I am a total non believer in mediums….

I'm writing this as my mate (and his brother ) never talks or even believes in such things has now freaked out due to an experience his brother had last week.

I'll try and keep it short… its a bit crap but you get the idea.

Brother and partner come home from holiday and are talking to the neighbors opposite.

while walking back their next door but one neighbor (old woman in her late 70's) starts chatting to them and invites them in for a cup of tea, (they have never really talked to her other than a 'hi' in the street)

anyway they sit down and while munching some hobnobs the woman says to my mates brother (MB)

"sorry i have to ask you, do you know a man called roger?"

MB says.

"yes, my father who died 5 years ago was called roger"

the woman they tells them roger is "IN THE ROOM with them" and that she is a medium and goes on to 'divulge' other tit bits…

(this part i am very cynical about as its always 'vague' and they never give 'specifics' do they)

Another name given was 'ROSE' MB's mother is called 'Rosemary' and he says 'thank you for the T, i cant get the full word, but it begins with 'T'' – MB says this is the 'trout' they had engraved on the headstone as roger was big into fishing.

Did you ever work down the docks with roger, i can see boats and crates – roger sadly died down the docks of a heart attack and MB did work with him on the odd occasion.

MB was asked has he ever had a injury to his face – which he replied yes broke his jaw playing rugby a year after roger died.

She then said i have the word 'Bell' or 'bells' in my head do you know anything that relates too? He didn't have a clue… but when i saw my mate he said last year when he went to his fathers grave 'roger' he tried to buy a bottle of his favorite whiskey but couldn't find it so bought a bottle of 'Bells'….

Here's the final gambit… the woman they said can you come back next week and bring a personal effect and it will help to make more contact, one item must be a wallet? Roger had a shotgun license and my mate wants going to bother to renew it as it costs £40 and cant afford it and doesn't want the guns. anyway he went to his mothers house and asked have you still got dads wallet, she said yes its in a bag that i haven't touched since he died. in the bag was his wallet… with wait for it.. £40 inside!! the license runs out next week.

my mate is now convinced that this woman is speaking the truth and along with his brother they are paying her another visit next week. I was was winding him up saying "when is she going to start charging" and he did get a bit arsey… I said its a load of b*llox but he is convinced as "how could she know such things" he said it is vague because there must be a type of filter from this world to the 'otherside'.. and it messes with the signals!

I guess i should respect my mates views andhis brother seeing as it is their father but they have just changed totally since this event..

Some suitable telly this evening –
http://www.channel4.com/programmes/derren-brown-investigates

I'll try and keep it short…

Well…..you gave it your best shot.

LOL

All mumbo jumbo.

They employ very clever guesswork and are quite skilled at reading people, thats it.

I've met people who do this kind of thing as magic. It is very effective, and surprisingly simple once you see what they're up to. A surprising number of people will not believe it is trickery, even when they are told that it is.

Basically, what you don't get in those reports from gullible people, is all the fishing questions where she didn't hit gold and switched questions.

As for working down the docks – Using my mind-reading skills, I bet the person lives in Cardiff or somewhere near it with a big port, where 90% of old people will have spent some time working the docks. Or maybe Liverpool or Hull.

Other things like injuries to the face, who hasn't? And even if you haven't had a facial injury, she can goal switch and tell you that the spirit is warning you to be careful.

Joe

Guesswork again. There's even a website that'll guess any item you're thinking of, given the opportunity to ask you 20 questions.

A person can see you face to face and has rather more processing power available than a computer.

To be honest, I class it with those people who have dogs that can do sums, which later turn out not to be able to do sums without the owner present. At worst they're total charlatans, at best they're terribly misguided.

my mate is now convinced that this woman is speaking the truth and along with his brother they are paying her another visit next week.

why ?

everyone concerned already knows that Roger is dead so there is no news, what she gonna tell you, that Roger happens to be wearing blue jeans today ? wow !

Kev

joemarshall +1

Hasn't this kind of stuff been pretty thoroughly demolished over and over?

She must be good – she saw him coming…

The thing is what does this woman get out of it, i mean she is bascially taking the p*ss basically out of two sane (they were before this event) people.

She must have bumped into other neighbours or met people that know the lads – he was totally freaked out by the cash in the wallet, i said its total coincidence, if it had been £30 you would have gone "my go i only need to find a tenner now" etc and yes the gun license is up soon but again 'just' coincidence.

I don't care what anyone says – Shirley Ghostman is the real deal

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQhzHf7ytEQ

The thing is what does this woman get out of it, i mean she is bascially taking the p*ss basically out of two sane (they were before this event) people.

A lot. Your charlatans are usually in it for the money, but for those who genuinely believe they're mediums, there are social rewards. As you said, your mate's brother had never bothered speaking to the old bat from up the road before, but now he thinks she's got magical powers and may well be popping in for the odd cup of tea in the future.

From the point of view of an old person who lives alone, a bit of social contact is worth a lot.

I have to say I've got the opposite view. I've had experience of going to mediums a couple of times, and am pretty convinced that death isn't the end of the journey.

MrsT

She must have bumped into other neighbours or met people that know the lads – he was totally freaked out by the cash in the wallet, i said its total coincidence, if it had been £30 you would have gone "my go i only need to find a tenner now" etc and yes the gun license is up soon but again 'just' coincidence.

If she is at all good at cold reading, then she wouldn't need to – there is nothing in what they report that she couldn't have guessed on the spot, even if she did it exactly as they suggest (more likely, with the names, she got them with some prompting from them, although they are such common names – she could have guessed they would know someone called Roger who was dead).

The 'has he ever had a injury to his face' question is the real giveaway though, it is one of those questions that to the person being tricked, seems very personal and to imply that the person knows an awful lot about them, but that actually 99% of people would answer yes to.

Quite a good description of cold reading here – http://www.wikihow.com/Cold-Read (there are tons of books about it – any magic shop will have one).

The thing is what does this woman get out of it, i mean she is bascially taking the p*ss basically out of two sane (they were before this event) people.

Some people are just good enough at this that they really believe that they have a magical gift of talking to the dead, and just enjoy the attention / feel they need to let people make use of their gift. Some people want to con people out of money, or are just weirdos. Some people are somewhere in between the two.

Joe

p.s. As well as betting that you live somewhere near Cardiff (and so does your mate?), did you have an accident as a child involving water?

I have to say I've got the opposite view. I've had experience of going to mediums a couple of times, and am pretty convinced that death isn't the end of the journey.

Okay, you might feel that, but can you name one thing that they did that couldn't be done by a fraudster doing cold reading?

I've had experience of going to mediums a couple of times, and am pretty convinced that death isn't the end of the journey.

I suggest you do a bit of TV viewing tonight then

IanMunro – Member
Some suitable telly this evening –
http://www.channel4.com/programmes/derren-brown-investigates

Talking to the dead is easy, it's getting them to talk back that's the hard bit!

It's all nonsense, cold reading, barnum statments, confimration bias etc. She lives in the same street, just how hard would it be to find out details of his parents lives?

Have a read of "Unsinkable Rubber Ducks" by Christopher Brookmyre. It's far from his best book but an entertaining read and it puts all this sort of stuff into perspective in a fiction setting so it's easier to get through

Ever had a facial injury of some kind?

The vast majority of them are cold reading (in my opinion of course), and as previously stated, are gaining either financially or socially from it. However, I have had personal experience of one supposed medium that left me unable to offer any kind of explanation – she gave names, dates, etc, was very specific, and even stated afterwards that she had been 'very surprised' by 'how clear' everything had been. I'm not going to go into great detail here, as I've been flamed once too often on STW, but the experience left me completely baffled. As an aside, my wife had a 'reading' from the same woman afterwards and thought she was appalingly bad. Oh, she didnt charge me either, just said 'I'm sure we'll meet again sometime'. Oh, and +1 for Shirley Ghostman!

p.s. As well as betting that you live somewhere near Cardiff (and so does your mate?), did you have an accident as a child involving water?

yer,
and fantasize about being an ageing woman while Ronald McDonald played with your droopy fun bags on a golfing green near Hartlepool?

See, we've all been there.

Barnsleymitch – she is clearly very good at what she does then. Ie, very good at making you believe she 'knows' when, in fact, she is just blowing smoke…

mastiles – As I said, she didnt charge me so I didnt feel skanked. I'd agreed to have a reading in order to 'prove my theory' that they're all con artists, and came away, as I said, completely baffled. I know how cold reading works, I know how we have a tendency to 'fill in the gaps' for people, and I know very well how many people want to believe that there is 'something more'. I'm not even sure what point I'm trying to make here, to be honest, because I still feel 'mediumship' is a dishonest, money making industry, yet here I am defending one of them. Go figure 😕

Don't get me wrong: I don't think they are all out there to rape your wallet – as has already been pointed out – but some of them are very good at convincing you they are genuine.

I, for one, hope there is not 'something more' – when I die the last thing I want is to be sat somewhere in a state where the only way I could speak to my loved ones was though some mad old bat in a darkened room. When I go, I want to be gone.

I'd agreed to have a reading in order to 'prove my theory' that they're all con artists, and came away, as I said, completely baffled.

Do you really think that your detective skills are such that you would be able to tell how they are doing it?

I'm also conviced that there is nothing in it but I also know that I lack the ability to detect all but the most basic of techniques, and even then I'm not convinced I'd be able to tell. Just because we can't prove it's a fraud, doesn't mean it's not.

utter nonsense. I could use science and logic to peruade those who believe but it is pointless and is wont affect your opinion. I suspect most people are genuine rather than out and out fraudsters but total nonesense. My mum used tot tak eme to these as a child as she attempted tp find her dead dad and the fun you can have with them by nodding at the wrong point and encouraging them to spout nonesense
Reminds me of the old joke about the clairvoyance session being cancelled due to unforseen circumstances.

Generally, yes, I'm fairly confident that I could pick up on cold reading, etc. If you are genuinely interested in this sort of stuff, Derren Brown's 'trick of the mind' explains how a lot of mediums operate, also 'six feet over' by Mary Roach is worth a read.

Reminds me of the old joke about the clairvoyance session being cancelled due to unforseen circumstances.

What does? The picture of those words posted above?

Keva – Member
my mate is now convinced that this woman is speaking the truth and along with his brother they are paying her another visit next week.

why ?

everyone concerned already knows that Roger is dead so there is no news, what she gonna tell you, that Roger happens to be wearing blue jeans today ? wow !

Its a bloody good point — even if there are ghosts and spirits, what has anyone, ever gained from "contacting" them? apart from their own satisfaction and comfort…

Any occult activity is very dangerous whether you believe or not. With Mediums – I think of them like lobster pots, inticing the person into something they will find very hard to get out of. Keep well away IMO.

what has anyone, ever gained from "contacting" them? apart from their own satisfaction and comfort…

Well, perhaps they couldn't find their keys?

monkey_boy's pal got £40…

no, i'm not convinced either.

i'm in the first flush of middle age, and i wake up feeling pretty tired sometimes. fast forward 40 years or so and the idea of actually being able to sleep forever becomes quite reassuring.

dezB didnt read the thread … Clearly 😳

Any occult activity is very dangerous whether you believe or not. With Mediums[b]religions[/b] – I think of them like lobster pots, inticing the person into something they will find very hard to get out of. Keep well away IMO.

Fixed it for you 😉 Same ball park surely? invisible unproven things talking to them and letting their presence be felt with no objective evidence to support them.

what has anyone, ever gained from "contacting" them? apart from their own satisfaction and comfort…

If someone grieving for a lost relation spends a tenner and gets a bit of "satisfaction and comfort" out of it, is that money misspent? Even if it is a load of crap? Obviously, if that tenner once turns into a tenner daily, that's different.

is that money misspent?

Yes, cos they've been duped!

On a number of occasions, I've been in a pub, and someone has told me that if I drink any more, I'll end up pissed…

I'VE ENDED UP PISSED EVERY SINGLE TIME!!!!! 😯

Scary, eh?

(Goes off to burn a cat)

mogrim – I've argued this point with the wife on several occasions. My concern is that when somebody is grieving, they'll seek comfort from wherever they can get it, and I despise the fact that there are cynical f***ers describing themselves as 'spiritual mediums' who are prepared to take advantage of such situations. Dont get me wrong, I believe that some of these people are genuinely convinced they have some kind of 'link' with the afterlife, and on at least one occasion have myself been more convinced than not that the person giving me a 'reading' was for want of a better word 'genuine', but on the whole, there are a lot of people making money from this 'business'. Talkemada, step away from the cat. How often have we discussed you and your obsession with matches? Say three hail Kylies now, there's a good chap.

An ex g/f was big into Spiritual Churches so sat through a few of them. The mediums are very good but even I could spot their fishing questions. "Any one know someone called <insert popular name life Alf> who died violently?" to an audience made up of pensioners who fought or were around in the Second World war. Surprise surprise someone did know someone called Alf or Alfie.

IMO these people were grieving for lost relatives and were looking for solice. What the mediums said was never malicious but usually along the lines of "he's happy where he is" or advice to how they could move on.

As for is there an after life? I've no evidence either way but am trying to enjoy this life on the basis that there isn't anything afterwards !!!!

(Goes off to burn a cat)

How do you make a cat bark?

Soak it in petrol, light it and listen to it go 'whoof'!

ex girlfriend was well into tarrot card readings…same old shite?