toying with getting a new 29er frame, something more modern, long, 100-120mm fork capabilities for general XC duties.

currently on an on-one, may keep that for other duties though. I’m 6’2 with short-ish legs for my height so have tried to find a decent standover bike with a long enough reach to fit. The on-one is a 21″, so a tiny bit on the large side in terms of standover, but length wise it’s good with my 100mm stem.

thinking of going all trendy, bit slacker (not too slack though), shorter stem, looong reach but trying to get decent standover and not having to slam my saddle all the way back on the rails.

My budget is around £350-400

current considerations are:

Orange Clockwork 100
Genesis Tarn
Genesis Longitude (now that it’s sus fork compatible)

anything else I should be considering?

Not sure about their more XC range but my Kona Honzo it one of the longest 29ers around

Looking for pretty much the same thing, same height as well, not quite found anything quite right, seeing if I can stretch to custom.
Suggestions would be:
Whyte 529/629 but only as full bikes.
Kona kahuna but again not sure if you can get a frame only.
Cotic Solaris poss too slack? not that xc, and depends if you like low bb’s or not (not low)
BTR chaser but mega bucks but awesome.

Clockwork is a good shout, I have one (older version) and apart from the head angle pretty good.

Finding it a frustrating search, hence custom idea, maybe being too fussy though, my main problem is I want long but not tall which seems hard to find in a frame only 29er xc.

I’ve just got a Surly Krampus. Not sure on actual geometry, but my large is half an inch longer than the Fortitude its replacing. ITs designed around a rigid fork with the same a2c as a 120mm travel fork.

http://surlybikes.com/bikes/krampus/geometry
hmm, ETT is still 20mm shorter than the Honzo though.

Haven’t built the 29+ wheels yet, but it certainly looks good with “normal” 29″ tyres.

Niner usually have quite long TTs.

Finding it a frustrating search, hence custom idea, maybe being too fussy though, my main problem is I want long but not tall which seems hard to find in a frame only 29er xc.

yep, that’s what I’m after. Solaris is a good one, but in ‘superbig’ is tall. Head angle is about as far slack as I’d like to go. something like a 69deg would be about right with a 60mm stem and 51mm offset forks.

tie that to a 73/74 deg seat angle, 20″ max seat tube length (or lots of standover) and a 660mm+ top tube and I’ll be happy.

here is my nukeproof scout 290, in XL

its quite long and slack. not that low although standover looks good even with a 20inch seattube. Not had a proper ride on it yet but doesn’t feel very slack. On paper its a 66 head angle with a 130 mm fork. Mine’s got a 140mm fork. it doesn’t feel raked out at all though. Frame is £350 on CRC. I’ve copied and pasted the geo table below:

KEY Small Medium Large Extra Large
ST – 381/15″ 432/17″ 508/20″
TTe – 608 629 651
HT – 100 105 110
Ha – 66 66 66
WB – 1152 1174 1197
CS – 440 440 440
STa – 73 73 73
BB – -65 -65 -65
Re – 415 435 455

Niner usually have quite long TTs.

they did, yes, but the reach is actually quite short by the others standards. Admittedly, not as compact as something like a cube, but not roomy.

The Nukeprood scout 290 kinda fits your needs but is longer travel & very slack, be interested to know if it was run with 120mm forks what the bB height would end up.. Doh bit slow..

Otherwise currently I watching for 2016 Whyte 29ers coming cheap (as above Whyte 529/629 only as full bike), 2015 & previous are no longer than anything else

ir_bandito – hmm, ETT is still 20mm shorter than the Honzo though

The Honzo is a beast in length and weight.

Someone mentioned on another thread that the Transition TransAM was long for its height, the XL is 19.5 inch seat tube with a 470 reach / 655 ett and 67.5 HA with 120 forks

I’m a bit over 6’4″ and have an xl transition smuggler, and an xl on one lurcher which I’ve just swapped for a l parkwood, both are a good fit though the parkwood is the shortest.

Transition have good long reach but the new nuke proofs are jumping on the bandwagon too

for comparison, I’d ride a XL genesis Tarn, with an ETT of 699mm and reach of 490mm. The new longitude in XL is a touch shorter with a 465mm reach.

The Tarn has the standover, but it’s weighty.

The clockwork is 461mm reach.

what’s with no seat tube water bottle bosses too….

The transition looks nice. over 6lb in weight though.

I would go to Curtis with my wish list, but unfortunately over £1k for a frame is way out of budget.

6lb isn’t that weighty for a frame of that calibre but I guess it depends on if you are on the race end of XC or the trail end of XC

Same problem here. Try a Salsa el mariachi in XL size. Good long top tube. You should pick up a mint used one for your budget. M

The Last fast forward is going to be a good reach too but again might not be xc enough for you

Not sure its available as frame only, but this sounds something like. It’s what ill be going for when it becomes available!

I have a Mk1 Solaris that I use for general trail duties. It has a very cheap build with heavy but weak wheels and it still comes in lighter than my all singing all dancing Carbon Stumpjumper (FS). I am only 6ft and have the large with a 40mm stem and it feels loads longer than any other bike I have ridden. I have really narrow Specialized Fast Track tyres on it at the moment but it is still plenty capable of riding FtD and the Monkey at Cannock. With wider grippier tyres and better wheels it will be even better.

OK, a couple of others thrown into the mix….

MkII Zealous.

Had a second look at the Trek framesets. I know, not exclusive enough for some, but the 21.5 (20.5) size x-caliber and superfly has is about the same geo as an orange clockwork. I like having two water bottle mounts too…

decisions….decisions..

That canyon look interesting, much better spec than the Whytes (yea it mail order vs well support small Uk company) though a big step up in TT sizes between L (normal short canyon) and XL (huge in comparision!) and the seatpost length is huge on the XL

Have a look at the Zealous Transition Frame, cannot tell you how good it is! Really short back end (Split seat tube to accommodate the rear wheel) and a long TT mean you can run a short stem without compromising the fit of the frame. Companies based in bristol if you fancy a look?

http://zealousbikeco.com/

the rear on that isn’t that short, the split tube is a gimmick or way to avoid the classic 29er bend

Same reach as the honzo, longer CS than the honzo and over half an inch longer in the seat tube than the honzo.

415mm isn’t short on a 29er now? Since when?!?! I built Shergie’s for him, and despite it being at least one size too big for me, I’ve never ridden a bike that manuals or wheelies so well short of an old Spesh P3 with 400mm stays!

The Honzo’s aren’t all that… Very heavy as we know, but they’re quite short and upright up front compared to a lot of more modern geometry bikes. The quoted Head angle of 68deg is on a 130mm fork fully extended! For reference, I’ve got a Whyte 629 now with a 120mm fork on it, and that’s a 67.2 deg HA static, the BB is still only 308mm tall, and although the chainstays are longer than ideal at 440mm, they don’t hinder the ride in any way. I still have a Taro frame, same Geo as the Honzo but 3lb lighter, it’s for sale if anyone’s interested. But the Whyte that has replaced it is quite a bit longer, quite a bit slacker, and very much more confidence inspiring to ride!

The new mk2 Zealous looks awesome, slightly slacker head angle, more clearance on the split seat tube for bigger tyres (it’s not a gimmick, it works!). The only downer is they’re quite chunky for an ally frame, but they’re a lot lighter than a Honzo still and more fun to ride.

415mm isn’t short on a 29er now? Since when?!?!

I dont think being the longest of the three justifies it being classed as “Really short”

Division 2 CS – 419
Honzo CS – 414
TransAM CS – 418

The Honzo’s aren’t all that… they’re quite short

Longest of the three

Division 2 Large Reach – 431
Honzo Large Reach – 452
TransAM Large Reach – 443

The quoted Head angle of 68deg is on a 130mm fork fully extended!

Presuming they are all measured at static as I cant find anything saying sagged & taking into account the fork length 0.5 deg per 10mm rule, the Division is the steepest of the three.

Division 2 HA – 67.6 (130mm)
Honzo HA – 68 (120mm)
TransAM HA – 67.5 (120mm)

So other than the facts prove you wrong, yeah… you’re right

and yes they are weighty but so am I

6,2 with a 32″ inside leg here so I struggle with getting long and low frames. Kinesis FF29 was where I ended up, nothing else really was available frame only that fit well and didn’t cost the earth. Most frame only are too boxy for some reason, on one cotic etc all seem to do a l which is OK stand over but too short or an xl which is ok reach but too tall in the seat post. There’s a bit more choice now but mainly on built bikes.

Look at the trek superfly or whyte HT the numbers are good but not available frame only, but if you can pick up last years and flog the bits you should do all right. FF29 no longer in production but has a nice replacement and you can still find stock.

Geo you describe = Trek Superfly. 69ish ha, looong ett (24.4″ on my 18.5″ frame).

I bought the alu ss frameset from Swinnertons and pretty sure they have the geared frame available. Nice and light and rides well for alu.

Here you go

http://www.swinnertoncycles.co.uk/components-c169/frames-c223/mtb-c225/superfly-al-frameset-p53377

My frame didn’t show as stock but they sourced from Trek USA.

Geo bottom of page here:

http://www.trekbikes.com/gb/en_GB/bikes/mountain/cross-country/superfly/superfly-8/p/2074600-2016

I’ve got an XL Yeti SB4.5 for sale on PinkBike.
Is an absolute ripper and only had a few days use: http://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/1911655/

Might be a bit above your price range though 😉

I had a Honzo, and now have a MkII Zealous. Regardless of what the geo charts say, the Zealous is slacker with the same fork.

Re the split seat tube being a gimmick – it means that regardless of saddle height, the seat tube angle is constant, rather than being steeper for shorter riders and slacker for taller riders.
It also allows mud to fall through the uprights, and off the downtube. It’s way better in mud and snow than the Honzo as a result – it hasn’t clogged yet. Honzo did.

The MkII also has way more tyre clearance than the Honzo – more tyre choices are opened up, and more rim widths possible. Takes 650+ too if that’s a concern.

It also weight around 2lbs less. That means a lot to a scrawny bugger like me.

I’m not saying the Honzo is perfect but it was leading the charge years back and is still ahead of quite a few of the new lot boasting long low slack… I agree tyre clearance could be better but as for the seat being the same angle for different height riders, I’m only one height so it’s no biggie

Superfly frame here in my size 🙂

though I’ll probably end up getting one from Alpine bikes as I have a Tiso card..;-)

maybe, if that’s what I decide.

I have a Dartmoor Primal 29, its long with a 68 degree head angle.
Its quite a chunky aluminium frame at almost 5lbs, but they are well made with good paint, and the best thing is they are only £200.

The Primal 29 is £165 if you look around but a 140 fork which I think is longer than the OP might want.

For my preferred reach / ett I’d need a large but the seat tube would be too long with my Reverb so I’d have to get a medium which would then be far too short and the rear axle would put me off… However the Primal 275+ Which may or may not take 29er wheels looks much more promising being that the medium 275+ is longer than the large 29.

http://www.last-bikes.com/products/frames/fastforward.html looks quite long, quite slack too