Trying to decide on a new bike and 2 options have 105 and the other has Tiagra, how much of a difference is there really?

Obviously 105 is now 11 speed and I’d expect 105 to be a bit lighter but is there much of an appreciable difference in use?

The tiagra bike makes up for the lower spec gruppo with better frame, wheels and finishing kit.

Cheers

Ive just gone down from 105 to Tiagra and can honestly say I don’t notice the difference. If it were ,e I’d buy the better frame with the better kit and upgrade later if I wanted.

Cable run on 105 is much nicer looking imo, unless new tiagra also has both gear and brake cable runs concealed under bar tape. As an occasional to the cafe and back roadie that sort of stuff is important to me.

I have old 10 speed 105 and 9 speed Tiagra, and, as above the hood shape and concealed cable routing on the 105 are the only noticeable differences. I’m pretty sure that the new Tiagra has sorted both of those though?

Have tiagra-9 speed on my Allez and 105-10 speed on my Ribble….the 105 is much nicer to use.

Have tiagra-9 speed on my Allez and 105-10 speed on my Ribble….the 105 is much nicer to use.

I doubt the OP is looking at new bikes that come with 5 year old groupsets though 😉

There were also 2 major iterations of 10speed 105, 5600 (2007) was decent, 5700 (2011) not so much, same with 9speed tiagra that spans 2 groupsets from 2001-2011

There’s a lot less between them now and Tiagra is much improved.

unless new tiagra also has both gear and brake cable runs concealed under bar tape

it does, it’s basically the same as the 11sp groupo now (same pull ratio, same annoying chainring BCD etc.) but with 10 clicks to keep compatibility with older/cheaper running gear.

the new 4700 stuff is very very good for the amount of money it doesn’t cost, easily on a par with the 105 for feel when new, and it should be pretty durable too.

I like the older 4600 10speed Tiagra too, feel was decent and the hoods were a nice shape too, the newer hoods a lot of people find better but I’ve not got on so well with them so far.

Internal Vs External cabling is one for an argument though, for everything you gain in neatness and aero (how much!?) you lose some in ease of maintenance and a bit of friction, although with the proper decent cables the internal stuff is spot on.

One thing I haven’t tried is the new 4700 brakes, I imagine they will be adequate but much improved by throwing away the OEM pads, as has been the case on <Tiagra brakes for years.

If it were me I’d get the bike with the better frame and wheels, current Tiagra is a very good groupset and can always be upgraded later if you really want to claw back a pound or so of weight.

+1 drofluf …. get the better frame !

I have the latest versions of both. The only difference is 11spd rather than 10 and the colour. I bought the 105 groupset separately but the tiagra came on a bike. If buying a groupset again it’d be hard to justify getting 105 just because it’s black.

I’ve got 10 speed tiagra, it was my first group set on a road bike since index gearing and I was very impressed overall. Then in September I bought a bike with 11 speed 105 and its significantly better. Id still say though go with the better frame and wheels as you can upgrade the drivetrain as it wears

Take the Tiagra with better other kit, without a doubt. Even Sora is good these days. (Though I’m a huge fan of having the gear cables along the bars instead of looping round in the way of lights/bar bags/my eyes.)

Though I’m a huge fan of having the gear cables along the bars instead of looping round in the way of lights/bar bags/my eyes

my eternal dilemma!

I want and like underbar routing, but I also want ease of maintenance and reliability of external routing.

the current crop of stuff from Shimano seems like it’s finally nailed it in terms of being good enough, but historically I’ve always be underwhelemed by underbar routed stuff.

I’d go tiagra as well. The consumables for the higher spec groupsets are more expensive too, something I always keep in mind, that’s one of the reasons I’m running Sora, which is fine too.

I’d say better wheels trump better groupset

Just fitted Tiagra (10spd) shifters to lad’s CX bike – deliberately went for external routing so cables can be easily lubed and handy to have barrel adjuster on the bars. Quality seems fine.

What Amedias said is spot on…

Personally, I was a little disappointed when 105 went 11spd. I felt they should have kept it 10spd, but utilised a lot of the Refinements from the Ultegra 6800 groupset (which they did anyway). But then they’ve now done that with Tiagra too, and it’s still 10spd (cheaper cassettes and chains and more choice of ratios) which is fantastic…

I’m a SRAM fan, love the clickiness, but Tiagra always impresses me when it’s new just how good it is for so little money. The only thing to change is fit some cartridge style brake pads instead of the one piece affairs…

I have 10 speed Tiagra with the old style cable routing and 11 speed 105. 105 feels crisper and easier, particularly the new front mech pull ratio. 105 braking with the new 105 calipers is also noticeably easier.

Depending on how much you ride, 105 might last half as long again as tiagra (the actual groupset, not consumables)

There isn’t a huge difference in price between Tiagra and 105. How much better would the frame, wheels and finishing kit be for a couple of hundred quid ? Not much I’d bet. Personally I like 11spd, you can go for a wide ratio cassette without annoying ( to me anyway ) gaps.

Cheers all for the info/replies.

The bikes I’m looking at are the Pinnacle Arkose 3 (2015) for £800 http://www.evanscycles.com/products/pinnacle/arkose-three-2015-adventure-road-bike-ec071307 which has 105, the Jamis Renegade Expat (£712) http://www.evanscycles.com/products/jamis/renegade-expat-2016-adventure-road-bike-ec122202 which has Tiagra and the Verenti Substance 105 http://www.wiggle.co.uk/verenti-substance-105-2016/ which I can get for the bargain price of 660quid.

To me the Jamis looks bestest VFM despite being the Tiagra bike…

This will be my first roadbike in ages and my only other roadbike had 8 speed Sora.

On MTBs I’m an SLX/Zee/XT mix and match kind of a chap.

Just get the Jamis Dan.
You can always upgrade..

Op. Get which ever takes your fancy, but not sure why the Jamis is “better” nothing special about Reynolds 520. I’ve never bought into the steel is best thing ( despite owning a 853 bike). From a personal perspective I’d prefer the lighter Pinnacle.

Taxi, maybe I’m buying into the marketing but there is some relatively clever stuff with changing CS length, BB drop and fork rake by size.

Road.cc loved last years Carbon model too.

That being said the Pinnacle and Verenti have reviewed well too!

I certainly wouldn’t rate that Jamis Frame above the Pinnacle one and the forks are full carbon with the Pinnacle as well. I’ve a 725 steel Croix de Fer which I bought secondhand, nothing wrong with it but if I’d been buying new now I think I’d go for the lighter Pinnacle. I’ve 2 steel frames the other being 853 and I would say that in both cases the carbon counterparts I own to each are either equal, in the case of the 853, or far better in the case of the 725. The only steel frame I’ve owned which felt a bit special was a custom built Roberts which didn’t need to meet any of today’s regs which do seem to have resulted in most steel bikes losing their best characteristics.
I’ve also got both the avid BB7 brakes and the Spyres and can’t say I have any preference, I think they both do a good job, the Spyres are relatively new to me but I’ve had the BB7’s for a few years and they’ve proved reliable and easy to live with.

I went from 11spd Ultegra to 10spd Tiagra and tbh I found the Tiagra to be firma and more positive. Much less flimsy at the levers too.

To me a big bonus of going to 105 would be being able to have hydro disc brakes, but looks like you don’t get that so get whichever and keep everything clean and we’ll adjusted which will make massively more difference than the groupset name.

If the cable routing for the new Tiagra is the same as the 11 speed, and the cables are coated, I’d go with the Tiagra. New 11 speed shifts smoother than Shimano’s first hidden cable offerings (but only as well as their exposed cables). The FD is better on 11 speed, but I’m not struggling with my 10 speed bikes (have two of each).

Frame first, always frame first.

I have the Jamis and its hands down the best gravel bike in its price class. Its a brilliant frame and the fork is exceptional. Full carbon fork is very well designed. Geo is dialled. Wheels are heavy but rims are decent. Bike is only let down by chainset n seat post. Excellent value reynolds 520 import. Jamis nailed it but not much demand for steel. This is the bike i will do lejog on with a brooks b17 narrow n dt swiss r32 wheels. Bomber n comfy as u like. Massive clearance.