Today's rental property advice request..

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Today's rental property advice request..

25 posts & 12 voices | Started 4 months ago by z1ppy | Latest reply from z1ppy

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z1ppy - Member

advice or point me in the direction of some-one to ask would be great.

.. my property has french windows off one of 1st floor bedrooms. There's a flat roof outside it, but as I decided to rent it I didn't put up any protection for the flat roof or a rail to stop ppl falling off the roof (quite high, as the ground fall away at the rear). As such I've never supplied the french windows keys to the tenants, but whilst investigating a damp issue (boxes against the wall!) today, they ask if they could have the keys.
I'm actually happy to supply them, on the basis the flat roof isn't used as a balcony, BUT want to protect myself from any sort of negligence claim. Any idea's how I could go about this? Tenant's have said they'll sign a waver, but I don't know if it'll be that simple?
Where should I go to get 'proper' advise on this?

Posted 4 months ago #
wwaswas - Member

a solicitor?

or just get some railings put up so they can open the windows for ventilation but a small child who was visiting and unsupervised couldn't get out the flat onto the roof?

It's not the tenants you need to worry about it's visitors.

Posted 4 months ago #
z1ppy - Member

this my thought, "I thinking about the children!"

Is there a particular type of solicitor who can clear this up though?

Posted 4 months ago #
thekingisdead - Member

Railings will be cheaper than a solicitor, and nigh on full proof (for the kidlets at least)

Your next tenant may have kids and ask for railings to be put in anyway...

Posted 4 months ago #
z1ppy - Member

Railing may well be worth investigating (I hadn't thought of it, but was looking for the 'free' option), but does give the impression the roof could be used as a balcony, which I don't want, due to the ease of damaging a flat roof. Though railing won't be that cheap TBH, as it's a large flat roof, and even railing to surround where door open wouldn't be a simple job.

Definitely cheaper to simply not give them the keys....

Posted 4 months ago #
midlifecrashes - Member

Doors open in or outward? If inward, Juliette balcony railings are available off the shelf from about £150 upward.

Posted 4 months ago #
z1ppy - Member

you know it not going to be that simple don't you?

...outwards, hense not a simple bit of railing, & it would need to attach to the outside wall not the flat roof...

Posted 4 months ago #
sugdenr - Member

It is simple. Do not give them the keys. There, free legal advice.

Welcome.

Posted 4 months ago #
z1ppy - Member

Posted 4 months ago #
wwaswas - Member

put the grill on the inside of the door?

Posted 4 months ago #
z1ppy - Member

I really like that idea, and it would be cheap too. Sometimes you over think an issue and the obvious pass you by...

BUT do I still need to get them to sign something to say they understand they are not allow out past it? Or will I have done enough by simply putting up a barrier?

Posted 4 months ago #
wwaswas - Member

that's the bit you need a property lawyer for I'd say.

there's lots of places that have this sort of door arrangment with a 60ft drop underneath the window not a flat roof so it's probably ok but there's no point getting them to sign a piece fo paper that says you knew they might use (even if they said they wouldn;t) if it just opens you up to liability.

Posted 4 months ago #
saleem - Member

Replace the doors with a window thats tilt and turn so that it can still be used as a fire escape, that way the kids can't get out, ventilation sorted too. Try and get a miss measure from your local window company,there are normaly some to be had.

Posted 4 months ago #
z1ppy - Member

Salem, that would be a very expensive solution, as the french windows also has two integrated (upper) windows either side of them, that and if I did have to move into the property, I'd want to use it as a balcony....

I like the internal grill solution but am confused about the waver option

Posted 4 months ago #
joeegg - Member

Put a condition in the lease that the flat roof is not to be used as a balcony.
If they do use it and possibly damage it at least you would have the lease conditions in your favour.Getting money for repairs would be another matter.

Posted 4 months ago #
TandemJeremy - Member

waivers are pretty useless.

I would not give them the keys myself unless it had proper railings and a walking surface

Posted 4 months ago #
project - Member

Flat roofs are easily damaged, and costly to repair, especially if done deliberately, when they dont want to pay the rent, or damaged by other people.

Also think of a visitor falling off the roof, i fell down a cellar once because the idiot didnt tell me the steps where imediately behind the door, and there was no light.

Oh and is it strong enough to support a few people.

Posted 4 months ago #
andyl - Member

Railings on the inside + a sticker saying "no access past this point" or something similar, maybe add "flat roof not suitable as walking surface"

Posted 4 months ago #
CaptJon - Member

How much would it cost to turn the roof into a balcony? And what extra could you charge for such a great new addition to the property?

Posted 4 months ago #
z1ppy - Member

it would cost too much, special tiles to protect the flat roof below, and railing all the way round (aprox 30ft long) would be excessive, let alone fixing it to the roof without damaging the membrane. Though in answer to Project, the flat roof was overbuilt (wood work wise), with the intention of possibly using it as a balcony.

Basically I couldn't charge anymore either as the view is onto a tatty estate behind (this is Brum after-all), it more about being able to open the french windows during the summer, as the side windows only have small top openings.

Anyways I'm pleased with Wwaswas's suggestion, as a short section of railing won't cost a lot & be easy to install. That and I can't see anyone being able to say I didn't try to stop access through/out the window

Posted 4 months ago #
TandemJeremy - Member

Even with a rail they will still go out on the roof - I would.

Posted 4 months ago #
sugdenr - Member

Q. How much additional rent are you going to get for the effort or risk?

A. None

Why bother?

Posted 4 months ago #
z1ppy - Member

Happy tenants?

Posted 4 months ago #
mrmo - Member

as a tenant i would be pretty pissed if my landlord told me your not allowed to open the windows. I would probably move elsewhere. Being able to get adequate ventilation on a hot summers day etc.

Posted 4 months ago #
z1ppy - Member

mrmo it was made perfectly clear during the viewing that this was the case, & if the tenant was so unhappy they wouldn't have been in over a year.

I'm just trying to accommodate what it a reasonable request from good long term tenants, but simply want to protect myself in what is becoming a "claims culture".

Posted 4 months ago #

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