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Got a cinelli experience on the way (for a summer evening blast round the lake'bike) and am considering groups. Is 105 £110 better than tiagra? Obvs it goes up to 11 but apart from that does it feel/shift any better? I want 105 purely for the shame factor of using tiagra but wevew just bought a new house so cash is tight....... What do we reckon?
For £110, I'd buy the 105. Tiagra isn't £110 less in terms of performance, but that extra cog on the back really means you can have your cake and eat it when it comes to cassette ratios having both the range and close spacing where it counts. Tiagra 4700 works brilliantly, but typically the 10spd cassettes have an annoying ratio gap somewhere, or you miss the 11T off the top end...
However, if that doesn't bother you, then aside from it being 10spd vs 11spd, Tiagra is practically indistinguishable from 105 in use.
I have a bike with 4700 Tiagra on and it works just fine, *however* it seems to be something of a mongrel - 10 speeds, but 11 speed cable pull ratio, so AFAIK there is no easy "upgrade" path without junking the lot (I'm not bothered, but you might be).
(Oh, and I've ditched the 11T sprocket for a 12T - I missed the 13T too much).
no easy “upgrade” path without junking the lot
Since it's the same pull ratio, why wouldn't 5800 shifter work with 4700 mechs (with the appropriate cassette) and 4700 shifters with 5800 mechs?
But this may be irrelevant to the OP, as he's considering groupsets. Personally, if I were in doubt over spending extra £100 on parts, I would probably look at pre-owned.
Just a word in terms of function: I have 4700 Tiagra on my CX/Commuter and it has been absolutely faultless in terms of function for 12 months. And while it may be that you, personally, miss the 11th cog, the fact is, I have even taken mine off-road on what would generally be considered an MTB route, and I was far more concerned about my tyre width (they were too narrow) than about any missing gears.
I have a bike with 4700 Tiagra on and it works just fine, *however* it seems to be something of a mongrel – 10 speeds, but 11 speed cable pull ratio, so AFAIK there is no easy “upgrade” path without junking the lot (I’m not bothered, but you might be).
I thought the whole point was it's pretty much interchangeable with all the other 11 speed stuff i.e. the 4700 rear mech can talk to 105/Ultegra shifters and do 11 speed, or you could run an 11 speed 105/Ultegra mech with the 4700 shifters on a 10 speed cassette if you wanted...
The thing is it will definitely cost you more than that £110 to bump up to 11 speed 105 later if you decide to, so is it worth the difference?
I'd say so if you can stretch to it, it sort of is, but Tiagra is a decent group and has plenty of range for most people and if that's what your budget dictates then crack on.
This is all very interesting (no really, it is). Without wishing to hijack the thread I'd appreciate some advice from the experts here. I've got an old Tiagra shifter (pre 4700) doing 1x10 with a SLX 9sp rear mech. What's the cross compatibility with newer shifters? ie will 4700 do the same with the MTB mech or do I need to re-think? Also I've got newer shifters (possibly 4700) on another bike and the cable discs are significantly better. Did they alter the brake cable pull too?
105 is very good. It replaced ultegra 6700 on my ’good’ bike, and was a significant improvement
on that basis I’d spend the extra!
Anything is an improvement on 6700 ultegra 😉 . Personally I like 10 speed, but if you are running a compact, you get to run 11-28 instead of 11-25 for the extra cog, which will suit all year. That might be useful if you only run one set of wheels, or it’s hilly.
If you are looking at group sets and are on a tight budget, not bikes, personally I’d go for used Ultegra 6600 (about £150). This is the best shifting groupset per pound, provided you don’t mind the external cables.
I run bikes with Tiagra 4600, ultegra 6500, 6600, 6700, 6800, dura ace 7800 and 9000. No 105, but it is basically 6800. 11 speed shifts better than internally cabled 10 speed and 6700 is terrible. I suspect the new Tiagra has the 11 speed cable routing, but only 10 speed for marketing reasons.
Thought about second hand and have an old (square taper so very old) 105 chainset to build around but tbh I'd prefer new. Have put together most of my bikes from scavenged bitsband bobs but for this one I'd like it to start with everythig matching. Need to get some overtime in!
In that case, if you are on a tight budget, I'd get a used 6600 groupset. Shiny looks nicer in my opinion. You could even get Dura Ace 7800. Avoid the later 10 speed because the cable routing is not great.