Been xc and marathon racing on and off for 8 years and getting/staying fast doesn’t seem to be getting any easier!
All the training plans based on mashing yourself 5 days a week seem to grind me into a fatigued, cold ridden individual susceptible to infections and needing a month off to recover and back at square 1.
Nearly 45yo now and wondering what tricks the vets massif are willing to give up. Do you train hard by judgement rather than schedule, do you need to up the protein to avoid loosing muscle from burning?

Judgement for me, just been saying on another post that I got my ass handed to me on a plate last year in the Nats.
So I now just do my best to beat those within reach.
For me that just means a few hard turbo sessions, a short race and a club run each week.
I adjust depending on results.
I don’t use any devices or plans or zones, just gut feeling.
Diet is robust and no supplements.
Happy with that and ten years your senior.

1 day on, 1 day off, clean (ish) diet, focus, pick your battles, don’t waste an opportunity, but don’t be rushed into compromising those battles.

Tapering works really well for me. Gradually build up to a targeted event, rest for a week before, and take it nice and easy just doing fun rides after.

But then I only do 3 or 4 events a year now which is much easier to plan. Not like back in my 20s when it was 2 or 3 a week, sometimes 2 races in a day. You live and learn!

You need to get down the gym. Your muscles start to deteriorate post 40. You need to lift some weights to maintain strength.

Race 50 year olds.

I’ve had a really tough year with lack of form trips to docs etc.. The penny dropped after all clear from docs I’m still trying to train the same as I was in my thirties … So been over trained and tired all the time .. Still trying to adjust but heading in the right direction with day on/day off .. More fun/easy spins too ..

You need to get down the gym. Your muscles start to deteriorate post 40. You need to lift some weights to maintain strength.

Nonesense. If you have enough strength to support your weight walking up the stairs you have enough strength to pedal a bike.

^ Yeah cos you only use your legs to ride a mountain bike………..

Lack of strength isn’t a contributory factor in getting fatigued and catching colds etc… I’m definitely in the ‘that’s bollocks’ camp.

Nonesense. If you have enough strength to support your weight walking up the stairs you have enough strength to pedal a bike.

What do you think your peak wattage output is when walking up stairs 🙄

One hard day a week, then an easy day and then not so easy day and repeat the latter two. Sounds simple but as you progress the not so easy day could still be 2-3 hours in the saddle zone 2 with 4-5 hill climbs thrown in. Hard days means short hard intervals to keep your top end revving so you don’t really want more than one a week. Throw in strength training 2-3 times a week, might not make you faster, but will make you more resilient to injury and help with not getting aches and pains. Clean diet (as much as you can) and take it D3 and magnesium/zinc to help immune system and recovery. But, remember that everyone is different so what works for me may not work for you.

Enough sleep, is one of the big helpers in recovery.

I jacked in full time racing 7 years ago now, but threaten to do it every September when the CX season comes round.
Anyway, the people who were good in their 20’s / 30’s and whom carry on, are still good in their 40’s / 50’s. Go the the N&D CX races and see how fast the Vets are. I thought once I turned 40 it would be easier – I was sadly deluded. If I got in the top half of the Vets, I had done very well. – this is against some blokes who are 70+.
I’m 50 now, and looking at the results, I’d still be very low down the finishers (if I was fit, which I’m not now!).

The people who get good finishes have always been good. It takes a bit more than training to be at that level for so many years – probably ideal body size/shape with lots of lungs.
A note of hope, a chap I used to work with retired, then after a short while was doing great TT times over 10 miles – he said he wasnt rushing around after work to try to get training miles in, he was taking it easier, but doing more, and suddenly he was doing TT times the saem as he was in his 20’s. So there is hope.

2 weeks on, one week recovery instead of 3 on, one recovery.

I’m still young ;). The guys I know who are 40+ and still racing at the sharp end are very focussed. This year I’ve raced Mtb, road, cross, TT and hill climbs with some long distance rides (150m+) and a couple of cycling holidays (90m+ days).

The guys who are older than me have picked their battles. Stuck to a few complimentary disciplines and trained for them. You can’t easily train for endurance races and then expect to be competitive in a 3 minute hill climb. They don’t enter everything (or if they do they don’t expect to do well).

Also the vets are very tactical. In road racing you’ll never see them at the front or chasing but they are always in the critical break or up there for the sprints.

Nonesense. If you have enough strength to support your weight walking up the stairs you have enough strength to pedal a bike.

What do you think your peak wattage output is when walking up stairs

You are confusing strength and power. Strength is the amount of force or torque applied to the pedals and power is a product of that force and the speed at which the pedals are being turned.

So even for a substantial power output of 500 watts at 70 rpm the force required on the pedals is 396N which is the equivalent of 40kg. Therefore, unless you are a midget, assuming you can walk up stairs you have ample strength to generate that 500watts. To increase cycling performance what you need to increase is the ability to push that force as fast as you can for as long as you can which needs fitness not strength.

The only time a cyclist might be strength limited is in track sprinting where enormous power outputs are needed.

Reckon I’ll carry on as I am and just accept it takes hard effort and competitive desire always takes some of the pain away. 2 out of 3 weeks works better for me too, gym for me is pretty much the rowing machine once a week in the winter and spring, occasionally add some leg work focused on leg push action, turbo in the winter, spring, long ride at weekends. Need to focus on better mix of protein in diet and sleep instead of surfing forums!
Thanks for all the feedback

Whenever a certain STW friend of mine pulls the “I’m ten years older” card, I like to remind him of all the 40+ year olds still handing youngsters their arses on plates in every discipline 😀

At 31, I’ve given up worrying about the age of the people racing around me- I’ve been overtaken by people old enough to be my granddad and all I think now is “fair play!”

Still there OP? Anyway, I can’t help much with how training changes over 40, as I’ve only been riding/racing since hitting 40.

But if you already know a bit about training, try reading Joe Friel’s blog. He’s recently been writing a fair bit about “older” athletes, although he seems to be focused on hos own ae group (over 50)

Cheers tim, I’ll take a look at Joe’s blog

Keen to get some advise here too ..

Did pretty bad 2 weeks ago at a cyclocross race. Then another race this Sunday was even worse. Could not maintain any effort at all.My HR was threshold for the full hour, but best I could do just felt like surviving rather than racing.

Key for me ( at 52) is recovery. Got to back off at least 1 week in 3 and no more than 2 hard days on the run. Its very easy to do too much and just constantly feel fatigued.

My HR was threshold for the full hour, but best I could do just felt like surviving rather than racing.

Well that certainly sounds like Cx racing to me.

Keen to get some advise here too ..

Did pretty bad 2 weeks ago at a cyclocross race. Then another race this Sunday was even worse. Could not maintain any effort at all.My HR was threshold for the full hour, but best I could do just felt like surviving rather than racing.

Welcome to ‘cross 😀

Those that know me will know I train on instinct, that said I do have a HRM that I use occasionally.
I have this silly old theory about some that train in zones and their HR’s. If I do train on the turbo with a HRM I never move my upper body, limbs or head. Just breath and push. But I can get my max right up by rocking all over the shop. Just think that some might be just blowing off energy and raising the HR by poor form?

Both wife and I are mid 40’s and ride every day, race xc and do ok. Main thing we’ve found getting older is that we need to eat better and sleep more… Also don’t crash as well !

I think the key to performing better is consistency and variety and not hammering yourself 5-7 days a week on the bike.
Rest and Sleep and hydration helps, protien maybe if you are also hitting the weights.
Remember that day that you dont want to ride because its raining, but you already had a few days off the bike, i think these are the days that set you back instead of being consistent. Dont be tempted to hit it hard 3 days in a row to claw back what you should have done, that will only burn you out.

Also just to bug rsvktm i only really cycle 1 day a week and still able to do a CX race (apart from the last one where i DNF lol) one before went ok though. Think i might get destroyed this week as done even less cycling.

Lack of sleep and hydration are my weak points.
Four hours a night is good going.
Hydration or lack of is my own fault, bought up on the idea of never drinking 60/70s. Even this Sunday my bottle wasn’t touched after a club 100km ride, add that to the race on the saturday I was pissing treacle.

oldgit that cant be healthy and you probably perform so much better hydrated.
i only wish i could function on 4hrs sleep

Funny thing is we don’t ride to train or race we ride because we want to.
Riding everyday has just developed over the years as we are lucky and can commute to work, both enjoy riding together but just as important enjoy riding solo as well. The vet classes are normally one of the most subscribed and competitive and the grand vets are not too shabby either. We also like to annoy the youngsters on strava, was Kom at Dalby for a while.
Agree re hydration, I never used to drink enough but it was normal day to day lack that was my issue, now that’s sorted I can cope with little water riding if needed.

Funny thing is we don’t ride to train or race

For me it’s the only reason I ride, or ride so much.

Did pretty bad 2 weeks ago at a cyclocross race. Then another race this Sunday was even worse. Could not maintain any effort at all.My HR was threshold for the full hour, but best I could do just felt like surviving rather than racing.

Well done. It’s always like that, and as they say, it never gets easier, just faster.

All my (mtb) short course races or road crits this year have ended up with me unable to talk, or get off the bike for five mins after the race. If I could I’d have been disappointed.

I used to have a hobby years ago that I enjoyed, became good at, trained hard, got sponsored. Became a job of work, didn’t enjoy, didn’t want to train, felt pressured to perform. Whilst I do ok racing bikes I am glad I can still enjoy it and whilst I am competitive I wouldn’t want that to take over. Back to the 40+ thing and harder to train I think it’s just harder to recover, I am probably as fast as I’ve ever been but wouldn’t fancy a multi stage race unless it was every other day !

Started road racing at 45. Took a season to get competitive in 4th cats, then raced Vets and really improved my racecraft. I’m now racing E123 and hoping for promotion to 2nd cat next season. Finished fifth in our club champs and 15th in the national circuit race for my age.

I commute daily and race twice every three weeks in the summer. And race in the winter. Training is club rides at moderate intensity, and races tend to be an hour + five laps, or 100km on the road.

I find recovery and sleep help most with trying to stay competitive. But racing frequently keeps the fitness level up more than anything else. This winter, however it is Trainer Road at least twice a week plus 150 miles of cycling.

A sedentary job probably helps my recovery too 😉

I eat almost anything but not huge amounts n have always been pretty slim and take iron supplements when I can remember and have a flu jab! Haven’t been ill much this year but had flu last year which knocked me back about three months!

Like you TiRed, see I don’t think that’s too much.
We have new members with coaches in our club that have seasons and don’t ride that much. Two I know are having an enforced rest from any cycling for a month on the advice of their coach, and all they’ve done is race a handful of 40 minute cat 4 crits.

I really think some people over analyse this racing malarky.

Cushy job you lucky git, I’ll be sweating within minutes of getting to work,

I’m much like TiRed.Only started proper racing (xc,crit,road) again at 40 (a couple of years ago) after a 20 year break.I’ve always been fit(ish) but in a middle of the pack kind of way.
Since January I’ve just been riding my bike(s) lots.I would’nt call it structured training and I don’t do intervals or anything specific.And I refuse to ride turbo/rollers. I just do 15-18 hours a week in the saddle be it commuting,mtb,dh,riding bmx tracks on the 4x or cx.That and cutting out all the crap I used to eat has brought me from 91kg to 80kg (at 6’2″).
Now I’m podiuming at Regional level mtb and cx and can hold my own with Cat2’s.I still enjoy riding because the racing just seems like a really good excuse to ride my bikes (and buy new ones) rather than the other way round.
I’m doing nationals next year and I suspect my fairly relaxed attitude to performance will come unstuck but I’m not running out to sign up a coach and buy a power meter any time soon!!

The fastest guy in my running club is 53 (I think), the 2nd and 3rd teams in last weeks British fell relay champs were both vet teams. If everything else is in place I think 45 is too early to be worrying about inevitable decline. Only you really know your own body though.

Edit: more helpfully, look at the other stuff like food, rest, drink, stress, sleep quality that might let you train harder. PS I’m neither fastest in my club nor 2nd/3rd team in the relays.

If everything else is in place I think 45 is too early to be worrying about inevitable decline.

Not so sure, I’m 44 and my recovery is definitely not what it used to be, can still work just as intensely, but it takes longer to recover, so have to train less often or less hard than I used to.

Aren’t there physiological changes that take place around your 40s? I think there’s quite a drop off in the production of HGH and that does impact recovery.

Though personally find that it’s external factors that are having the biggest impact to being able to get in quality racing later in life. E.g. more demanding job, family life and small kids. Tends to be sleep and recovery that gets squeezed.