[Closed] 27.5 XC Racer? Dont want a 29er....

My riding buddy is 6' 4" and bought an on one 29er just before lockdown. He doesn't like it at all and is spending a bomb re doing his 15 year old Trek 26" xc bike...I would think you need to go s/h or custom....

I think you'll struggle tbh, XC-biased bikes are all 29er now really. What's up with the Scale that you're looking to replace it if it's already the bike you want..?

And why would i replace a perfectly good bike with something ‘inferior’ and more importantly heavier??

Good question
If it ain't broke dont change it
.
[Edit] What he said ^

Its always the lure of a new one.... i have been scanning eBay for another (used) 710 or 700RC 2016/2017 vintage.

I have a 2003 Trek 4900 as a training bike. Needless to say every part of it has been replaced except the frame. Would like to have a newer hardtail XC bike and the scale becomes my training bike (i sold the Cube BTW)

My riding buddy is 6′ 4″ and bought an on one 29er just before lockdown. He doesn’t like it at all

Yep he's a funny one. Bought a scandal in XL and thinks it's a tank.

“ Advice please. Who makes good 27.5XC race machines these days??”

No-one. Not for adults anyway.

“why would i replace a perfectly good bike with something ‘inferior’ and more importantly heavier??”

Because 29” bikes are faster so superior for winning XC races. If you’re not bothered about going faster then you have a good point - save your money, save the planet, ride the bike you have!

Literally nobody makes off the shelf 27.5 race bikes any more. The closest you mare going get is when manufacturers do the "size specific wheelsize" thing where XS and S frames of a given model run on 27.5 wheels e.g. Canyon's Grand Canyon (which isn't strictly a race bike). Even Giant who went all in on 27.5 only do the Anthem and XTC in 29er. Second hand would be your only bet I'd say.

Maybe you might find a Chinese open mould frame in 27.5” with more old style xc geometry - but you may as well keep what you’ve got if it still works.

If you want new / shiny maybe treat it to new forks (sid ultimates are nice - if they make them in 650b) or a bling new set of carbon wheels / fancy groupset?

Trek and Kona still do some small size frames with 27.5" wheels, good chance some other manufacturers do too if you work through their websites.

Its always the lure of a new one…

Sounds like you are setting yourself up for an empty wallet and disappointment TBH.

Yep, keep what you have as it sounds perfect for you. (easy for me to say as I swap bikes, frames a few times a year!) I don't like 29er either but we are in the minority here so have to ride 29er new bikes or 26/27.5 old bikes.

I've wondered what difference a 27'5" actually makes in riding. I mean thats only an increase of 3/4" higher off the ground. Not really that much.

Isla Short used to race one, Silverback iirc.

I think you’ll struggle to find a better 27.5 race bike than the scale. I love mine and I only have the alu version. Spend the cash on nice bits for it 👍

I sometimes idly look at new race bikes and they do 100% seem to be 29ers

Buy a 29er put 27.5" wheels on it.

Looks like we're all on the same page. No 27.5 XC racers anymore. Id like shiney new, but one of the dricvers is i could do with new front forks. We all know its cheaper to buy the complete bike than to buy the bits seperately......

Its got Fox 32 Elite CTD, i'll get a nice set of SIDs for it and then the new wheels....

If lucky enough, like fashion, 29ers will be out and 26/27.5 will be the fashion again!

No offence to Cube owners, but I've never sat on or seen Cube bike that didn't have awful, dated, awkward geometry.

I really wouldn't judge or dismiss 29ers based on one brand.

According to some people on here, if you don't want a 30lb+ 'trail' bike, then you're a 'troll' and an 'idiot' for not listening to them. 😉

I'd quite like a nice, light XC type bike, with wheels that aren't too massive, but they don't seem to exist. I'm more than willing to try a light 29er, but that's not possible right now. As soon as European travel is allowed once more, I intend to go on holiday somewhere with plenty of bike shops, and hire/test a few out over a couple of weeks or so, and then buy one there. This may work out cheaper and easier (and a lot more fun) than trying to source something in the UK. I'm aware some might see this as a 'tax dodge', but that's not the intention; if UK suppliers can't get stuff in, I'm not going to sit around waiting or chance buying something online without having tried it first.

I’m aware some might see this as a ‘tax dodge’,

Not if you declare it to HMRC, as per the rules.

The Cube LTD SL was a nice bike, well equipped. 2 things i didnt like about it was the frame was 'harsh'. Didnt seem to have much give in it. The wheels being 29,i found it wasnt as quick as my 26 or 27.5. Maybe a personal preference, it rolled over the trails well as youd expect, but whats best described as the wheel size rotating mass (best words i can maybe conjure up) it just didnt do it for me. Also The bike just looked BIG. I almost bought a secondhand SWorKS Epic Hardtail, but it was a 29er, and just didnt look right, and after the Cube experiment......

I'll look for XS or S bikes where they are putting the 27.5s on instead of 29s. But still few and far between, and i like riding medium sized frames.
Maybe like Scott offering the 7xx and 9xx ranges for 27.5 and 29 wheels in same models, the juice aint worth the squeeze.... pity.

OP if you fancy spending on a nice light, maybe FS 29er XC bike, we can then do a swap for my 27.5 boardman pro carbon hardtail. Even fitted it with Reynolds black label carbon wheels, and a new SID fork is on its way (non boost front and QR rear makes upgrades like that nice and cheap, if a little harder to find).

I’ve loved it almost to death in the last 6 or so years, but I think 29ers while maybe not better, are at least as good and certainly more plentiful and available. For full disclosure my wife has an Orbea Oiz that I’ve ridden a bit and it’s miles better than the Boardman!

Just pick a 29er/27.5+ frame with a highish bb it will be the same as some 27.5 bikes. There is a massive cross over in geo. Ignore the manufacturer’s stated wheel size and look at the geo.

For example the Santa cruz carbon chameleon with the 27.5+ dropouts has a bottom bracket drop of 47mm. You’d be fine using it with 27.5 wheels.

as per the rules

I wouldn't want to be avoiding the tax on it anyway. I'm assuming I'd not be paying local VAT, and then paying import VAT on arrival? Or; if I pay full price for it (inc local VAT), then use it for a week or whatever, what's the status then? I've never quite understood any of that. And Brexit has made it so much easier to understand, of course. I've never bought anything more expensive than a couple of hundred quid, when abroad.

According to some people on here, if you don’t want a 30lb+ ‘trail’ bike, then you’re a ‘troll’ and an ‘idiot’ for not listening to them.

I think the summary was you're an idiot because you won't try a modern geometry bike before you make up your mind AND seem to think weight is the be all and end all for bimbling about Epping Forest.

bridges

A thread on here about the Bird Aether reveals weights ‘start’ at over 28lbs, and go up over 30! My FSR was a little under 26, and that felt ‘heavy’ in comparison to the Trek hardtail I had, which was about 22lbs. I accept this isn’t really a fair comparison as they are very different bike types, but I’m not seeing any real significant weight loss across bikes. I’m 10.5st, so I don’t need anything super tough.

As was pointed out because in our experience they will climb better than your old FSR but you don't want to try one and keep saying its not possible. Obviously you can't really test it in Epping Forest as there aren't any real hills to speak of but I'm sure plenty of people would have offered you a try somewhere you can.

Im 5′ 5”. Ride medium frames.

Bit of a toss up and something you'd need to try... based on your body shape and size and the specific bike.

I'd share the earlier thoughts on the Cube btw... except different manufacturers tend to have different ideas of "people geometry". Despite having a giant I find they don't fit me well.. my 11yr old son has long legs for his height and I have short legs for mine and my medium XTC (27.5) fits him far better than me whereas a Whyte is always too high for my legs... this goers more or less across the ranges from XC to Enduro so what fits someone the same height as you might not fit you.

At your height I think that makes it EVEN more sensitive on a 29er....

@SSS I've found you a few:

Small & mediums available in either flavour of wheel size:

https://www.polygonbikes.com/product/mountain/syncline-c3/

Created for pro cross-country racers climbing to seize a world-cup podium to racers who are enthusiastic about off road riding.

Those size options are available throughout the range of HT & FS.

👌

Already asked SussedOut Susspension about SIDs they have on their website. The Scale could be getting a nice new front end soon..... I'll keep looking tho. Maybe try a demo day or something, when the world returns to normal and retry a 29er. Try a Scale 920 or something to get a feel.....

I think the summary was you’re an idiot because you won’t try a modern geometry bike before you make up your mind AND seem to think weight is the be all and end all for bimbling about Epping Forest.

Er, I think people simply just didn't understand what I wanted, and suggested something they wanted instead. Which wasn't the advice I was after. Hence why I chose to ignore those who weren't understanding. And the bike won't be just for Epping Forest; if you actually read what I'd posted you'd know this. Oh well.

As was pointed out because in our experience they will climb better than your old FSR but you don’t want to try one and keep saying its not possible.

You really don't read stuff, do you?

I’m more than willing to try a light 29er, but that’s not possible right now

It's actually up there, in black and white. Actual words. That you clearly didn't read. And have you any clue why trying bikes out isn't possible right now? Right. Let's move on.

Just pick a 29er/27.5+ frame with a highish bb it will be the same as some 27.5 bikes. There is a massive cross over in geo. Ignore the manufacturer’s stated wheel size and look at the geo.

This is interesting. I was wondering how much putting smaller wheels on, would affect things. Anyone got any experience of this?

Thanks @QwERTY. USA only and the levelseems to be in line with the Scott Aspect range which is 27.5 available, not same as the Scott Scale range.

Maybe i just need to get taller and heavier......

Er, I think people simply just didn’t understand what I wanted

I'm pretty sure they did... what you wanted is an old school geometry bike that is dependent on weight to climb

and suggested something they wanted instead.

Pretty sure as I said they were speaking from the experience of trying a new geo bike.. and finding out they were wrong. I certainly was...

Which wasn’t the advice I was after. Hence why I chose to ignore those who weren’t understanding.

I don't think you wanted advice though did you? Your responses indicated you wanted someone to agree that modern bikes are heavy and shit.

And the bike won’t be just for Epping Forest; if you actually read what I’d posted you’d know this. Oh well.

I did read and as you'd know if you read then most of us buy a bike for the main use... not the once a year trip or odd weekend etc. (or you buy 2 bikes or you rent a bike on holiday)

It’s actually up there, in black and white. Actual words. That you clearly didn’t read. And have you any clue why trying bikes out isn’t possible right now? Right. Let’s move on.

No clue at all, please explain why you can't borrow a bike from another STWer?
What did I miss?

I regularly ride Epping as my mate and kids can cycle from home....We do a 100 km loop on different bikes from my sub 9lb XC to his FS Enduro. Makes little difference at all except his 120mm travel FS 29er is the comfiest and my lightest XC HT is the least comfy but is more efficient on the road sections but all the modern bikes are comfier and climb better than his old school Epic.

bottom bracket drop of 47mm. You’d be fine using it with 27.5 wheels

My wife has an aversion to 29" wheels so we stuck 27.5x2.4 rubber in her 2018 spark 910 Contessa with a 43mm BB drop.. it did not work. Pedal strikes galore with 165mm cranks.
The Sparks 43mm drop is considered low already.
I'm trying to choose a Chinese carbon frame as a 27.5 kids project at the moment. Everything 'modern' is 29 and I'm trying to get something less than 30mm drop for 152mm cranks.

On another note. My eldest has a spark 700 future pro. It's a regular spark front triangle that as far as I can tell they've paired with the early 27.5 versions rear triangle and linkage giving it a 26mm BB drop and 425mm chainstays
Last year it was available with a carbon front triangle with a 410mm reach so probably only a bit shorter than your current medium.

You may be better seeking a frame. I would suspect *somewhere* has a NOS frame suitable kicking around.

You would have to go pick it up, but:

https://www.cyclery.de/en/gt-zaskar-carbon-pro-275-650b-cross-country-bike-2016-2

Chinese carbon
https://www.carbonal.com.cn/carbon-mountain-bike/carbon-mountain-bike-frame/27-5er.html

No clue at all

Clearly. I think that sums up your 'input'. I have no desire to continue indulging your need for confrontation, and I'm sure everyone else is bored with it too, as it contributes nothing to the discussion. So, if you don't mind, can we just agree to ignore each other from now on? Thanks.

My wife has an aversion to 29″ wheels so we stuck 27.5×2.4 rubber in her 2018 spark 910 Contessa with a 43mm BB drop.. it did not work. Pedal strikes galore with 165mm cranks.
The Sparks 43mm drop is considered low already.

Interesting, and very useful information there.

I regularly ride Epping as my mate and kids can cycle from home….We do a 100 km loop

@stevextc Epping is my local also, I'd be grateful to see your 100km loop?

@matt_outandabout interesting!! Very interesting... thanks.

Kryton
It's an Evans one ... I have it in Komoot somewhere (for reference as my mate knows it all backwards) but might be as easy to search for the Evans Bucks ORS 100km.

If you can't find it I'll see if I can export and put it somewhere for you.

We usually start at Chenies as there is parking (for me) /pub (with beer garden) and the green opposite but its circular so you can jump in wherever you want.

Clearly. I think that sums up your ‘input’.

Um yeah... you said some stuff, its lies and you don't want to go into it ... fair enough.

@kryton57

Let me know if you found the Evans 100km ... I'm away at the moment so it's less simple for me but I can dig it out if you don't find it.

My "quick look in Komoot" I found a modded (60km) version we must have done with the kids or we only had an afternoon or something but I have the original somewhere, its just finding it whilst living in the van.

And why would i replace a perfectly good bike with something ‘inferior’ and more importantly heavier??

Because it's quicker? Or is this a race bike that isn't used for racing?

That was talking about the Spark. Not the Scale.
Yes they are used for racing (10hr, 24hr and Endurance races). But he Spark, thats FS, i much prefer hardtails. So in a law of diminishing returns, no point replacing it. The new ones may be quicker, but probably marginally. So as someone said earlier, no point lightening my wallet.

And why would i replace a perfectly good bike with something ‘inferior’ and more importantly heavier??

Because it’s quicker? Or is this a race bike that isn’t used for racing?

i much prefer hardtails

Well, this is what is confusing. If you want an XC race bike, you want whatever is faster. The reason everyone switched to 29ers was because they are faster. They may be slightly heavier, but weight isn't the only consideration in speed.

Same goes for suspension bikes. Hardtails sprint well on smooth surfaces, but suspension bikes let you stay seated and keep pedaling over rougher terrain. Hardtails feel fast, but the only thing that matters if you are racing is the stopwatch and good XC suspension bikes are faster on rougher courses.

Unless you want a race bike that is more fun to ride but reducing your chances of winning.
A "taking part" bike if you will.