I'm looking for a full suss frame for a bit of DH (non-race), mucking about in the woods general riding (but not all day XC stuff) and the odd uplift day.

I've been looking at the cheep (comparatively speaking) and cheerful Santa Cruz bikes but don't know which would be more suitable and fun.

All opinions would be greatly received, Ta.

Buy a cheap DH bike 2nd hand

Bullit is great for messing about on etc. but you'll end up building it up too heavy or too focussed to ride any XC on.

Heckler is nearly as heavy as the Bullit (only about a lb in it) but too steep angled really to be much cop for any DH use.

Both are very short in the wheelbase for their travel too.

You'd have more fun just picking up a cheap 2nd hand DH bike…

I've got a bullit, its fine for everything, you just have to work harder when it comes to xc. my frame with fth element coil shock weighs 9.5 lbs. Its an excellent climber, and going down is like a magic carpet, personally if it was one bike only this would be it. In the uk if you re at all interested in going down, you need something that can go up. The bullit is it. When it gets to the alps its the best thing next to a full dh rig.
EDIT: The heckler comes down more on the xc side than the bullit, but we re talking shades of grey, if you feel that you need to let out your inner hooligan, then buy a bullit, if you are a tadge more reserved, buy a feckler.

imho stw isn't the place to find much positive about bike like the bullit or the feckler..

Buy my bullit, it's great!

i use my heckler for exactly that. feel the need for a bit more on DH days, but it copes with everything fine.

The Bullit has wierd geometry, its quite short and steep, with a high BB. Im not saying buy the Heckler, just maybe dont buy the Bullit.

My Bullit is awesome, use it for everything, Lyriks (U-Turn) for general riding, 888s for DH. Was a pretty cheap bike, though with the upgrades I've dropped almost 1k on it now. I would agree with the last poster regarding the bottom bracket height, it isn't very good in tight corners, I'm hoping that running it with Lyriks wound down to 115mm will help next time I go to a trail centre with it, if not it's no biggy.

If you only have one bike and want to do everything, you won't find something that doesn't have it's faults.

Toys19 and all Bullit riders – what forks are you running, and do you rate them?

you talking the newer or older heckler/bullits?

I only know about the newer ones and they are very different bikes imo. From your description of what you want the bike for the heckler is not appropriate. Get the bullit. If you want a SC thats inbetween them get the nomad. Thats what I did

And have you considered an Orange Alpine 160? Dirt say it's a mini-224 that climbs – best 160x160mm bike you can currently buy. Sounds ideal.

Might be my mates setup on a 160 but it's not a patch on my nomad. But then again I would bias wouldn't I?!

Agreed on the Bullit geometry comments…

A Specialized SX Trail or a Giant Reign X would be my choice.

I've been running both for 2 years..have just sold my heckler and my bullit frame is for sale on here…felt like a change but can't recommend either enuf…for different uses..
agree and disagree with the above…

Heckler designed for xc/all mountain. agree the geometry is too steep on the head angle for DH. wouldn't be my choice. I've ridden IL, Cwmcarn DH on it as the frame is tough enough but you can feel it's on the nervous side…140mm travel gets a bit of a battering..

Bullit. you can defo ride DH. 7" travel in the UK no probs. It's super plush. almost endless. 4 of us have or have had Bullits for DH…non race..the bikes just fly. eg ridden IL, FW & Ae etc…the shock shuttle on my 05 allows wheel base adjustment..don't agree with "weird geometry". work on bar height, stem length, axle to crown height on forks…for your set up..
I've ridden it xc and been to summits minutes before xc mates..can be sluggish on flat singletrack….but carry's speed and grip…cos you have worked on your suss set up..
I'd defo recommend a Bullit for non race DH…and it'll do so much more..
(another suggestion would be to look at an Orange Patriot…)

I've got older bullit, the last of the old ones 2006.

fox van r 36. Its no good believing anything I say, I'm deeply in love with my bullit…

Heckler is currently what I'm thinking of replacing my Wolfridge with – anyone know of a demo in XL size?

Ive got an XL 2008 heckler full build on sale ?
You may find it if you search the forum or mail me.

How much for the frame?

Full build