I’m moving job soon, which means for the first time in 5 years I won’t be able to walk or cycle to work (boo!). Presently, I rarely use our second car, but will be doing circa 80 miles a day, most days a week, for the foreseeable future, so a decent reliable auto is a must.
There’s nothing wrong with our current car – an Astra 1.6i petrol, it’s just that hopefully I’ll make a significant fuel saving on a smaller, small vol diesel engine?
I’m looking at the VAG group as I like them, and can DIY stuff on them relatively easily.
My preference engines are the 1.4 tdi (70-80bhp) and the 1.9 tdi (100bhp), in something like a fabia/ibiza.

Anyone got any real comments on either of those engines, good or bad?
There seems to be lots of 1.9s around, less 1.4s… Is there a massive fuel economy difference, and will the 1.4tdi get the >60mpg advertised?
Hopefully neither will be underpowered for mainly motorway driving, but will the 15bhp difference make the 1.4 unbearable???

Cheers,

DrP

1.4TDi is pretty good, especially if you get the 90bhp version. 75 version isn’t quick, but is economical.

Will you get 60+ from one? Yes if driven mainly on open flowing roads. But you’ll get well over 50mpg from a 1.9 in the same conditions anyway.

Can’t comment on the 1.4, but when looking for a cheaper to run replacement for my Puma, I was looking at VAG motors, and I test drove a 90bhp 1.9TD VW Bora, which was horrible. W reg £6k, and it just seemed sluggish, so the next car was an Octavia 1.9 TDi, 110bhp. What a difference, 51 plate, £5k, went like the clappers, really comfortable, ginormous boot, lovely car to drive. Still got it four years on, £110pa tax, and on a long 240 mile motorway trip to get a new set of wheels I saw 63.5mpg indicated on the computer. I get around 450-500 miles out of a tank, but that’s mostly local short distance stuff; I rarely get a chance to do a long, steady drive, so I don’t know how much I could really get out of it. The only issue I’ve had, that’s just been resolved, was an irritating loss of power at around 2200rpm. Had it looked at, ok for a bit, then went wrong again. This time I had the air flow meter looked at, which was out of range, which seems to be a common-ish fault. The other problem is one that probably wouldn’t be an issue for you, but was probably due to my low local milage; the turbo waste gate was sticking closed, causing loss of power. A good soaking with WD40 and other releasing agents has brought the power back.
Good engines, good cars.

Can’t comment on the 1.4, but when looking for a cheaper to run replacement for my Puma, I was looking at VAG motors, and I test drove a 90bhp 1.9TD VW Bora, which was horrible. W reg £6k, and it just seemed sluggish, so the next car was an Octavia 1.9 TDi, 110bhp.

Weight is the key here. Bora is a heavy car (1300kg+), so 90bhp is gonna be a struggle in it. I had a 90bhp Passat briefly, now that was SLOW!

In a smaller lighter car, 90 or even 75bhp is more than sufficient. And it will of course be more economical too.

If they are anything like the 4 VAG diesel engined cars I was behind on my way to work, they will belch out black smoke on every touch of the throttle!!

Oldest was a 05 plate 😮 How the hell do they pass the Euro 4/5 test?

If I floor the throttle in my 56 reg diesel there is not the slightest whiff of soot/smoke yet I constantly see VAG & Merc oil burners doing exactly that??

I have a 1.9Tdi 130bhp Ibiza, love it… decent enough fuel economy & goes like a bat out of hell

I generally return ~40mpg with bikes on the roof on a motorway run

I have had an average 59mpg out of it on a 16 mile run down an A road, barely tickling the throttle and brakes

I reckon the 100bhp will be good if you like to drive with enthusiasm, the 1.4 will be ok but not much more than that I suspect

The 1.4 should cruise well once up to speed but overtaking might take a while

Sorry, but spending £££’s on a new car to save money on fuel doesn’t make sense to me, unless either it doesn’t cost you anything to change car, or you sell the old one for more than the new one costs.

On my 5th VAG Diesel and they’re tremendous granted they’ve all been 2.0TDi so can’t comment on how they’ll compare. Going to order another in a few weeks.

I have a PD 1.9 GOlf 100 – love it, have driven a few VAG CR TDI’s as well and although they are quieter and a bit more powerful, they also appear to be less reliable than the lower powered PD engines.

I average 50mpg in summer and about 45 in winter in my car. mixed driving, but I do drive slow and use the engine as much as possible.

1.9 TDI PD 150 in a Seat Leon. Has been a brilliant engine which has bags of power and torque and easily gets 50mpg+ on longer journeys and mid-40s on shorter ones. Only issue has been the air-mass meter needing replaced due to the power dip alluded to by CountZero.

just be careful of the dual mass fly wheel, mine went after 50k and cost circa £900 🙄

What about LPG conversion on the Astra. If it is any good please let me know as i am thinking of doing the Merc.

80 Miles a day – Are you working over here?

i’ve got a 1.4 A2 tdi, which normally gets 65mpg on combined or 55mpg urban. it’s an older 75bhp version, which seem to be more reliable as no dmf or vvt. It is a very light car though, so ymmv on other models with the same engine.

80 miles a day, presumably 5 days a week, so 400 miles/week.

Petrol cost in the Astra @35mpg and £1.30/litre = £68

Diesel cost in an unspecified diseasel VAG @ 50mpg and £1.35/litre = £49.14

Saving of £19/week is not to be sniffed at, but absolutely not worth changing the car for. Bear in mind you’ll pay a premium for the diesel car over a petrol model, so your net saving will be very small indeed.

If you were thinking of changing the car anyway, then it makes more sense, but I’d be tempted to try it for a month or so and see how the Astra does. On a long motorway run you’ll probably be closer to 40mpg anyway, thus narrowing the cost differential still further.

4ndy B – Member
I have a 1.9Tdi 130bhp Ibiza, love it… decent enough fuel economy & goes like a bat out of hell

I generally return ~40mpg with bikes on the roof on a motorway run

I have had an average 59mpg out of it on a 16 mile run down an A road, barely tickling the throttle and brakes

I reckon the 100bhp will be good if you like to drive with enthusiasm, the 1.4 will be ok but not much more than that I suspect

The 1.4 should cruise well once up to speed but overtaking might take a while

I’ve got the same – 1.9TDi 130bhp Ibiza. Fantastic car – I love it. Big(gish) engine in a small car, plenty of poke & economical. 70mph = 1800rpm or so.
I test drove the 100bhp version as well and to be honest that was perfectly capable, but I decided on the extra grunt of the 130 version and sacrificed a few mpg.
On my mainly A-road journey to work, I can easily get 55mpg out of it, and recently have been driving like Miss Daisy and have been getting around about 62-64mpg out of a tank.
I bought it with 24k miles on it @3 years old and it’s now got 162k miles on it (so I’ve put on 138k miles in under 5 years).

My sis has got a Polo with the 1.4TDi in it, although I don’t know the output it is pretty nippy. Don’t know about economy or outright performance though. She regularly uses it for long drives loaded with children & a full boot, so I think motorway miles don’t really phase it.

Using the fuel economy calculation above, but putting in a more realistic figure of 55mpg (will be more for the 100bhp version) – you are looking at about £44.60 in diesel, so the weekly saving will potentially be more like £23.
Obviously depends on what you are currently getting out of the Astra.

You need to tie in any fuel saving with the cost to replace. You mention that there’s nothing wrong with your current car. What would be the cost to replace & how long before this was recovered by the fuel saving?

Right, well let’s see. There are lots of different versions of these.

Pre 1997 they are plain old TDI with a basic computerised injection system – these are reliable, as long as you change the cam belt!

1997 til around 2004 ish depending on which VAG brand and car, they are the older PD engines. These are the ones that deliver a massive slug of torque from 1200-3500 rpm and then nothing. To make progress as fast as possible you shift well before the red line. Some find this annoying, but having all the torque concentrated means that in that band (ie where you do all normal driving) all you need to do is ease down slightly on the pedal and regardless of gear or road speed you just get flung forwards – good fun 🙂 My Ibiza 1.9 was like this, 53 plate.

Then they added electronic injector control to the PD engine, which is where the 2.0 TDI comes in. This was between 2005 and 2008 on Passats I think. They have a much flatter torque curve, my Passat pulls well up to the vicinity of the red line, building all the time. Not as much of a bonkers slug of torque low down though. They sound less clacky but fairly weedy like a coin in a matchbox. Commonly comes in 140bhp which is a nice useful amount of power without being silly imo. I think Seat changed their cars over to this engine later, based on the test drives I did. Some batches of these from certain factories had catastrophic oil pump failures after 40k miles or so leading to engine death. This was recalled, and any surviving engines do not have this issue. You can find exactly which engine numbers are affected online. There is also some suggestion that the injectors are not as reliable – but some say this is the just wiring not the injectors – despite some garages changing all the injectors anyway. My car had some slight stuttering on very light throttle, cold engine, low speeds when I got it – now after lots of long motorway trips and some ragging on the autobahn it’s amazingly buttery smooth. Diesels really love being ragged.

After 2008 they have common rail engines. I have only driven one in a van but it was buttery smooth. No clacky clacky at all, just a lovely hum. However the van was so under powered I can’t make any claims about power distribution.. there really was none to distribute 🙂

Oh for info – my Passat is a 2006 2.0 TDI saloon with the DSG auto, and I get 52-54mpg on long trips including 80mph motorway driving, and even as much as 63mpg occasionally on the trip to work which is part motorway and part 60mph open road. Not bad for a big auto 🙂

I was never impressed with my “1.9 tdi pd 115bhp” engine in a mkIV Golf. Economy wasn’t that great, about 45mpg. i bought it with 80k miles, at 110k it blew its head gasket. Garage had seen a few others too. Think they can be quite variable in terms of quality and economy.

Wca, working in portsmouth, but living in worthing!

I’m sure a 1.4 would return more than 50mpg, making the fuel difference more substantial. Also, tax would be half the price.
Insurance very similar…
Plus I’ll be driving 7 days on, 2 off, so mileage will be more per week too….

on one hand this is a financial decision, but also for work in the long run, a smaller cart would be useful, plus I kinda fancy a new car (well, new to me) if I’m going to be driving long miles….

Will look into it some more!

DrP

Cruise control, set at 70mph, you’ll do well.

My brother is a motor engineer in Detroit (he headed the team that built Hummer 2) and last year he came over to the UK and hired a 2.0 Tdi Passat Estate. He was gobsmacked by the car, saying it was as close to perfection as he’d ever driven in cars of that type.

I have a Passat B6 and in 3 months I’m getting the new B7, this will take my CO2 from 156 gms/km to 120, saving me £135 a month. Can’t complain. Brilliant car, I’ve had 4 bikes and 4 passengers inside it and regularly do 3+3.

I’ve been doing VAG for 14 years now.

They’re never temperamental, go like a train, are cheap to run and are low maintenance.

Quite unlike (most) beautiful women! 🙂

i wasnt going to comment, but driving along today i thought i might anyway.

i REALLY do like my HDi 🙂

2L Turbo engine that went in ALL the diesels, from the big vans and cars through to my pokey little 206.

returns 55mpg NO worries. Only 90bhp, which i would prefer to be 110, but cant say it affects the drive, and it tugs the tiny little 206 along plenty quick enough if you short shift the useless lower gears and use the torque in 3rd and 4th instead. its only noticeble when i jump in the bosses 130bhp mazda. (which, thinking about it, is tight as a drum after 130k of abuse)

i think you will pay more for a VAG, and im not convinced i can see where the extra money goes. (though im sure people will disagree)

2001 Passat 1.9 PD 100bhp . 266K on the clock.
I have a 32 mile drive to work B roads, A3M , A3 , A272 . Get 52 – 54 mpg on the way to work, uphill and cold start , cooler ambients. Can get 58 – 62 mpg on the way home. This does involve very careful driving and gentle throttle applications.
My bro had the newer TDI 140 version and never got it over 50mpg.
He had a Golf 130pd which was superb . Fast if you wanted it, or very economical if neccessary. Not huge , but big enough. The 150’s were abit less reliable , and economical.
Polo sdi for 70mpg if you want maximum miles per gall. Rare tho.and slow.

I’ve also got a 1.9tdi 130bhp ibiza fr and am averaging 60mpg per tank (calculated), 63ish on the display and regulary over 70 on a good run. The 100bhp version will do more mpg as well. The 1.4tdi i drove was fine unless you really want to blast around.

As said before though your best bet for now is run the astra until it goes bang, the depreciation on a newer car will more than outweigh the fuel saving.

VAG diesel engines – opinions

Good, not as reliable as you might hope, chuffing expensive to fix. ~(1.9 tdi in 95 Seat, 1.9Tdi in ’99 Passat and 1.9Tdi in ’05 Touran)

He was gobsmacked by the car, saying it was as close to perfection as he’d ever driven in cars of that type.

I’m not surprised if he help come up the behemoth that is a hummer 2.

They are great engines, but the turbos can be flaky. I’ve owned several from the newer PD to the old version from 110 to 130bhp. Always preferred the older TDI variants myself.

Their window regulators are shite though!

I have a 1998 Cordoba (mk3 Polo estate) 1.9 TDi, and what molgrips says about the torque range is very true.

Despite being quite old, I can get 60+ mpg (single occupant + bike), around 65-70mph.

Only downside is high tax, and relatively high insurance in my younger years.

I had a 1997 1.9 TDi Vento. Bought specifically for a 120 miles/day commute. It was the cheapest car with that engine. It ran for over 100,000 miles faultlessly and returned 56mpg over that combined distance (no computer estimate, this was from fuel bills).

Not fast, but speed and commuting don’t go together – traffic conditions are a much bigger factor for travel time.

I now have a newer 2.0 TDi that struggles to give 45mpg, but the car is MUCH heavier.

Since you have a car already, unless you NEED to change, I also think the economies are against you. Convenience (less time filling up) and more relaxing drive are pluses, however.

45 from a 2.0TDi some things up, my previous ones I was getting mid 50s and now with the newer engine on the MK VI Golf I get in the 60s on long runs. I’m not a slow driver by no means either.

Cruise control, set at 70mph, you’ll do well.

What, from Worthing to Portmouth?

You’ll be sat in the car probably 3 hours a day, make sure its a nice place to be – and you said ‘auto’, so you need to look at the mpg of these rather than for a manual.

tbh I’d run the Astra for the foreseeable future.

Btw mine’s auto, so I do ok, but I don’t sit in traffic much if at all.

Don’t want auto!
Will have a think about things….
I’ll be driving at random hours of the day, do mostly clear roads I expect!

The ‘ nice place to be’ is also important. We’ve an octavia, which is lovely to drive, but the wife’s bagged that!

DrP

so a decent reliable auto is a must

obviously a mis-read…

The ‘ nice place to be’ is also important. We’ve an octavia, which is lovely to drive, but the wife’s bagged that!

She’s not daft!

Sorry there! Auto…mobile!

Drp

Me = 2.0tdi Glof, averaging 54-56mpg over the last 5k (still running in…) and I drive about 1500-2000 per month. I don’t tend to hang around, although old age seems to be mellowing me.

Missus = 1.4tdi (75) Fabia. Gets about 580 miles out of a tank costing 55 quid which I think is about 60mpg at current prices? That’s 35 miles per day urban running, so for a decent a road or m’way commute I think you’ll do better. “Characterful” engine. Clattery, 3 cylinder. Narrow powerband but OK as it seems to pick up quite well when moving. I find it really hard to do uphill starts in, funnily enough. Personally I’d struggle with it over a long time on motorway driving, but you can’t argue with the economy if you’re paying for the miles yourself.

I’d be tempted to see how it goes with the Astra – run it into the floor if you have to, then look at a replacement when you’re used to what you need for the route.

FWIW I used to have a 56 plate 105 1.9 tdi Spatat and it was a pretty poor engine in that size car. No engine problems noted with any of the above as we’ve not had the Fabia long and the others have been company cars.