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I'm building up a drum brake rear wheel for use on my Transition Klunker - the coaster brake keeps trying to kill me!
Do drum brakes need to be bedded in like you would with a disc brake? If so, is it just a matter of braking from speed a few times, and then letting the brakes cool off?
I guess they'll be a fair bit weaker then disc brakes, but hopefully less 'skiddy' than the coaster.
Disc brakes don't really need to be bedded in if you just ride with decent braking technique. ie. brake hard when and if required and don't drag them for no real reason. simply riding this way means they will bed in without spending any time faffing about. Mine are always bedded in in less than one descent.
Drum brake braking materials are similar but as the shoes are essentially pushing outwards creating an interference fit in the drum will lock the wheel eventually no matter whether bedded in or not.
Niche indeed!
Only had one on a borrowed tandem. It was already bedded in. It wasn't that weak, but got really hot and would regularly snap brake-side spokes on big hills when really hauling on it hard. That then led to the only real faff - I had to remove it to replace spokes and it needed a very large socket wrench.
You shouldn't have the same issues I would imagine as you'll have less load than our tandem.
One thing I do on classic motorbike drum brakes is to file the edges of the pad material slightly to help it contact the drum, and I also cut a second slot into the middle of the pad to give it another edge to bite on.
No idea if it helps, but it's how me Da taught me to do it, and he learnt it from when he raced scrambles many moons ago...
Have a look on the Cycling UK(ex CTC) forum.
Honestly, they know more about this sort of stuff than you would believe.
Don't know about being an expert, but I have fitted drums to 2 of my bikes and used them for the likes of the StrathPuffer 24 hours.
I also used to tweak my motorbike brakes many many years ago, basically doing what sobriety's father did, and also fitting Ferodo green linings.
I haven't needed to make any modifications to the Sturmey-Archer drum, but it does help to sand down any high spots when new to cut down bedding in time. The other way is to smear some wet grit on the linings, go for a ride, then clean it thoroughly afterwards. 🙂
Like most cable brakes, it's actually the quality of the cabling that determines how good the brake is, so pay particular attention to that.
I recommend using the S-A levers. They're dirt cheap, good quality, and seem resistant to crashing.
Modulation is good, but you do need a firm hand for panic stops.
Things you'll appreciate:
The hub bearings are really good. They spin very freely, and seem very well sealed. Haven't had to touch them.
The linings look like they'll last for ever - mine have done 5 'Puffers and are barely worn.
Use the 90mm for the front - the 70mm is barely adequate there.
Pic of the front hub after 3 'Puffers.
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Cheers for the replies.
Epicyclo - I saw pics of your drum braked Surly when looking for info on what type to buy online. Are the cables/outers that come with the SA hubs ok, or is it worth upgrading?
It's only going to be a drum on the back. The front is either brakeless (it's a Klunker!) or I have the option to fit a disc on the forks I have on it.
Just finished building the wheel. Fitted to the bike, but will have to wait until tomorrow for it's test ride.
If it works well I'm tempted to buy another hub, and fit it to my '97 Indy Fab SS, as it doesn't have disc tabs.
David wraith-Sharman was the man when it came to bicycle drum brakes. He was building floating shoe mods for ages.
As above, blend in the leading edge a bit then ride and brake enough to get the shoe and drum to match curvature. It'll be about ride 3 that the brakes start to feel at home.
There's a good thread here:
forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.pforum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?t=68691
Ps. Weird that I was looking at drum brakes on Wednesday for a build...
The long rear cable is a bit spongy IMO. However as it's the back brake that doesn't bother me over much.
I have been intending to replace part of the cable runs with rigid tubing as I have done on other bikes but I figured I'd do the next time I stripped the bike for an overhaul. However there's bugger all to go wrong on a drum brake singlespeed, so years later, it's still waiting. 🙂
If I had a rear brake only I would do something about the cable, but try it first, it will probably be ok for its purpose.
A 90mm on the front would look good on a clunker. 🙂
BTW disk tabs are handy for use as a brake anchor, I drill the brake reaction arm and bolt it to the disk mount instead of using the clip provided.
on motorbikes as they got older and worn and even new pads were not as well fitting as could be the trick was to shim at the activator (plate that pushes pads out) and/or pivot points so the pads 'stuck out' a bit more
I have a drum brake truss fork that I'm looking to put into service so will be following this thread!
Like to see pics of that fork
cyclesouthwest
Like to see pics of that fork
Like this?
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(Belt drive springer I knocked together from surplus bits)
Had a good ride around the local roads on it last night, and it all works. Not earth-shatteringly powerful, but slows you down. Might try the sanding edges of the brake shoes trick, but I suspect a few rides will help.
I might also invest in some of the proper SA brake levers. The older modelm Avids I have can be converted between long and short pull for cantis/drums and Vs, but I think a longer lever would help too.
I need to shorten the cable and hose a bit. With the fixed cable ends I guess I'll have to cut off the brake end and re-solder the end back on?
I've got drum brakes on an old Moulton, and they're not too bad, although the front brake is slightly grabby. I don't ride the bike much, so I haven't yet got around to looking at it.
I also had drum brakes on a recumbent trike (twin front wheels) and they were a nightmare. There's a need to have left and right brakes balanced, which is managed by adjusting them equally. However, I think some of the hub shells aren't quite round, and (similar to my Moulton) there can be high spots which kick in before the main braking power. The result (with a single brake lever) was a trike which could veer in different directions depending on how hard you braked!
There's a good article here on Brake truing by Greenspeed (a recumbent trike manufacturer). I've not tried the technique myself, but I think it would have cured the problem on my trike. It's definitely worth a go if you're experiencing less than smooth braking.
The Sturmey Archer levers work great for drum brakes because they have a strong return spring.
Ps. Weird that I was looking at drum brakes on Wednesday for a build…
Not weird, we just gave the same impeccable taste 😉
What are you thinking of putting drums on?
The modern S-A drums are a world better than the old ones.
They are stoppers rather than retarders. 🙂
The S-A lever also is nice and long so you can get an entire hand on there if necessary.
That Greenspeed mod is something we used to do with our motorbikes in pre-disk days.
Great ride today....having built the wheel, I then decided to see how it went on my old Indy Fab SS. No disc tabs on the frames the drum is an ideal solution.
20+ miles and a load of singletrack later I'm a drum brake convert 😀
Wheel didn't need a single tweek on the ride, still 100% true (nice to know my wheel building skills are still up to scratch). I went for a 2X build rather than 3X due to the large flanges.
Power was spot on - just enough to slow you down, but not quite enough to skid. I purposefully took it down some of the steeper more technical trails, and it didn't miss a beat. The bike's got XT V-brake levers on it, and with the pivot cam fixed in the lower position it seems to work very well.
I'm going to order another hub and build another wheel, so the Klunker and Indy can both be drummers.
Great thread. Thinking of building a klunker up with drums. Loving the bike, epicyclo and the Indy Fab, Ajantom.
For any would be drum brakers out there, use the 90mm front not the 70mm.
I'd use 70mm for road and tyres up to about 40mm, but the 90mm is much better elsewhere, especially long steep descents with sketchy surfaces - it's easier to modulate.
One thing no one has mentioned is how freely the wheels spin. It reminds me of my old Campag road wheels, just keeps spinning and spinning.
The drum brakes are multiplying!
I kept the wheel on the IF, and have now built another wheel up for the Klunker.
3rd ride out on the IF with the drum brake today, and interestingly half way through the ride the braking seemed to get dramatically better. Probably felt like I had about 1/3 more power.
I guess any high spots on the pads and inside the hub have now evened out and it's braking more evenly.
Don't know why I didn't do this yonks ago. It's given a great old bike a new lease of life 😎
Excellent - I'm glad it's working out.
I have a drum brake rear on my old honda cb100n. It works much better than the cable disk front. There must be some benefit to discs but I recons a well adjusted drum brake works just fine.