I'm finding that my legs build up lactic acid quickly when climbing but recover very quickly as soon as I stop and I can then continue as before. Riding faster or slower up the hill doesn't seem to make much difference to this…

I can make reasonable progress but in short bursts.

What's the most effective way to improve the stamina in my legs?

Should I just ride more climbs and it will come on its own?

Do you get out of breath quickly as well? Do you ride with others so that you can measure your performance against theirs as you may be expecting too much of yourself? I don't know your age or fitness level but it might be worth getting the once over from your GP just to make sure there is no underlying health problem causing the lactic acid build up.

What helped me most to improve on hills (when I used to be moderately fit), was to do intervals on a small circuit eg. find a small loop with a moderate to steep uphill section which takes around 30 seconds to climb, go at it as fast as you can and rest on the way back round – then go hard at it again, repeating 5 or 6 times.The 'loop' should be big enough so that you have almost fully recovered from the previous uphill sprint but not quite and you should be absolutely knackered after the last attempt. HTH

just ride more buddy.

Thanks Guys,

I think it's a case of general fitness, I'll look for a suitable loop for some intervals.

I had a session on a treadmill linked up to an ECG and a thing to check my o2 sats as part of a checkup about 18 months ago and was told everything was fine so I guess I need to ride more… no hardship there then 🙂

Base training. Do long slow rides rather than hard work intervals. It trains your body's fat burning metabolism which doesn't produce lactic acid, and means you can work harder without producing any.

i get the same feeling in my legs but as woody asked i get out of breath quickly too why did you ask that? i try to ride at least twice a week and am a lot fitter than this time last year, but still struggle, some days more than others though.

Everyone hurts, just some move faster than others 😀

Is it still 1929? It's got piss all to do with lactic acid.

http://www.brianmac.co.uk/lactic.htm

brakeswithface – Member
Is it still 1929? It's got piss all to do with lactic acid.

http://www.brianmac.co.uk/lactic.htm

Ok, substitute the words "lactic acid" with the word tiredness…. the effect is the same… lol 🙂

I also have this problem, dont really get out of breath but my legs always feel ****.

Base training. Do long slow rides rather than hard work intervals. It trains your body's fat burning metabolism which doesn't produce lactic acid, and means you can work harder without producing any.

Could that be the answer? I rarely do long rides, usually just 1 and a half hours of going as fast/hard as i can

Brakeswithface – as you are obviously much more up to date than the rest of us, would you like to offer the OP some advice instead of being a smartarse?

woody asked i get out of breath quickly too why did you ask that?

Just a general question as it could indicate respiratory/cardiovascular problems. Not too likely in relatively young fit people but if it is bad or much worse than your riding buddies of similar fitness then it would be worth having a check-up.

I hate to agree with molgrips, but he speaketh the truth.

Brakeswithface I followed your link and found out what I already new about lactic

Why isn't it lactate in this case? Isn't he just climbing outside his aerobic capacity and therefore building up lactate?

Is it still 1929? It's got piss all to do with lactic acid.

Did you read or understand the link you posted? Lactic acid is produced, which ends up as lactate and H ions, and the H ions cause pain. So pain is directly proportional to blood lactate therefore and is caused by lactic acid production.. that's how I read it and that's what every coach I've talked to has said.

What I said still stands. And let me tell you from having blood lactate tests that blood lactate levels are proportional to leg burn.

I rarely do long rides, usually just 1 and a half hours of going as fast/hard as i can

I used to do that, albeit for longer than 90 mins, and base training utterly transformed my riding. My first blood lactate test showed that my fat burning pathways were barely active at all, lactate was acumulating slowly at all power levels. I simply could not ride up any kind of incline at a low heart rate, which meant I could only ride for abotu as long as my normal rides then I'd completely die in agony. Which is what happened when I tried to do a 24 hour pairs race.

You also need to learn old cyclists mantra; ride over hills, not up them.

If you are blasting up knowing that you will stop and rest in a minute, you're not doing it right; aim to ride up hills and do the last quarter quickest, then carry on over the top and straight into the next downhill or flat section.

Stopping and resting is cheating…

I used to do that, albeit for longer than 90 mins, and base training utterly transformed my riding. My first blood lactate test showed that my fat burning pathways were barely active at all, lactate was acumulating slowly at all power levels. I simply could not ride up any kind of incline at a low heart rate, which meant I could only ride for abotu as long as my normal rides then I'd completely die in agony. Which is what happened when I tried to do a 24 hour pairs race.

That sounds about right i think. Usually in the last half of my rides I can power up hills easily, maybe cos my heart rate is high?

At the first of of my bike rides I struggle up hills cos my heart rate is low?

Umm, your heart rate is proportional to the amount of CO2 that needs removing from your muscles. It'll only take 5-20 seconds to change. It will however take you 10-15 minutes to warm up.. which sounds like what you are experiencing.

Still – every cyclist (concerned about performance) needs base training. It's very important even if you are only doing 90 minute races, but obviously more so if you are dong 6 hour ones. Usually it's done over the winter, because it lasts longer than speed fitness and hence does not need to be done during the race season so much.

http://www.cycling-inform.com/articles/4/2/Cycling-Base-Training-tips—How-to-Reach-Your-Full-Capability-as-a-Cyclist/Page2.html

wombat – are you grinding powering up hills or sitting and spinning?

I tend to sit and spin if it's a long hill…

At the first of of my bike rides I struggle up hills cos my heart rate is low?

Your heart is a muscle and needs to be warmed up just like all the others.

As I get old(er) I find that the first 20 minutes is really hard and sometimes feel like turning back. If you look at any competitive cyclist you'll see them on rollers or warming up for 20-30 minutes prior to a race for that very reason.

As I get old(er) I find that the first 20 minutes is really hard and sometimes feel like turning back
+1 i thought it was just me that felt like this lol

Your heart is a muscle and needs to be warmed up just like all the others

if it isn't already warm you are dead mate 🙂

I had similar issues, see this thread http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/how-long-can-you-pedal-standing-up

I could cycle for ever sitting down but my leg strength was pathetic and my thighs burned after a very short time standing up, previously I had never stood up much and always sat and spun my way up hills. Since that thread about a month ago I have made an effort to pedal standing up as much as possible when i come to a hill on my commute. The difference in the space of a month has been amazing, my legs are far stronger and it actually makes a difference when your sitting and spinning too, your able to spin faster rather than winch your way up.

Sometimes over training is an issue. If you are riding regularly for an hour and a half blast you will tire and feel exactly as you describe.

For slightly older chaps this is really significant (in my case anyway). You need to make sure you put in enough timee to recover between rides if you hope to get faster, especially hard rides. It is incredibly easy to overtrain.

squats, they always wored for my missus, I'm quicker than her so so long as that remains the case Im happy!

Overtraining? I disagree.
It's actually very hard work to overtrain, and crops up as an excuse far too often. It's easy to be tired, its easy to be fatigued, but overtraining is overused as a phrase.

crikey, how do you get tired or fatigued then?

You get tired by riding your bike for a long time, you get fatigued in the same way.

You get tired/fatigued by working all day, all week, whatever.

You don't get 'over-trained' by doing that; you don't get overtrained by working weeks on building sites, you get tired.

Overtraining is a completely different thing, and is over-used as a phrase when people really mean 'i'm a bit knackered'.

I work weeks, even months of nights, that leaves me tired/fatigued, but I'm not 'over-trained' at work, I'm just fecked…

Overtraining is a physical, behavioral and emotional condition that occurs when the volume and intensity of an individual's exercise exceeds their recovery capacity.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overtraining

Overtraining is a physical, behavioral and emotional condition that occurs when the volume and intensity of an individual's exercise exceeds their recovery capacity

😆 sounds like a description of being tired and fatigued to me.

I may be knackered immediately after a long ride but probably fine the next day. If I'm pushing hard on my commute every day I start to feel more tired and fatigued by the end of the week, legs feel a bit dead, etc. If thats not being tired and fatigued and caused by over training then I don't know what is.

There's a huge difference between being tired and being overtrained; overtraining is hard to achieve, being tired is easy.

We are quibbling over terms, but 'over-training' is used by weekend warriors when they mean tired…

The link you quoted describes over-training as being unable to recover quickly enough and subsequenetly that having an effect on performance, hence feeling tired and fatigued 🙄

wiki thinks they are pretty much the same 🙂

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatigue_(medical)

Physical fatigue is the inability to continue functioning at the level of one's normal abilities.[1][2][3] It is ubiquitous in everyday life, but usually becomes particularly noticeable during heavy exercise.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overtraining

Overtraining is a physical, behavioral and emotional condition that occurs when the volume and intensity of an individual's exercise exceeds their recovery capacity. They cease making progress, and can even begin to lose strength and fitness. Overtraining is a common problem in weight training, but it can also be experienced by runners and other athletes.

Ok, have it your way…

Ok, I will… because i'm right 😉

Gosh that was all a bit serious.

Is it still 1929? It's got piss all to do with lactic acid.

It doesn't matter what year it is Lactic is waste product produced that causes aches and cramps, just like it says in that article you linked.

As for training, for me it's a case of getting out more and using a gear higher than I want to get up the hill, once I had a good base then I'd pick and choose a gear to suit. Worked for me but may not work for you.