Can't find much opinion on this Forum about these… anyone tried one? Anyone own one?

Am currently on a Turner 5 Spot and seeking a faster, lighter, zippier, more nimble bike. My conclusion is that with a 28lbs 5.5ins bike I'm dragging approx 3-4lbs of unnecessary chunk around and I'd prefer a bit less travel anyway.

I want fast acceleration, great climbing, excellent descending, sharp handling and a singletrack demon. Plus lots of fun. (I know, don't want much, do I?)

The only mag review I can find on the ST4 is Dirt, August 2008, which made the ST4 sound a bit aggro-oriented..

I think they have a demo one in Llandegla, Jim the partner has one and did the Trans Rockies on it. Seems to give it a high rating over a meta 4 he had before

Pretty poor spec compared to a lot of other brands. Have you checked bikeradar for reviews? Are you definitely after a 100mm travel full sus? There are a lot of good light 120-140mm travel bikes out there that would kick the ST4's ass (including the commencal meta 5 that the Orange ST4 is based on)

Turner Flux surely once a homer always a homer?

Just get a flux,great fast bike! 😀

Aren't they supposed to be the same weight as the 5?
If so, you'd need some top drawer kit to hit 24-25lbs.
I was looking at it too but it's just too heavy for a 4" bike.

There was a thread on here a while ago and from what I remember people were raving about them. They said they were masses of fun! I think all those guys are probably out riding today, so maybe ask again later and you'll get a more informative response. People really were raving a couple of months ago though…

Since when was the ST4 'based on' a 5 inch travel Meta 5? I think you mean the Meta 4.

Regarding weight, the frame is 1/2 a lb lighter than the Orange 5.

I'm seriously considering getting one too. It will be my first Full sus and sounds like it is aimed at exactly my sort of riding.

So that makes them ~6lbs2oz? around 5oz less than a 5spot.
Less than half a pound for 1 1/2" less travel.

they aren't a light bike – not supposed to be. the idea with the ST4 is to put trail geometry into a short travel platform, while still retaining a super plush action, which is achieved by a higher volume (i.e. longer eye to eye measurement) shock and the commencal-esque rocker linkage.

Everyone I know who's ridden one loves it, but its a trail bike, not a light weight XC marathon machine, and it's all the better for it.

as backhander says, you'd need some top drawer stuff on it to being it down to that weight (and putting super light wheels on it sort of negates the point of the bike)

I like it, but don't see the reason for its existance, I don't doubt that its mega fun. I'm happy to be guided on this, but why would you want a bike that rides similar to, weighs similar to and and looks similar to a 5" to 5 1/2" trail bike but with only 4"? for example, the alu SC LT2 is 1oz heavier and a far more capable bike IMHO. I think you're looking for an Intense spider2 or the new Knolly endorphin XC. Thes are not race/marathon bikes and are definately more trail orientated. I look forward to a lot more bikes like this coming out

ahem anthem x ahem

I'm happy to be guided on this, but why would you want a bike that rides similar to, weighs similar to and and looks similar to a 5" to 5 1/2" trail bike but with only 4"?

I don't doubt that its mega fun.

There you go, you've answered it for yourself. If you've never tried a short (less than 5 inches) travel full sus that isnt an XC race bike, then you should. There a right laugh for blasting about on, jumps, donwhills etc.

I had an old Specialized Supercross with 4.5inches of travel. It nearly weighed the same as my 7 inch travel Patriot, but it was far more fun to ride and quicker downhill too. Saying that, the geometry was good for dh.

Anthemx – pure lightweight trail aggression – I'd cut my arm off to have an Anthemx0, but then I wouldn't able to ride it

They're brill but chain suck is a concern and a ST4 pro is barely a 1lb lighter than your Turner… so unless you can afford an SE spec don't expect weight savings.

ST4 is nearly as well built as a Five, it's just about being lower and snappier.

http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/st4-or-five

http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/orange-st4-pics-and-view

As above, is a more involving, slightly faster uphill, slightly nippier, slightly lighter, slightly better at 90% of what I do, slightly more fun bike than a '5'. I like it

but chain suck is a concern

And is related to chainset & chain, not bike.

oh, and http://www.orangebikes.co.uk/reviews/pdf/ST4_Test_Singletrack_48.pdf

I demoed a brand new ST4 and suffered chainsuck on the first ride where the chain got so tangled I had to loosen off the front mech to sort it out. Also found the bottom bracket a bit low – ended up clouting the pedals on lots of logs and stumps that I normally ride over with no problem. That said I really loved the fast ride, the zip going up hills and the confidence inspiring handling. Ended up buying a 5 which is not much heavier in a light XC build.

And is related to chainset & chain, not bike.

…but there's somewhere for the chain to jam on an ST4 unlike on a Five.

I have an Ellsworth ISIS single pivot, 4 inch travel. Weighs around 6lbs with an ultra sturdy monocoque frame, nice angles that make it a right laugh on single track and, with a 120mm fork, all the travel I'll ever need.

I use it for single track, alpine riding, jumping, pretty much all sorts. It's 6/7 years old and in all that time I've never found anything else I'd have over it. I'm really hoping that the current move that a few manufacters are making to 4 inch travel bikes that are built to have a laugh on like the Orange and others continues. Maybe I'm old fashioned but for 90% of what I ride 4 inches is more than enough and I'd quite like new bike sometime if I could find one like mine.

Yes Matt, I'd have to agree with the others here. While it might be component related, I've seen it personally on two ST4s ('09 and a first ride, brand new 2010) and MBR had issues as well. I too had to help a friend remove his front mech trail side to untangle the mess.

Don't get me wrong, I'd have one in a heartbeat, but it would play on my mind.

Is there any hardware you can install to prevent the chain suck problem?

A 2+bash?

how would that stop chainsuck? Besides I couldn't be doing with no big ring.

I demoed a Five and an ST4 at Glentress last year, the ST4 was lower and felt a better singletrack / trail centre bike than the Five, but I did clip pedals with the ST4. The Five felt higher and more capable for peaks/lakes riding but made things too easy at GT. In the end I bought a Turner 5 spot which feels somewhere in between – it feels slightly lower than the Five and better in singletrack but with the 5.5 inch travel for natural riding. I've been looking around at 3-4" FS race bikes and for vfm Giants seem to be the way though I've not ridden one yet.

After a test ride on a st4 in the Lakes yesterday, I think its the kind of bike that suits a certain kind of trail.
It felt really out of its depth on the rocky decents in the Lakes,on the climbs and smoothish singletrack it really rode well.poor tyres handicaped the initial grip and ride but the balance of the bike was exellent and it really encouraged you to ride quickly everywhere,I did have a couple of chainsuck issues,not good on a brand new bike!and this seemed to eminate from the rear block rather than the front chainset,pushing the rear on turns made the back end feel a bit flexy but I did have a lot of sag and softish tyre pressures! maybe not the Intended optimum ride settings!

I have also tried the Giant Anthem x, although breifly, it works the rear shock in a much more efficient way,very much like the Commencal meta,this would be my choice as it feels bottomless in its stroke and with a well set up front fork, rides like a bigger travel bike. 😉

When you say out of it's depth, were you bottoming out the shocks? What sort of rocky descents?

I was riding it beyond its limits of design and travel,Maybe more set up time would have given me a plusher, and more planted feel at the bars but I just felt the bike was not good on rock steps, or steep technical decents,(tyres excluded) great everywhere else though.

I was getting full travel at the back, although the front forks could have been a little softer.
This is still a great bike though, and if I was doing lots of trail centres or fast peddaly singletrack it would be an exellent choice,Its just not quite the all-rounder I was hoping for. 😉

Cheers GaVgAs. I'm hoping that it's the bike for me.

Currently on a hardtail so it has to be an improvement over that even in those areas.

http://www.orangebikes.co.uk/dealers/demoday.php

No worries surf,I would advise test ride before putting down your hard earned wadge, the next demo day is at Whitwell (free) in November get it booked asap 😀

I'll have to try and throw my leg over one somehow but that demo day is 4 hours away 🙁

Yeah, but Llandegla is only 2 hours away and also the next YstwythMTB end-of-month ride :). See if you can get a demo……………..

Dave I'm at a stag do that weekend unless you fancy pushing it a week later to the 1st 🙁

Flux with 120mm forks on is a riot, poss not quite a s robust unless you get the DW version, but a great woods/singletrack bike, and the less gnarly trailcentre unless you whack a really big tyre on it!

GaVgAs: The ST4 responded very well to having a set of Nevegals on it. The Contis were seriously letting it down. I actually found it a more capable descender than a Meta 5.5 I rode around the same time. It was ultimately a bumpier ride but it seemed to track straighter and more accurately than the Meta.

Jon Woodhouse of this parish was giving the prototype 2010 ST4 (stiffer back end from what Jon was saying) some serious stick in Verbier when I was out a couple of weeks ago. It was pretty darn light and he was throwing it down some seriously techy trails.

Very nice looking bike and would be on my shortlist if I was in the market for something with a bit less travel than my Turner.

Cheers

Sanny

GaryLake – Anything progressing with your lastest project?

Foxy: I've got some time off in November, I'm doing my CTC Trail Leader award and then hopefully knuckling down to it in the week I have off afterwards.I'll keep you posted!

Sim reviewed the ST4 in the Singletrack magazine. I rode it briefly and really liked it. As folk say – light, low, snappy and the linkage seems to do it's magic to combine a feeling of plushness without wallow.

Orange have a demo bike and it's just been up at one of the Biketreks demo days. There are people on here who went.