These are the must have items:
- Minimum 140mm travel
- Aggressive trail geometry, so around 67 degrees HA, 13.5"BB as a guideline (not buying on the basis just of geometry)
- Rated for at least a 140mm fork, ideally a 150mm fork with 160mm a bonus.
- Capable of medium sized gaps/drops, say around 3-4m on a gap, 2m to flat.
- Weight (the really important one) cannot be in excess of 2.7kg (6lbs) with an RP23 or similar. Ideally it would be 2.5kg (sub lbs). Bike weight with absolutely the lightest build possible should be aroiund 26lbs or less.
The good news is there is no restriction on budget, so carbon exotica are in the mix.
Bike use will be aggressive trail riding; fast singletrack, trips to the Peak/Wales/Chicksands maybe a few DH courses thrown in. Home turf is Surrey Hills but the rider (it's not for me) is doing most of the bigger jumps and drops around here.
I'm curious what fits. It's for a mate who currently has a Five Spot but wants to lose weight from the bike. He only weighs 60kgs so there's no opporutnity for him to go on a diet! I've been trying to suggest things but we're running out of ideas other than a Blur TR-C or a Mojo SL-R.
Mojo HD140/160? nomad carbon?
Pivot Firebird or a Pronghorn PR6 Trail with a 36 Fox Float. Except we all know no-one will ever accept that the Pronghorn is epically good simply because it looks a bit special, so just pretend I only said Pivot Firebird.
Orange Five?
It's not the Blur TR-C you want, it's either the LT Carbon or Nomad Carbon. The TR-C is only 130mm travel and 130-150mm fork.
LT Carbon is 140mm, will take a 160mm fork and weighs 6 lbs
Nomad Carbon is 160mm, will take a 180mm fork and weighs 6 lbs
ooooooooh! - could an Orange 5 really do all that, it must be an amazing bike
Sounds like your friend doesn't really know what he wants but...how about a Zesty 914 with offset shock bushings and a 36 set at 140mm?
carbon spicy?
Sounds like your friend doesn't really know what he wants but
😀 Yeah may be the case. To be fair he does know exactly what he wants but we're not sure it really exists just yet.
The Blue TR-C may still be a contender. Current set up is with a 32mm Fox Float 150mm, so the TR-C should be OK.
The Mojo HD has always been my recommendation and one of our group already has one but it's not light enough for him; not compared to what he already has.
pah - was going in with Mojo HD [i want one] !
in fact, i sound like your mate LOL !
[url= http://www.canyon.com/_en/mountainbikes/bike.html?b=2102 ]Canyon Strive[/url] ticks the boxes and you can buy it frame only, but not sure if you can get full build for 26lb, given that their full XTR with carbon wheels comes in at 27.5lb.
Mind you, take off the seatpost adjuster, 10 of the gears and lockon grips and you might get close, but I'd leave it all on (if I wasn't a steel hardtail wheels on ground type in the first place).
in fact, i sound like your mate LOL !
You could be my mate TLR but you'd have to stop making derrogatory remarks about riding in the south east 😉
Seriously though TLR I'm a bit surprised you haven't plucked for a Mojo HD as yet. In 140mm mode it's probably just the bike you're looking for.
Mind you I also think you should splurge £70 and get a set of -7mm shock plates for the AM, then lower the Fox 36 to 140mm and set the CCDB into the third hole down at the back.
Yes the BB is low, around 13" off the ground, but the tune from Stendec on the CCDB is just brilliant and so far I've not had any issues with catching my pedals. Given where you live and ride you may still have problems, but nothing that might not be cured by switching to slightly shorter cranks.
It's a pretty low risk option for you to get a bike that is taughter, faster and more responsive. Switching out the Fox 36 for a Revelation would get you a 29lb trail monster and that's still with a CCDB.
geetee1972Yeah may be the case. To be fair he does know exactly what he wants but we're not sure it really exists just yet.
It could be done, but I'd imagine it'll take a very bling and non standard build. If he could get one, and that's a big if, the stock Whyte 146 works ticks all the boxes and could be made even lighter than stated.
RM Slayer - might be heavier than desired but seems to fit the bill otherwise.
but I'd imagine it'll take a very bling and non standard build
Yeah well he already has that. XTR 1x10 drive train, Fox 32 Floats, Crossmax STs (I still think he should just spunk the money on a set of Carbon Havens and loose, ooh, 200g!), XX cassette, carbon bars, point one stem etc.
BTW Jimjam, are you Jambo from Sussex MTB? Did you buy the Fox forks off of me about 4 years ago? It was an eBay transaction but you popped round to collect.
Turner site suggests that he should be able to get his 5 spot to 25lb? 😕
geetee1972
BTW Jimjam, are you Jambo from Sussex MTB? Did you buy the Fox forks off of me about 4 years ago? It was an eBay transaction but you popped round to collect.
I am not!
The new/imminent Knolly Endorphin?
Turner site suggests that he should be able to get his 5 spot to 25lb?
His Five Spot currently weighs 27lbs 2ozs. The weight saving options he would have over his current build would be:
- Carbon seat post from a KSi900, saves about 300g,
- Easton Havoc Carbon bars to replace the SixC ones, saves about 50g,
- Easton Haven Carbon wheels to replace the Crossmax STs, saves about 200g
- Carbon race face SixC cranks to replace XTRs, saves maybe 50g?
I reckon he could in theory save 1lb if he made these changes, but it would be cheaper to buy a new frame.
Very difficult to get a bike to the weight you ask for and have all the features. My Blur LTc has all the things you ask for but is 28lbs inc pedals (and Adj seatpost). And thats full XTR and Revelation WC XX's.
Neil that sounds like an amazing bike. The Blur LTc is strange in that it weights more or less the same as a Nomad. Personally I would favour the stiffness that obviously imbues in the frame than I would the weight reduction of going with a lighter construction.
There's a chap down here rides a Blur LTc on the Surrey Hills with a similar build except he has BOS Deviles, Carbon Haven Wheels, Formula R1 brakes, XX gears and cassette and carbon cranks, bars etc.
I think that gets to under 27lbs.
yeah those wheels are much lighter than my proII's, I also have Saint 4-pots on mine, so If I changed them to R1's that would save almost a pound.
Don't get me wrong I love my bike, but to get it to the weight you quote would require too much of a compromise in strength/longevity/cost. Would you like to replace a Haven carbon rim???????
Would you like to replace a Haven carbon rim???????
Most likely you'd just exercise the warranty.
Could your mate not bulk up a bit, put on a bit of muscle in order to be able to throw a bike around a bit easier? 60 kilos is nothing.
Unless he's a habitual spender of money, I can't see the point in spending a few grand to save a pound or two when the limiting factor will be him rather than bike.
Why not spend the money & get a few coaching/training days instead.
26lb and 7ft drops to flat? Have you coniddered a trails bike because that all that will fir the bill surely!
Then again, Pitch Pro this year is 29lb. Easton havens, light tyres, I-beam saddle and post is probably -3lb.
Bottlerocket and a dodgy set of scales.
Hob Nob if enough posh types buy this stuff it eventually filters down to us plebs. At this rate, 4 years from now we'll be able to get 25lb 6 inch travel bikes from Halfords for £600...
(In a less mean spirited manner, it's pretty awesome seeing what people can build with some of the new stuff coming out, still for less than a car).
Wait for that new ragley full sus to come out?
Hob Nob if enough posh types buy this stuff it eventually filters down to us plebs
There's a difference to being rich and posh you know. 😀 Besides its amazing what you can afford if you do without a lot of other things.
His Five Spot currently weighs 27lbs 2ozs. The weight saving options he would have over his current build would be:
Why does he want it to weigh less than that? Is he astonishingly weak or something? P'raps he needs a nice ti hardtail instead 😉
There's a difference to being rich and posh you know
Woteva, posh boy. 😉
Anyway, what about the Canyon I originally suggested - did you ignore it cos u iz posh? 😆
Anyway, what about the Canyon I originally suggested - did you ignore it cos u iz posh?
Sorry mate, I think it was a great suggestion. I like Canyon bikes. Will have to show it to my mate.
geetee - i'm still keen on the ibis, but awaiting a demo from inverness shop highland bikes.
they're getting in touch once their demo is sorted.
i'm looking for about a 26.5/27lb build on the 140 set-up.
keep us updated with your mates progress and decision.
for ref, the LTc is still on my radar........ 🙂
mojo slr with cc angle set
odd set of requirements- light weight is the most important aspect?
Spec Enduro Carbon would be my suggestion, meets all the requirements on the surface, though unlikely to be boutique enough in the company he keeps/area he rides 😆
The new Chumba EVO G2? Might struggle to get down to 26LB though.
[url= http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5268/5641645482_601f24c8dd_z.jp g" target="_blank">
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/93388219@N00/5641645482/ ]Chumba EVO G2 White[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/93388219@N00/ ]srbwilson[/url], on Flickr
chumba looks nice there.
OK the bloke is only 60kg, but seriously, what difference is 1lb gonna make overall? 😕
I understand the point of speccing light weight components (where you're not sacrificing strength or quality), but sometimes you just can't have your cake and eat it. 27lb all up is still seriously light for a bike that can do all that is asked of it above, I doubt saving 1lb would make a massive difference at all... Besides, you've not given a full rundown of the spec, I bet that whilst there's some nice kit in there (XTR, Fox 32's etc.) there is easily more than 1lb that could be lost from the spec on the bike without actually spending ridiclulous money. Does he run tubeless for example? What tyres does he run, could he save a bit of weight there?
FWIW the Maverick Durance is 1 140mm travel frame, comes in at 5.5lb inc. shock, hits the geometry req's almost spot on (head angle is 68 degrees with a 520 a/c fork, so might be about 67 with a 545 a/c fork like a 36 or a Lyrik). I've had my (older 125mm travel version) for about 18 months now and I love it to pieces, I don't huck it off things but I don't take it easy on it either (and I'm 80kg not 60).
Besides, you've not given a full rundown of the spec, I bet that whilst there's some nice kit in there (XTR, Fox 32's etc.) there is easily more than 1lb that could be lost from the spec on the bike without actually spending ridiclulous money
Some good points in your post Mboy, largely ones I would agree with, but my mate knows his own mind, knows what he wants and is more than quick enough everywhere to carry it off.
I did put a run down on an earlier post but to make it more easy to read it is as follows:
g
Frame Turner DW 5-Spot (M) 2855
Shock RP23 280
MISC 600
Fork Fox 32 Float 1750
Bars Race Face Sixc 225
Stem Renthal 138
Cranks XTR 526
Chain rings Middleburn 56
Chain device E13 XCX 55
Chain Shimano XTR 275
Rear Mech XTR 176
BB Chris King 80
Seat Specialized Henge Ti 225
Seat Pin KSi900 550
Brakes XTR Race 430
rotors Shimano 160mm 200
Wheels Mavic Crossmax SL 1615
Tyres Schwalbe Nobby Nic 1500
Tubes Tubeless
Pedals Point One Racing 359
Shifter XTR 115
Headset Chris King 98
Cassette Sram XX 205
Rear skewer Mavic 50
KG 12.363
LBS 27.3
I reckon there is about 1lb to save, but it would involve silly money, including Easton Haven Carbon wheels.
Cove hustler? think the frame is slightly over 6lb but has the geometry and will take the abuse..
bottlerocket
Jedi - do you recognise the build? You coached the guy a week or two back.
why you post a pic????
Devinci Dixon, frameset with RP23 and custom build, 145mm travel, 67deg head angle, not sure on bb height. Could be built up around 27lb, recon this is going to be my next bike next months.
Whyte 146 works has all the boxes ticked
I reckon there is about 1lb to save, but it would involve silly money, including Easton Haven Carbon wheels.
He's gonna be wholeheartedly disappointed unless he reigns his needs/wants/desires in a little bit more in line with reality I'm afraid!
First off, how much does he use the dropping facility on the i900 post? Even a Thomson will save about 300g off the weight of that for starters. New Easton Haven bars would save another 50g (but this is getting stupid to be fair!), and then like you say the Carbon rimmed Haven wheels (which is asking for trouble IMO) will save a bit more again.
Now, bear in mind that skill is far more important than the bike you ride, and how much it weighs, and though he is only light (I weighed 60kg too once upon a time not so very long ago), 27.3lb for a bike with 140mm travel both ends and a dropper seatpost is quite frankly bloody remarkable! Most people ride hardtails that weigh more...
And honestly, if you rode a 26lb bike back to back with a 27lb bike, would you notice it? If that extra pound was entirely in the tyres, fair enough, but spread evenly over a number of key components I'd challenge anyone to actually be able to tell the difference without putting it on the scales... Less time obsessing, more time riding methinks, besides his 5 Spot sounds pretty much spot on for what he wants anyway...
Some weight savings to consider:
Fork: Fox 32 Float 1750
[b]Revelation 140 RLTs 1600g[/b]
Bars Race Face Sixc 225
[b]Answer Pro Taper 680 XC Carbon Flat Bar 130g[/b]
Wheels Mavic Crossmax SL 1615
[b]Pro2 with Crest and CX-Rays 1463g[/b]
Tyres Schwalbe Nobby Nic 1500
[b]Continental Speed King 2.4 Supersonic 900g pair[/b]
That's another whole 2lb there!
Frikken LOL...
2 metre drops to flat? Yeh, nice one. (6ft to transition drops you'll be bottoming the bike out, even on a DH bike)
NO 26lb trail bike will survive that well. a dozen in, and you'll be wanting a new frame and wheels.
basically 2 bikes needed.
a LT hardtail (DB alpine TI that might just be produced) for surrey and bouncer for trips away.
everything on the surrey hills is doable on a hard tail anyway and more of a challenge.
thats what we all do - just ride the bouncer once in a while for a change of scene around here.
I saw a few mega equiped Carbon Blur LT and Mojo HD's at the Macavalanche. I spoke to a few of the owners as my mate was really interested in building up a lighter enduro racing machine. Amazing bikes and incredibly close to what I would call XC weight despite being able to take a beasting - I guess you have to think how long they could take that kind of hammering for... and hence if they are the riders only bike or a race-day-special??? I used to think it was a bit of a case where you had to think about if you are willing to live with the risk of breaking a part if you have a wee crash vs. having a stronger and heavier bike which will survive more offs. But it seems these days that that is less and less of a problems as even the light weight kit is far stronger than it used to be. Looking after your bike and checking things before you ride is better than having an overbuilt bike and keeping your fingers crossed.
One comment I remember is that the Carbon Blur LT was preferable to the Carbon Nomad as it was lighter and more responsive - the extra travel of the Nomad made it more of an all mountain cruiser than a sprint and shoot enduro weapon… and I guess that’s the key to riding these superlight enduro bikes: You may lose ground to the bigger bikes in the gnar but you'll more than make up for it on the smooth lines and pedally bits. Fork changes were common, fit a Fox 36/Lyrik if the course requires it or use a 32/Rev if you think you can get away with it as weight saving is substantial.
It had me thinking if I am still overbiked with my current 33lbs AM machine? But then… I'm not an enduro racer and tend to be taking it easy on the smooth bits so I can enjoy the gnar… different strokes for different folks. I'd still like a lighter bike though as it makes a big difference to the rolling bits, and what goes down must first go up.
Flite carbon/Ti saddle = 140g
Formula R1 brakes are much lighter than XTR - and if my Formula RX are anything to go by they will be more than powerfull enough (or go Th1 one with smaller disk a la Nico).
The Whyte is intriguing… have you seen the testing vt?
Messiah, that's an awesome piece of insight, big thanks for sharing that, especially the comments on the Blur LTc versus the equivalent Carbon Nomad. I was always curious about that since the frame weights are really close, something like 6lbs versus 6lbs 3ozs. I guess it shows it's not just about the weight but also about how it rides.