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Interesting thread, my view is that the customer should not be aware of any shortfall in the service or problems you are having. If you have to make a loss on a particular week because of a faulty van or sick guide-- absorb it. Probably a lot cheaper, in the long run.
I guess with an awful lot of holiday firms is they know you are only there for 5 full days . Arrival and departure day is pretty much taken up with airport runs and check in queues etc, same for departure day .
This leaves 5 days in whic to entertain the punters . Its probably easy to fall into a routine and maybe take things abit easy . As an employee in a holiday resort it must be harder to keep professional , whist others are enjoying themselves .
If things to go wrong ( I have been on the recieving end with a ski chalet girl who couldnt even make scrambled eggs ) in 5 days a different group will be along .
Before the intereweb this didnt matter as much , however now with Trip advisor word gets round very quickly .
Same can be said for restaurants / bars in seaside locations . some are fantastic, others rely on the turnover of holiday makers to make enough cash through the summer to get them through winter .
singletrackmind
Sierra cycling actually allow clients to arrive and depart on any day and stay as long as they want. This has been great for us in the past but i would imagine its a nightmare for them
Op all the way 😐
wise words from DS...goes for lie down
Molini Freeride in Italy are fully registered in Italy, and also P.IVA regd (basically the equivalent of VAT). Our bunkhouse is also registered with the local authorities and also the Province. Despite what people assume is a shambolic bureaucracy in Italy, the regulations are enforced - sooner or later! Not only that, many companies that try to operate "under the radar" have been hit by retrospective taxation and fines.
[i]Molini Freeride in Italy[/i]
I believe your fire regulations are particularly stringent? 😉
Ive known Alan and the previous guides Johnny and Dave for a while now and I even showed them so routes further afield, Ive talked with lots of groups who were here on holiday and everyone I spoke to enjoyed there time here in Spain . I am sorry to say you might of been unlucky and a bit unfortunate , I hope you enjoyed the riding we have here as some of it is fantastic ask my mates from Blazing Saddles in Hebden Bridge who have been here 5 years running and have had some great rides on the best natural riding trails theyve ever ridden.
Crikey - Fire regulations! I did a test for the Vigle del Fuoco and passed with merit. On the other hand if you collect mushrooms without a licence, you get your bike confiscated and paraded round the village with a big sign round your neck and ducked in the laghetto using the old stool from Triora.
spanishbarry - I don't think anyone doubts the quality of the riding in the area the issue seems to have been
a) Issues that arose during this particular holiday.
and
b) The rather offhand response that the owner of the business has subsequently given.
My 2p is that you can tell how good a business is when things go wrong (any idiot can deal with eveything going well) - in this case SC have fallen well short of what I would have expected.
Well at least knowone complained about the weather !
Just a couple of points to realise
1 . Finding any guide out here at short term notice is near on impossible and especially one who can speak English and knows the trails.
2. The van hire scenario - Spain is so differant to the UK , if you needed to hire a van at the weekend forget it you might be lucky to find a place open until midday on a Saturday if your very lucky , if you needed to get a hire van in siesta time (2-5) forget it , I dont think Ive ever seen a minibus for hire either , you dont even get 6 seater white cabs here as the local town halls wont issue them a liscense much easier to take two cabs and double the fair.
Your in the height of the season with loads of golfers who have probibly prebooked all the vehicles months ago.
So, in that case, the SC apologises to the customers, explains why they can't sort out a van and maybe offers something in recompense.
2. The van hire scenario - Spain is so differant to the UK , if you needed to hire a van at the weekend forget it you might be lucky to find a place open until midday on a Saturday if your very lucky , if you needed to get a hire van in siesta time (2-5) forget it , I dont think Ive ever seen a minibus for hire either , you dont even get 6 seater white cabs here as the local town halls wont issue them a liscense much easier to take two cabs and double the fair.
You might be lucky to find a place open until midday, I'm afraid is bullcrap. I think most places would be open until midday. Availability at short notice is, of course, another question and as already mentioned the company should really have a contingency plan that doesn't affect the holiday of the paying guests.
Not much money could buy you [url= http://www.segundamano.es/malaga/ford-tourneo-ft-210-s-connect-4p/a27945700/?ca=29_s&st=a&c=39 ]this[/url] contingency plan, or with a little more, [url= http://www.segundamano.es/malaga/land-rover-defender-110-sw-s-5p/a28792445/?ca=29_s&st=a&c=4 ]this[/url] and if I remember correctly there is a guy in Cordoba knocking out both LandRover and Santanas. Not having a spare vehicle is not a good enough excuse, I'm afraid.
just to clarify a couple of points that are being discussed which possibly aren't clear from our respective posts;
1) Alan drove us TO the trail overloaded. His reply suggested he drove us home overloaded at our insistence (hence the comment he made about not letting the other group go first), but we were driven out [i]to the ride[/i] in the morning 9 clients and a driver in a 9 (8 + driver) seater van.
2) the van broke midweek and was always going to be a long term repair as it needed a new alternator which apparently costs 500 euros.
the van broke midweek and was always going to be a long term repair as it needed a new alternator which apparently costs 500 euros.
Long term problem? That, I'm afraid, is cobblers.
I don't doubt that the alternator costs €500, but it's never been longer than a 1 hour job for me to swap out an alternator. This is a commercial vehicle remember, they're designed to have stuff accessible and easily fixable.
So the choice for SC would be:
(1) hire a van for a few days, order the alternator by courier, fix it yourself in the evening - not hard. No-one really notices the issue.
(2) Get the van to the garage asap, get an express order in, get the van back on the road in 24h. Don't hire another van, swap the rest day around so no riding is lost, apologise to guests about the problem, and treat them all to drinks at the local bar for an evening. They'd almost certainly be understanding, and they'd certainly think well of you for sorting out the issue.
Never mind the details, they did seem unprofessional, unprepared and failed to treat paying customers properly. Then to make matters worse, they provided a really bad response online.
No excuse for any of their actions really.
When I was a dive guide we had to cope with boats braking down in the Red Sea, compressors giving up halfway through a fill. All whilst at sea days from land.
One boat even started to sink.
We still had back-up plans and ensured the guests were treated like royalty.
I don't doubt that the alternator costs €500, but it's never been longer than a 1 hour job for me to swap out an alternator. This is a commercial vehicle remember, they're designed to have stuff accessible and easily fixable.
Never dealt with a Spanish garage, have we? Two weeks minimum at a guess. 😉
When I was a dive guide
You were a dive guide? - you should have mentioned it earlier 😉
Wouldn't have the first clue about how long an alternator takes but that was what Alan, at Sierra Cycling said/we were told. Plus the van broke down around lunch time we were riding until at least 1600 so somewhere would've been open after that I imagine.
You were a dive guide? - you should have mentioned it earlier
😆
Best bike holidays are ones you plan youre self. No guides. Just need a map and a bit of local knowledge that you can find on the net
😆
One boat even started to sink.We still had back-up plans
sorted.
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don't forget the:
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LOL @ DavidRussell
Are you lot still moaning on?
Nope....we are laughing at DavidRussell thanks.
I think he needs a bigger boat
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"One boat even started to sink. We still had back-up plans and ensured the guests were treated like royalty."
Am I the only one with an image of the guests having dinner in black tie whilst the water is creeping up their legs as the boat goes down?
Think of a cross between Titanic and Carry on up the Khyber dinner scene. Trimix would be Sir Sydney Rruff Diamond!
😉
Great thread this. Still no word on the use of illegal trails or the guide putting his feet up in a cafe for half the morning?
300
hth x
Good work phil
Trimix earlier 😀
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Ok I'll mention the illegal trails. I've ridden mainly in NE Spain and in several Natural Parks such as Els Ports, Sierra D'Irta, Montseny et al, is there a blanket ban on mountainbiking in these Parks or are there specific prohibitions. I've not seen signs banning bikes but if there was a blanket ban, I guess they wouldn't be necessary, bit like footpath signs not explicitly barring bikes in England and Wales. It must be confusing for foreigners riding here, (not that I've ever met any)
Something about being allowed on the fireroads but not on the paths?
Trimix - MemberOne boat even started to sink.
We still had back-up plans
Did these plans involve issuing the guests with diving equipment and wishing them good luck? 🙂
A back-up plan sounds better than a straight-down plan when talking of boats.
I'm glad Mr MC posted about their experiences with Sierra Cycling - if it had been someone who had just made an account to have a dig I'd be skeptical, but they're forum regulars who seem like fairly sane and rational people*. The owner's response doesn't really do his company any favours in my opinion. :/
* By STW standards 😛
re: cycling in natural parks in spain.
Living in bcn I should abide by this.
http://www.uncomo.com/articulo/normativa-ciclista-del-parque-de-collserola-barcelona-961.html
basically says you can't cycle on anything narrower than 3m.
and you can't do more than 20kmh
dunno if its the same everywhere in spain.
never taken any notice of that myself.
postierich - MemberThere is a free bar
No there isn't, there's a kitty which every guest pays into, as part of the overall cost. TANSTAAFL, but some people get very excited just to get what they've paid for, as long as they don't have to pay for it at point of delivery 😉
it used to be free - maybe not now
I think I went in 2007
I wonder how many rivals are putting the boot in on this thread
The bar was certainly free back in 2003 at S.C. - when i say bar, i mean we were invited to help ourselves to the beers in the large fridge in the kitchen. TBH i don't recall actually having many!
I do think it's a shame how Alan has responded to the OP's comments about their holiday, it doesn't really show him or his Company in the best light.
I have been with them and had a good time with them but it was a long time ago now so i can't comment on if/how things have changed in the meantime. I will say that we were met at Malaga Airport by Alan holding up a sign though. I do hope S.C. can take this onboard and react in a positive manner, it would be a shame otherwise.
Oh the joys of doing business in the 21st century. I can't help but have a little sympathy for SC. I hope they learn from this experience and can bounce back.
TBH don't recall actually having many
the 3 of us managed a case per night - after we got back from the bars 🙂