Anyone suffered a torn rotator cuff injury? Buggered if I know how I did it but the night time pains been over three months and certain movements made me feel physically sick and almost pass out with the sudden intense pain/feeling of shoulder trying to dislocate so went to docs and he confirmed the injury. Put me on Naproxen and written me up for some physio but couldn’t give a timescale for healing….although he did run through the escalation if it doesn’t get better which I aim to avoid.
I’m still riding (and crashing on it) but avoiding all really heavy push/pull/ rotate movements and trying to gently stretch and get it moving properly again. So how long in general does it take?

Small tear in Jan. Been on naproxen when needs be. Pain can be impressive. Got a pre op consult in a few weeks. The only thing that’s taken the pain away were agonising cortisone injections which wore off after work 6-8weeks.

Tore mine at the gym 10 years ago did nothing about it and tried to train round it… Gave up training/gym after 5 years of 3+ days a week because of it.
It was painful for 12+ months and not right for years… Even 2 years later attempting to lift/pull heavyweights caused pain and uneven strength.
Regards bike it’s ok because strength involved is less.
But to be honest any more that a long DH day or multiple trail days and I’m back on naproxen to kill the shoulder pain and tennis elbow pain.
If there is another option other that leave it I would look into it.

Chris physio and op?

Had the op on mine. Partly because I didn’t stick religiously to the physio but then had to do it post op but has been weaker ever since.

Good luck.

Cheers for the replies, I found midweek off piste riding made it a he like a sod too so I’m taking 6 days off from any riding to see if I can get it to settle whilst the naproxen does its stuff……I’ve a nasty feeling it may end up with an operation to repair it. Was hoping for stories of miracle self healing! 😯

Did mine for the first time in 2008. Several times since then. Never did any physio and now it’s pretty ****. Hurts when I put arms straight up in the air. Much less strength in shoulders than before injuries. Don’t be like me. Look after it.

6 months on and still aches…

I did a fair amount of damage to mine when I dislocated my right shoulder back in September I took it really easy on my right shoulder and arm, I stayed off the bike for about 4 months and did all the physio I was told to do, I got back on the bike when the physio gave the ok and apart from it feeling a little weak to begin with it’s completely back to normal now.

Yea it sucked being off the bike but decided it wasn’t worth the risk and glad I listened now.

18 months and still not right, aches after swimming, badminton is a no no on the bike not so bad, dirt bike made it hurt 🙁

so I’m taking 6 days off from any riding to see if I can get it to settle whilst the naproxen does its stuff

You’re going to need to stay off it for a damn site longer than that! If you’ve got any sense! And any doctor or physio will tell you precisely that. You’re looking at a few months, minimum, for it to heal properly. And if you don’t let it heal properly, then you’ll do lasting damage and permanently weaken it. I know thats not what you want to hear, but thats the cold, harsh reality. I’ve been there, and its a PITA!!

I did mine about 18 months ago. 3 months off the bike, with regular physio and a lot of medication meant that after that time I was able to ease myself back in. I got a full recovery with no lasting damage.

You need to rest it! Properly! And I mean do absolutely nothing but the exercises the physio gives you to do. If you’re talking about riding again in days, then you’re just going t do yourself lasting damage. Is i worth it? Think long term. It helped that I did mine at the beginning of December, so got three months of excuses not to ride through gale force winds, torrential rain, snow and ankle deep mud! 😀

Good luck with it, but please be patient. It’ll be worth it in the long term!

Had mine operated on last August after 18 months of physio which did nothing to help. Good as gold now no issues at all. Get the op its the only thing that helped me. Once the tendon is damaged only complete rest (which is very difficult in the shoulder joint) will heal the tendon. The constant movement through the AC joint aggrevates and inflames the tendon causing the pain.

I was 8 weeks no riding at all, eased back in. Now had second cortisone with the consultant saying to take it easy as if it tears further I’ll not notice but she will. When she’s in digging about.

Thanks for the wise words particularly Binners…….I decided not to ride for 6 days having crashed onto that shoulder again last Wednesday night 😆
My difficulty in my head is I have never in 50 years taken any long break from activity…..even snapped ankle ligament only had me missing two weeks, stirrup strapped it for the next five years and didn’t miss a match. I know it’s not a complete tear as I have a reasonable amount of movement before the excruciating pain and biking in general (apart from crashing) doesn’t cause too much aggravation. I did tell my Doc who is an orthopaedic specialist and ex rugby player (and also guilty of self aligning broken bones etc etc) and that I was MTBing still and he didn’t tell me to stop……or even be careful. I just get the impression unless it’s fully snapped away from the joint you’re not going to get any sort of operation on it any time soon and that I will do my own physio anyway.
It’s been a week since going onto the naproxen and it is improving so I may just stick to some road biking and tame MTBing for a while. (Gets me out pushing the shopping trolley too) 😆

As an aside, can you run/jog with the injury?

Does your doc understand that mtbing isn’t just canal paths? Before I had mine done it started ‘popping out’ on the bike off I absorbed bumps. Excruciating and ultimately dangerous as that was generally like being stabbed in the arm at speed.

If you can’t take a break,take up road biking for a year and go big on the physio (is what I’d do if it happened again ).

Current thinking is that you are far better to ‘optimally load’ rather than rest completely. The tricky part is determining what the optimal load is- ie how much exercise and activity you should be doing that involves the injured tissue. OP do you know which muscle and what grade of tear it was? The rotator cuff is made up of four different muscles, and they all (mostly!! 😉 ) move the arm in a different direction. If you know the grade of tear I might be able to give you a rough figure for how long it’ll take to heal (assuming that you follow your physio’s instructions. You are seeing a physio, right?!?! )

He’s given me a physio referral but no date for first session yet. The main pain is if I go to put a coat or jacket on on reverses the car but also if I waft the king size duvet up in the air to get it to lay flat. Inner shoulder on the front face of the joint and a pretty constant ache in the rear beyond my shoulder blade and collar bone….deeper than my deltoid (very much down in the joint)I initially thought I’d got a bone spur or something of that ilk causing the joint to jam but it progressed to the well described rotator cuff injury pain. I can feel it more using tricep, no pain on bicep movement, or indeed lats. Not tried any pecs or deltoid stressing ( other than what the doc did) and haven’t got a drooping shoulder. One final thing I did note when it got really bad was my deltoid and tricep in particular involuntarily twitching a hell of a lot, I put that down to blood seeping into them from adjacent tear area. Doc didn’t actually mention a grade of tear and didn’t even shove his fingers in to probe. Based on what little he did I was hoping its classed as minor although he ran through the escalation treatment.

I’m liking the optimal loading idea……it’s what I did when I dislocated my right shoulder….starting two days after with small movements no weight….building up to a blue housebrick by day 7. My right shoulders always been strongest thereafter….wonder if being a loose head prop has any bearing on it as my left arm would predominantly be effectively stretched above my head binding on to the opposite prop. Have had to lift the bike over styles etc for years with my right arm and thinking about seated pressing I was always weaker on my left shoulder. 🙄 maybe a long standing minor tear that I’ve made worse?

12 months in my case to get better with a spate of physio, lesson learned – don’t try and chuck stones further than my kids at the beach

I think auto correct has misspelt a couple of your words there- reverses the car? Other than that it sounds like the infraspinatus, which rotates your arm outwards. So if your elbow was by your side but bent by 90 degrees, so that your fingers were pointing forward, then if you rotate your arm/shoulder so that your fingers wee pointing to your side (elbow still still by your side and bent 90 degrees) you’re using your infraspinatus. It sits on the back of your shoulder blade. However, what you have said has not ruled out supraspinatus tendinitis. This sits on top if your shoulder blade, behind your collar bone and runs under the bony bit that sticks up from your shoulder. This is a very common injury. Palpation (feeling with your fingers and ideally by a physio!) will determine this.

Ultimately, it sounds like the doc has left you with a lot of unanswered questions/

A) degree of strain
B) which muscle is strained
C) what stretches and strengthening exercises you need to do to fix it
D) how long this will take.

All these can and will be answered by your physio (especially if you ask!! 😉 ). This is not the doc’s fault (I’m assuming it was a GP, right?) they have a fantastic knowledge base but it is very broad. It is their role to refer you to the right person, which is what this one has done.

I’m liking the optimal loading idea……it’s what I did when I dislocated my right shoulder….starting two days after with small movements no weight….building up to a blue housebrick by day 7. My right shoulders always been strongest thereafter….

Always good to see what you read in the textbooks being borne out on real life!! 🙂

Cheers for that shermer75, I meant to type when going to reverse the car and putting my arm up on the passenger seat and turning at the same time to look out the rear screen……this was the movement that nearly made me pass out with intense pain and I have a high pain threshold!
I tried the moment you describe for the infraspinitus and there is certainly some discomfort in doing that movement but equally I’ve had my fingers in various gaps in the muscles/ tendon/ joint and indeed the deep bits i can get to reveals that the supraspinatus area feels bruised. ( I’ve had tendinitis and bursitis elsewhere over the years too). I’m going to be a sensible old chap and until the physio appointment just keep massaging the whole area gently, keep taking the Naproxen and avoid any more crashes/ride local and sensible and keep using my arm ( but sensibly) like I’ve done with injuries in the past……I’ve avoided any surgeons interventions so far in life, I intend to carry on letting them cut open other folk rather than me! 😆

Cool. The supraspinatus, along with the deltoid muscle which is much bigger and sits on top, lift your arm up. You would be using it (along with many other muscles) to do all of the actions described with the jacket, duvet and putting your arm on the passenger seat. It’s tendon runs underneath the bony, crooked finger-like outgrowth that joins the collar bone to the shoulder bone, which can make it hard to palpate. It also often rubs against this bone, causing it to inflame, which in turn causes it to rub against the bone more which makes it inflame more and so on. It is a very common injury with baseball pitchers, as you can image they are putting large amounts of force and stress through their shoulder when it is in an elevated position. Apparently it is very painful.
I completely agree about avoiding surgery! This would be my instinct as well. Always better to try non surgical techniques first! 🙂

Have you tried standing next to a wall so that your affected arm is between you and the wall and then trying to raise it?

*This is a good way to see if the supraspinatus is the culprit, it’s definitely not a rehab exercise!!! If it reproduces the pain then it’s a good indicator that it is the supraspinatus.

I’m going to go back to wait now until physio as I woke up in the night in absolute agony again, on my hands and knees, itbwould seem it must have hurt in the night so subconsciously I got on to my hands and knees to turn over and get comfortable………which woke me up 😆 I do find it bizarre that the two minutes of agony in the night resulted in greater pain free movement this morning. There’s only so much a thick I with the touch of an elephant can do with regards to my assisted diagnosis, thanks shermer75…. I do feel more confident of getting over it faster and with no invasive intervention.

Have you tried standing next to a wall so that your affected arm is between you and the wall and then trying to raise it?

Might be a bit difficult as the wall is in the way! 😕

I had a ski crash on new years eve and eventually had a steroid inj last month which allowed me to move it much better as it wasn’t getting better at all. Its still weak though and I don’t want top push it, so still hoping it improves by itself.

I have done both of mine.

Never had steroid injections but did physio both times and did the prescribed exercises to the letter.

Both still a bit f****** but not too bad and don’t stop me doing anything.

One occasionally locks but manipulation sorts it out.

how long

6 months+ providing no movements that particularly stress it are done, and you keep up the physio.

Carry on exercising, MTBing, expect it to be like that for ever with little to no hope of repair.

I’ve done both of mine – I have glass shoulders apparently – I’m now fairly limited in type of pressing movements I can do (wide grip or overhead presses will get it to flare up eventually), and anything with a long lever like pec fly or delt raise is out. But at least I can still do some stuff and day to day it doesn’t affect me much at all.

Thread resurrection!

Can anyone recommend some good exercises to help after a hard shoulder impact? I’m told there’s no bone damage, despite my upper skeleton feeling out of kilter, and that it’s likely to be rotator cuff related. Can live with the (mild) pain, just don’t want to feel like my shoulder is on wonky.

Is a rotator cuff tear different from the damage caused by compaction by impact, or are they the same thing?

Ta.

Not trying to be funny but I’d try and get some imaging done MRI or ultrasound.

My physio diagnosed a probable rotator cuff year in mid June after external examination and based on presentation. Give it another 8 weeks and here’s some stretches.

Yesterday I was diagnosed with a frozen shoulder by an orthopaedic consultant and am looking at 9-12 months of restricted movement and night time pain. I can’t tell you how painful knocking that shoulder is if I knock it at the moment – proper going whey faced and sweating stuff.

I don’t blame my physio but I think imaging earlier would have helped get a diagnosis and treatment regime appropriate for it.

Yup, that chimes with what I was told, if it doesn’t improve in two months “get thee to an ultrasound”.

The pain thing annoyed me during diagnosis*: – Tell ’em there’s little or no pain, they don’t understand why you’re seeking treatment/advice. Tell ’em the shoulder looks knocked out of joint, they ask whether there’s any pain. Repeat.

*sneek edit: I realise this is down to a perfectly necessary diagnostic/assessment process.

I too suffered a frozen shoulder capsule……the rotator cuff is 99% healed but the frozen capsule scar tissue has been more painful to tear/breakdown. Physio went part way in breaking it down and I did the majority myself, one big section by accident……dropped the big wooden chopping board and reached out fully extending my arm and caught it before it hit the floor………I was reeling,sweating, swearing, tears of pain for 20 minutes after…..I had read that they can do this under general anaesthetic to break it down…….alas I was of course conscious……
Hurt like hell all evening but got up day after and had massive amount more movement.
Exercise wise I use doorway stretches, over head stretches, pulling my upper arm across my chest and towel behind the back to pull my bad arm round my back.
Private physio has just been superseded by NHS……both say my left scapula is not where it should be (dropped but may be linked to historical back injury). I’ve also been diagnosed as having a degree of hyper mobility in all my joints ( runs in my family) and this hyper mobility has been masking my serious injuries and fractures over the years.
Pain management I have found that a thumb pressed up into the depths of my armpit finding the most painful point then wrapping rest of my hand tound towards my back and palpating gently with thumb and fingers releases all the knotted muscles and rotator cuff muscles and relieves pain pretty much instantly.
I’ve probably pushed harder than the average person would in terms of pain (according again to both physios) and with the frozen shoulder it’s the only way I believe, embrace the pain as you stretch the capsule.
My other main bit of advice and what I have found to aggravate frozen shoulders is using a smart phone or tablet…….I can garauntee you an improvement if you stop holding it and rest it on a surface instead!!!!!!
Basically MTFU and do the painful physio 😆

No pain, no regain then. I might just upload my consciousness into a robo-computer with flashing lights instead.

Actually, 99% healed after two months sounds pretty good going. Maybe healing is a better option.

If there is another option other that leave it I would look into it.

Unlikely to be any muscle left to repair if you tore it properly 10yrs ago.

Hi,
That’s a heck of a lot of posts, and I admit I’ve not read them all, so if my musings are already stated then I apologise.
Rotator cuff is a group of 4 muscles that hold the shoulder stable (suck that egg why don’t ya!)
Theres a little simple test that will help you determine which of the muscles (or which muscle) you have injured:
it involves lifting your arms up, beginning with your arms by your side, first exercise is slowly lift an arm, or both arms outwards as if making a star jump. point thumbs down. – record pain/no pain
2nd, same exercise with thumbs pointing forward in a Jedi X-wing style. – record pain / no pain
3rd, thumbs up. record pain/ no pain
If memory serves, and without trawling back through my notes and text books the results indicate as follows:
pain with:
thumb down = Teres Minor
Thumb horizontal = Infraspinatus
Thumb up Supraspinatus

hope I’ve helped!
you’ll have to google yourself a means of diagnosing Subscapularis. – I cant remember!

@peraphlite. Spot on, I have s full thickness Supraspinatus tear which is due to be fixed the same time I have a distal clavicle excision. Cannot wait for that!

That sounds lovely, best of luck with that!

just look after your healing, look at yourself a lot in the mirror, scrutinise your posture and try to hold your shoulders in the correct position (kt tape could help “teach” you the right position) its common to find that you are rolling your shoulders forward. especially if you have a desk job. this can lead to impingement issues.
best of luck, and remember, when it feels better, its not really better, subacute muscle repair stage, probably from around 3 or 4 weeks in your case will lead you to believe that all is good in the hood, however since your muscle is like a pony tail, only a certain percentage of those hair (muscle) strands will be repaired, you’ll have functionality but not strength. first unseen rabbit hole: ping…..return to sq.1!

Subscapularis medial rotates, doesn’t it? So I guess resisting any of that kind of movement should reproduce symptoms?