trial shortly after shooting speckled Jim,

Cookie to the accused, AND Can you see the Chip Shop owner anywhere in this court room now, Baaaaaaah