[Closed] 1 x10 or 2 x 10??

36/11 is a good top gear for offroad riding though a bit spinny on the road at times (but then it's a bike for offroad...). 36x36 may or may not be too big a gear for you depending on your fitness and what you ride which only you can really comment on...

What kind of bike is it?

Light XC goat or heavy 8" travel monster?

How fit are you?

Try cycling it about just in the middle ring for a few weeks. 1 X n is the better option if you can do it, IMHO a 32 chainring and 11-36 cassette is the optimal 10 speed setup, spinning out isn't a big deal and doesn't happen that much off road, and 32/11 is fast enough for a MTB even onroad unless you are doing a multi-day tour. 32/36 will give you an 'underdrive' for that last long hill on a 7 hour ride, IMHO more likely to get used.

Does anyone make Shimano compatible 22, 34 or 36 tooth chain rings? I imagine Shimano will make a 36 for the trekking market.

Could a freehub handle the load exerted by a 22/36 gear combination?

I don't get this 1x9, 1x10 stuff. You lose a shifter at the expense of lots of gears, doesn't seem like a worthwhile exchange.

It does if you don't really need those gears and it's not a lot of gears - usually just two at the very top/bottom of the range. If I was a bit fitter, I'd reckon that 1x10 would be spot on for me.

Especially if you wait for the Hope 9-36 cassette, should be all the gears you need.

I've gone 1x10 with a 36t ring and 11-36. Wouldn't personally fancy a 32t, would be undergeared. As others have said though it depends how fit you are and what, how and where you ride.

I'm on a light XC race bike, and I'm reasonably fit.

I don't get this 1x9, 1x10 stuff. You lose a shifter at the expense of lots of gears, doesn't seem like a worthwhile exchange

[b]Losses:[/b]
the three lowest ratios over a 2x10.

[b]Gains:[/b]
No shifter
No cable
No derailler
Less maintenance
Cheaper to run
2 fewer chainrings,
4 fewer chainring bolts.
shorter chain
more mud clearance
fewer mud traps
less thinking
less faff

Bimbler - I don't get this 1x9, 1x10 stuff. You lose a shifter at the expense of lots of gears, doesn't seem like a worthwhile exchange.

You loose about 450 grams of Heath Robinson noisy annoying front deralleur mech and associated bits:

2 chainrings
front deralleur
cable
shifter

You loose maybe 5 or 6 gears, 3 at the top, 3 at the bottom, which are all used less than 4% of the time, and which can be lived without with surprisingly little problem.

You gain much satisfaction of having a simpler drivechain, more ground clearance, less cables and bar accessories, less noise, less maintenance, cleaner looking bike, a reasonably large weight saving, simpler shifting...

which are all used less than 4% of the time

That sounds like a well 'calculated' statistic!

4.51% by my calculations...

Lies, damned lies, and statistics!

It was approximately 52% a guess.

Losses:
the three lowest ratios over a 2x10.

Gains:
No shifter
No cable
No derailler
Less maintenance
Cheaper to run
2 fewer chainrings,
4 fewer chainring bolts.
shorter chain
more mud clearance
fewer mud traps
less thinking
less faff

So why do Shimano make a triple chainring for the new stuff at all 😕

Because whilst it is only a small loss in range it is a loss in range. More overweight Weekend Warriors would be annoyed to pick up their £5000 bike only to find they can't ride up as big a hill or pedal on the road as quickly as they used to be able to, and would likely not appreciate the advantages.

Gains: Chain device
or
Gains: sore knee/shoulder
possible lossses: teeth. (a childs face)

😉

Especially if you wait for the Hope 9-36 cassette, should be all the gears you need.

thered So why do Shimano make a triple chainring for the new stuff at all

Because 27 gears > 9 gears, 30 gears > 10 gears. In the punters mind, more is better, it is easy to sell more. Plus the 3 x n configuration is 'just the way things are done'. It is easy, both for the manufacturer and the rider. Who is going to stick their neck out and make a production 1 x n bike, and loose a whole bunch (majority?) of sales to other bikes?

So, unless there is some kind of an epiphany in the general public on the advantages of dropping that nasty bit of bent sheet metal and wire string that is a front deralleur, 3 x n will be the standard for some time to come, I feel. 1 x n will remain with the other niche drivetrain layouts such as belt drive, hub gears, and singlespeed - something that a rider moves onto after becoming dissatisfied with the standard 3 x n in some way. Vive la difference!

Plenty of bikes (everything high end SRAM equipped) is 2x10 now, but yes I agree with your comments. Bikes are aimed at the mass market, not the relatively few who would be happy with a single ring set up.

njee20 - I've gone 1x10 with a 36t ring and 11-36. Wouldn't personally fancy a 32t, would be undergeared. As others have said though it depends how fit you are and what, how and where you ride.

I'm on a light XC race bike, and I'm reasonably fit.

I run 11-32 with a 32 chainring, and don't feel undergeared. The only difference between the setups is you being able to run a 36-11 ratio (3.27) against my 32-11 (2.9).

32-32 is a one to one ratio, 32-36 is 0.88. If I was to go 1 x 10, I think I'd prefer the lower gear for keeping me going on longer days / climbs, than the taller gear for going marginally faster on flat smooth roads. However, being limited to the one to one ratio hasn't really bothered me yet, so perhaps 36-36 would be better, guess I'll have to try it and see!

I am also on a light XC bike, and am reasonably fit (on a good day with a following wind 🙂

Knowing you mansell I'd go for 2 x 10 as you are quite weak 🙂

I use 1 x 10 with 36 upfront and 36 x 11 at the back. Just man up.

32-32 is a one to one ratio, 32-36 is 0.88. If I was to go 1 x 10, I think I'd prefer the lower gear for keeping me going on longer days / climbs, than the taller gear for going marginally faster on flat smooth roads. However, being limited to the one to one ratio hasn't really bothered me yet, so perhaps 36-36 would be better, guess I'll have to try it and see!

Yes, thanks for that, personal though, which was the point. I don't feel the need for lower than 1:1, whilst regularly use the 36/11. I do often ride 7 miles to/from the trails on the road, when it's useful. Used the 36/11 racing at Sherwood and Dalby too, which is 2 out of 2 nationals this year. Not saying 32/11 wouldn't be enough, but personally 36 seems to suit me better.

No I understand 2x10 and if I was in the market for more than a single gear I'd prolly go that way. It's the 1xthing I don't really get, you lose a shifter but need a chain device, so the net loss is a shifter and a cable and a chainring (or two), seems like a worthless compromise versus gears.

The chain device thing is appropriate if you ride long and hard trails that bounce your chain off. If that doesn't happen then it don't matter.

Not saying 32/11 wouldn't be enough, but personally 36 seems to suit me better.

I think you've hit the nail on the head with that comment.

I've seen you ride and I know how fit you are so I can well understand the need for a 36 front by 11 rear.

I think the point that was also being made though is that downhill or along fast twisty singletrack, you're never going to be anywhere near the limit on a 36 by 11 and so a 32 by 11-thirty whatever, gives you less compromise on the climbs.

This of course assumes that you're not fit enough to be spinning out at 36t by 11t. Personally I'm not a weekend warrior but my bike is on the heavy side and so I want both the lighter weight of a 1x10 set up and the higher gear afforded by a 36t rear cog.

I know I'm not slow downhill and I've yet to be ever undergeared on a downhill section on even a 32t by 11t set up.

The point is that if you're going 20mph already (which is about 90 rpm on a 32t by 11t set up) then chances are it's either really steep, in which case you can have more speed just by letting off the brakes) or it's a fire road, in which case I'm not too bothered about speed.

I've been on DH courses where there were fast open sections that really needed a much bigger gear, but you don't tend to find these outside of places like Molefre or the Alps. So for me, like 7hz, 32x11 is more than big enough.

I found 32x11 fast enough for MTB, just a bit slow if you include lots of flat road/gravel track sections. Currently got 34x32-11.

I forgot that you may find you need a add top chain guide ~50g (I did). But that much lighter than a derailler.

I'm also 3 x 10 but looking to go double & bash. Do you need a 10sp specific 36T chainring?

It's going to be on a blur lt2 and i ride in the alps with very little road. I'm thinking on advice to go for single ring and then 32t and 34t? think i should be covered fairly well with these. I think one of those simple top chain guides like mrp, or e13 are doing will be spot on too. Thanks everyone

The MRP one is pants. The backplate is quite thin and not very stiff. The consequence of this is that when the chain derails from the lower part of the chainring (and it will do) the backplate can get pushed inwards and the chain subsequently jams between the backplate and the chainring.

This is a right faff to put right as you then have to push the backplate further inwards in order to get the chain cleared past the guide itself. This warps the metal on the backplate, making it more likely that the chain jams over time.

The e13 doesn't suffer this problem because the backplate is about 50% thicker and therefore stiffer.

For ridingin the Alps, I think I would miss my granny ring. I've ridden in the Alps several times on a 1x10 set up but this is still only a once or twice a year thing.

I ride in the alps year (9 months) round. I am more than happy to take a little bigger gear and have much less maintainance, more chain security and simplicity.

As for 'Big enough Gear' I race european Enduro's hence why I use a slightly bigger gear but the benefit of the 36 x 36 is you get 1 2 1, you get bigger gears with less chain slap and you get more top end speed whilst still being able to pedal up pretty much anything. Granted, you do need to be quite fit and if you ride as a guide you would probably want the granny for the 'dark' days. I ran 1 x 9 with 36 x 32 and it was hard but doable, so 1 x 10 in 36/36 is like a dream.

I ran 1 x 9 with 36 x 32 and it was hard but doable, so 1 x 10 in 36/36 is like a dream.

I think that's a very interesting observation. 1x10 36/36: the MTB gearing of the future?

and I think 36 x 36 is easier than my Compact road cassette on Road bike on alpine climbs. For me its great but I can understand how its not for everyone 😉

1x9 here, running 32 up front with an 11-32 cassette, can winch myself up most climbs and it's definitely improved my pedaling as I don't have the granny to fall back on. Will probably change over to 10 speed 11-36 with a 34/36 up front as things wear out.
I'm running a full chain device (superstar plasma) so haven't saved much weight, but the chain is secure and I have good ground clearance (bike is a blur 4x, low bb so this was an issue before), besides the bike isn't a light weight and neither am I so it's not really noticable 🙂

and I think 36 x 36 is easier than my Compact road cassette on Road bike on alpine climbs. For me its great but I can understand how its not for everyone

Well yeah, my bottom gear on my road bike is 39/25, but road climbs aren't nearly as steep as off road ones! I don't think you can really compare the two.

My own setup is 2 X 8 at the minute 36/22 with an 11-30 Cassette, When I had 32/22 I found the top 11-32 just wasn't tall enough and I would be spinning out on the odd descent where I knew I could go faster, 36 suits just right for that, climbing gear wise it tops out at ~19 "gear inches"

quick run down of the choices you presented:

1x10 - 34 /11-36 will give you extremes of 80.3 - 24.5 gear inches
1x10 - 32 /11-36 will give you extremes of 75.6 - 23.1 gear inches
2x10 - 36/22 -11-36 will give extremes of 85.1 - 15.9 gear inches

you'll get a very good, wide range form a 36/22 - 2x10 if it's a bike you expect to pedal up and down everything then that's not a bad idea, 1x10 with the 34 tooth ring will give a good range, though maybe a little tall,if you are a strong, fit rider you will probably get it up most things with a 32t ring but you might find 32-11 a little too low and that it spins out on faster descents...

Surely 36/36 is just the same as 32/32?! So much for the new world!

Yes, yes, I know you don't get the 36/11 gearing - thats what outer rings are for!

Personally I need my granny gears. Like you can never be too thin or rich you can never have too low a gear.

But then I like to spin my way up hills and hate to push

cheers RHSno2 think I'm gonna just see how I do with 34 x 36 at back and if I find that I spin out on some of the faster descents then i have a spare 36t that I use. Was gonna just use a middleburn 34t ring up front with e13 chain device by the looks of it!

For those that are interested I have done a very small review on the new blur LT with 1 x 10 drive on my blog. Check it out if you wanna see some pictures of the new build. Very impressed

http://mansell-mountainlife.blogspot.com/2011/06/santa-cruz-blur-has-been-ridden-in.html

mansell - Member
It's going to be on a blur lt2 and i ride in the alps with very little road. I'm thinking on advice to go for single ring and then 32t and 34t?

Well from your blog you seem happy so why change. I run a 2x9 double and bash with 36/22 up front and 11/34 out back on my LT2 and reckon it's the perfect combo for my Scottish highlands riding which reasonably regularly includes 1000m+ days.

I need 22/34 for cranking up long steep climbs like Carn Ban Mor so assume you would need something like that in the Alps. I also would not like a lower top end than 36/11 as there are always some fire road runs and actual road work where 34/11 would spin out too easily.

Have not had any problem with the chain coming off as the bashring keeps it in place, so no chain device needed

buzz-lightyear - Member
I found 32x11 fast enough for MTB, just a bit slow if you include lots of flat road/gravel track sections. Currently got 34x32-11

I think you may be confusing mountain biking with riding round forests on fire roads 😆

Yeah I do some fairly regular 1000m days but my riding is based more on getting to the start of a decent descent rather than riding technical climbs. I am very happy with the whole bike and gearing so far and have only lost the chain once with the top guide so no need to change that.

What about Shimano's 1999 patent for what seems to be a 1x14 system? 11-39 rear cassette, funky new style of narrow chain, no repeated gears, no front mech and perfectly spaced ratios:

http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/originalDocument?CC=US&NR=6039665A&KC=A&FT=D&date=20000321&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_gb

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