Hi all,

It’s new bike time. I’m coming from a 2008 Orange Five S (minor changes e.g. Gravity Dropper, 2x) with a view to something a bit stiffer (bigger forks than than Recons + bolt through) and slacker for clattering around the Peak, going hike-a-bike in the Lakes and Scotland and the odd whizz around a trail centre. I tend to keep my wheels on the deck or not far off and I prefer fuss-free maintenance and minimal fettling. The Five’s been great in all these respects, I’ve ridden a 2011 and I was pretty much ready to pull the trigger on a new 2015 Mk2 Five S with a couple of upgrades (Reverb, Hope BB) when the Bird Aeris caught my eye. From my limited knowledge the geometry looks similar (effective top tube, wheelbase, BB height), the ‘.2’ build significantly better (Pikes over Revs, Reverb as standard, cost effective X1 option) and the price about £600 quid cheaper.

I’m not fussed about the German imports and not bothered about throwing any other bikes into the mix other than possibly the Nukeproof Mega TR, so it’s essentially Aeris.2 vs Five S. I’ll be demoing both in the next few days but has anyone else been through a similar process recently or think there’s any other factors or strong contenders. This will be my only bike bar the old Clockwork with the kiddy seat on the back.

P.S. I live in Yorkshire so this ought to be a shoe-in.

Go for the bird…..

Had a Five for a month or three.
Not ridden that much but suits me.
Can chuck it back in the shed after a muddy ride without worrying about umpteen bearings going rusty.
Did a day at Bike Park Wales on it, & its got way more ability than I have. 🙂

Don’t expect them to ride too similarly. The suspension setups are very different. I’m not going to bash single pivots as they’re clearly effective and popular but the fundamental differences in the way rear suspension designs work mean it’s unlikely a given person will like all approaches equally.

You’re unlikely to come away without a strong feeling either way.

The Nuke TR is more like the Bird but a little more mainstream. I have them on my fantasy shopping list (I don’t need a new FS bike this year…)

Enjoy!

Nuke tr here, it gives the feel of a much bigger bike than it’s actual 130mm travel. I’m just under 13 stone and still haven’t managed to really bottom it out on some pretty fast rocky stuff. Sizing is slightly small though.

? http://vitusbikes.com/products/escarpe-pro/ ?

moniex – Member

Go for the bird…..

This

Have you seen the Mk1 Five for sale at £1900?

http://www.bikescene.co.uk/Orange-Five-S-Mk1-9006-122-0.html

I’m very tempted …

I had a 26in Nukeproof Mega (the AM not the TR), recently ridden my mate’s 2012 ‘5 for a couple of trails and own a Bird Aeris. The Mega is/was a great bike but a bit too much for a trail bike (the TR 27.5 may be better) due to its heft. It was still fun hustling it about in the singletrack and was fab at BPW (although see below) and the Alps. Good bikes, very stout, seem to be excellent value.

The ‘5 isn’t for me. Because I’m not brave enough to make it come to life. I’ve ridden a few and they all seem to need you to be really pushing on to get the best out of them. I run out of bravery before this happens most of the time. The old ones were quite short and didn’t climb that well, the new ones are better but I still don’t think they climb as well as the Aeris (and maybe the NP). I can see why people love 5s and my mate absolutely hammers his, but it just felt a bit ‘needy’ for me, you had to be on it all the time to get the most out of it.

The Bird: http://pickled-hedgehog.com/?p=3418 I love. Just back from BPW yesterday and I much preferred it to the Mega. Not sure why, just feels better in the flowy sections and at least as good in the rocky/jumpy ones. It’s also fun at slower speeds as well in my experience. For the money, it’s a brilliant bike and when you call Bird up you speak to the people who designed it.

I rode a YT Capra the other day and felt the same about that as the 5. It’s kind of Suburu Impretza v very fast Jag. I guess what I’m saying is the answer to your question is about being honest about the riding that you do and what you want out of a bike. Three great bikes, all would do a job, but probably one would be better depending on what you want.

So which one is the Impreza Alex? Give me one of those over the Jag any day. 🙂

I had a 2006 Five, which is similar to your 2008 I think and now have a 2013 (26″) version. The newer one is indeed longer and slacker and personally I prefer it, although others may prefer the older model.

Funnily enough my view is the opposite of Alex as I think that one of the joys of the Five is that it is always fun, whether you push it or not (and I never get close to its limits). It’s not sophisticated, but it just feels alive and I’ve developed an irrational affection for mine. Maybe it’s because I spend too much time riding on my own in remote places, but it’s like a friend now. It groans and complains on the climbs, sings to me on faster sections and hoots and hollers on the rare occasions when I let it go on a descent. But I can do a few hours on totally tame forests roads and still come back with a smile on my face.

Having said all that, it doesn’t really make any sense. The Nukeproof is probably the sensible choice, the Bird is the fashionable one and there isn’t really any sensible reason to choose the Five. But we’re talking about riding round in circles to get muddy. Sensible doesn’t come into it 🙂

Gotta be honest, I think you’re nuts dismissing the Canyon Strive AL.
7.0 for £2799?

Yes please…..

Anyone ridden an Aeris and a Codeine?

Aeris AM is £2650, very good spec for the money!!!

@roverpig 🙂 all opinions are valid. It’s possibly a consequence of how much you’ve ridden a bike. Swapping from my Aeris which I’d ridden a lot and exclusively to the 5 at the top of a descent more than likely swayed my opinion. My 5 riding mate went very fast on the aeris straight away. It’s definitely rider influenced 🙂

In the latest STW (shameless plug), I wrote about the danger of using numbers/angles/measurements to decide which bike to buy. For me, it’s more about which one ‘feels’ right. My emerging view is that’s probably the one you ride the most.

Ah that was your article was it? I had a quick flick through the mag last night and marked that as one to sit down and have a proper read of later.

I’m sure you are right about it being “rider influenced” I’m somebody who really needs to ride a bike for a while to get comfortable, which makes test rides a waste of time really, but that’s another topic.

For the record I think the Bird looks fantastic and if I were buying a bike now I’d be giving it a seious look.

Five. Latest version is mint: geometry-wise it’s the perfect halfway house between an Alpine 160 and the old Five. In other words, the perfect all-rounder for northern UK, or fine in the Alps etc. Enduro riders are getting podiums on the latest Fives. Plus you already know how reliable and bombproof they are.

So after some deliberation and a test ride on a MkII and an Aeris I’ve settled on a new Five. The Five I demoed was ‘same but better’ as my 2008 Five in that the ride was involved but the bike filled me full of confidence. The Aeris on the other hand with its more cultured back end (and the fact that I was in Swinley and not Yorkshire) was just not as involved. Now it’s fair to say that that is the point with rear suspension at which point I can safely say that whilst the Five isn’t the sensible option its the one I’ll most enjoy. I’d certainly recommend anyone with £1500-2500 to drop on a trail bike to look at the Aeris. Great bike, great components and options, great people and great price – Unlike the Five I just wasn’t assured that it’d be the bike I’d want to rag around on and ‘neglect’ 😉 for the next five+ years. To requote roverpig “there isn’t really any sensible reason to choose the Five. But we’re talking about riding round in circles to get muddy. Sensible doesn’t come into it”. Hear hear!

And it’s an orange Orange.

Alex – Member
In the latest STW (shameless plug), I wrote about the danger of using numbers/angles/measurements to decide which bike to buy

Good article. Well done Alex.

Good lord, an stw bike thread where the op goes away, tries both bikes and makes a rational and honest decision.

There’s a first time for everything, eh?

lol chakaping

That’s a wonderfully rational explanation of an irrational decision. Well done that man 🙂

…isn’t the sensible option its the one I’ll most enjoy.

Spot on.

To requote roverpig again “there isn’t really any sensible reason to choose the Five. “
Why? not trolling just curious
Is it simply because there is better out there for the money? and that the design of the five is now considered to be “getting on a bit”

I currently have £1700 in the bank to spend and a shortlist of 2 bikes and one is a second hand Five, my heart is telling me in no uncertain terms to buy a Five, but my head is now starting to confuse the issue with YT’s, Canyon’s, Nukeproofs etc etc
The five was awesome (according to many reviews) 3 year ago, I am definitely no more awesome than I was 3 years ago so the heart might be winning, that is as long as I stay off this forum 🙂

But we’re talking about riding round in circles to get muddy. Sensible doesn’t come into it”. That sentence makes me smile every time I read it 🙂

Funnily enough my view is the opposite of Alex as I think that one of the joys of the Five is that it is always fun, whether you push it or not (and I never get close to its limits). It’s not sophisticated, but it just feels alive and I’ve developed an irrational affection for mine. Maybe it’s because I spend too much time riding on my own in remote places, but it’s like a friend now. It groans and complains on the climbs, sings to me on faster sections and hoots and hollers on the rare occasions when I let it go on a descent. But I can do a few hours on totally tame forests roads and still come back with a smile on my face.

Having said all that, it doesn’t really make any sense. The Nukeproof is probably the sensible choice, the Bird is the fashionable one and there isn’t really any sensible reason to choose the Five. But we’re talking about riding round in circles to get muddy. Sensible doesn’t come into it

You’ve just basically summed up my whole reason for riding a mountain bike, Ive had a couple of fives, messed around between the 16 and 17 inch frames, I now ride a 16 2014 Alpine (26er)which will hopefully do me well for a few more years, I don’t consider myself to be a good enough rider to understand/notice the differences/nuances between the various different rear suspension arrangements, I find the Alp can do all the five can and has given me the confidence to tackle the steeper more technical downhill stuff.

Is it simply because there is better out there for the money? and that the design of the five is now considered to be “getting on a bit”

There is better out there for the money in pure VFM stakes.

The simple design and the nice way they ride is part of the appeal to many owners.

I wouldn’t buy a three-year-old one for £1,700 myself. If I was in your position I’d get one of the discounted Vitus Escarpe or Sommet 2015 bikes from CRC…
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/vitus-bikes-sommet-vr-suspension-bike-2015/rp-prod120724?gs=1&gclid=CKHCi57GqsYCFfQatAodKu8IyA&gclsrc=aw.ds
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/vitus-bikes-escarpe-vrs-suspension-bike-2015/rp-prod120715

So after some deliberation and a test ride on a MkII and an Aeris I’ve settled on a new Five.

So, bird ISN’T the word? Ear-worm opportunity denied. 😀

To requote roverpig again “there isn’t really any sensible reason to choose the Five. “
Why? not trolling just curious
Is it simply because there is better out there for the money? and that the design of the five is now considered to be “getting on a bit”

It was just a throw-away line really, but I’ll have a go at justifying it.

The Five is a bit more expensive than other bikes that, on paper, look similar. You can come up with lots of arguments to justify that, but you just end up in a pointless debate about the value of things that you can’t really put a value on. My point was that you don’t need to get into those discussions. It’s not a rational decision, so there is no need to try and rationalize it.

To take a trivial example; in my opinion, any bike that is neon orange already has an advantage over any bike that isn’t. I’ve ridden my Five over bleak misty moors in the middle of winter and I love the way the colour pops out in those situations. It’s like having your own personal sunshine. Can I put a value on that? No, of course not, but why should I have to?

In simple VFM terms yes there is better out there now…and the companies you’ve already been told about like Nukeproof, Vitus, Canyon, YT etc all offer brand new bikes for that money with specs you wont find on a full price basic £2500 Five-S….i dont know what spec the second hand £1700 one you’re looking at has so maybe its an absolute steal?

The frame linkage/single pivot thing gets blown out of all proportion, i’ve owned single pivot and it felt great, not as ‘composed’ as other designs i’ve tried but certainly nothing that would hold me back either…the Orange/Dirt team are going great guns on theirs so far this year in both DH World Cups and the EWS, given that the riders arent exactly household names and the supposed limitations of the frame design then everybody and everything else out there must be pretty crap!…which we know isnt true obviously!….so actually despite the detractors they ride pretty well in trail, Enduro racing and more DH orientated stuff…which seems to be what people are buying them for.

The problems arise when somebody buys into the legend (and its not cheap)….pootles round their local trail centre, experiences pedal feedback/bob….feels brake jack for the first time in their life coming into corners….notices the weight….etc etc….and declares it rubbish compared to the Spesh Camber they sold to part fund the Five….in that situation i would agree but thats user error in buying the wrong bike not the fault of the Five being rubbish, its not an XC type racer so dont expect it to be.

Point it along the trail (preferably downhill), let off the brakes and hold on with a death grip…smile as the weight, the wheelbase, the single pivot etc all start to make sense.

I’d happily have one but having just built up a full-suss trail bike i cant be bothered starting again from frame only which is how i like to do things….Five frame, Fox-36s, yet to be released 1×11 XT drivetrain, Saint brakes, Renthal bars, CaneCreek DB-air…..Mmmm, oh where was i?!

Ear worm allowed

https://www.facebook.com/themudhugger/videos/528116343993545/ (no direct linky so manual clickage required)